The post-Sam Ash era

[b1j]

Alamo Music’s front man with some thoughts about the Sam Ash closure’s possible impact on guitar and gear sales.


https://youtu.be/wmVwlc4C0aI?si=R9Jb0MUbsTnyjoDQ

Mom and pop store opens in your town with great guitars and great service.

GC thunders in down the street with a lot more stuff, degraded customer experience, huge economies of scale, and … big rent.

GC eventually snuffs out all but the very best small shops.

Internet selling slashes corporate cost structure for GC; ironically, hundreds of national physical stores become expensive sitting ducks that still pay rent and salaries.

Good guitars and gear are more readily available online. In-store experience largely disappoints buyers.

Large-chain physical stores throw in the towel, first in highest-rent cities, and soon after, everywhere. (Replace GC with Sam Ash here.)

Who’s left?

[abn556]

For me it shops like Fullers. Shops that have a big inventory of nice guitars where I can go play them all before I buy. I prefer to deal with this kind of shop now. If Wildwood was open, I would consider flying up to Denver to buy something. Same with Music Villa.

Sweetwater’s customer service called to check on a bulk string order a few weeks ago and asked what kind of guitars I had bought lately and where. When they asked if I would consider using them for guitars, I asked them how do you replace the ability I have at Fullers to pick the best J-45 or D-41 out of a group of them? Their answer was to offer free shipping if I wanted to send one back. That’s kinda not the point I was making…..

[sinistral]

Small, independent bookstores were among the first to succumb to this phenomenon. First Borders and Barnes & Noble, then Amazon. Anyone remember You’ve Got Mail? That movie came out in 1998.

The interesting thing about guitar stores is that local stores have fared better than bookstores, largely because there is more value in trying guitars in person than buying books in person.

When one considers what Sam Ash was at its peak on 48th Street (along with Manny’s which Sam Ash took over), it has really been a slow decline over 20+ years. But it was so sudden right at the end.

As with Chris McKee, I wish the best to the Ash family and the employees and hope that they are able to move on from this sad event.

[Bowie]

If no one was shopping there and they had to close down, I don't really see it having a big impact. What business they did do will shift to other stores, be they brick and mortar or online.

I think brick and mortar stores are important as many people thinking of learning an instrument will want to put their hands on one first. But, if the public is comfortable buying cloths online without knowing exactly how they will fit, I guess they'll buy a guitar too, if they really want one.

[koine2002]

The locally owned stores here do good business. The nearest GC (75 minute drive) is always near empty when I visit.

That said, when someone is buying an entry level guitar to learn, unless they have someone present who know better, they likely won’t have any idea for what they should look, feel, and hear. Thus, that really where online sales have a good place.

However, for a step up or a “forever” guitar, that’s where putting hands on different models as well as specific guitars within that model is important. That’s where local stores can shine.

Another factor is that companies like Taylor, Martin, and Yamaha are selling directly to the public, now. In fact, when I get my dream Taylor, I’ll be driving up to the factory showroom in El Cajon on one of my in-law visit trips to buy it there. I was there last November, and anything they had in the showroom could be bought.

Unfortunately, our local music shop in town ONLY has entry level stuff stocked of all instruments. I only by strings and such from them. I drive about 30-40 minutes to a family owned store whose stock make GC look small (Hugo Helmer), when I want to consider a guitar.

[catndahats]

These times they are a changing....

One thing the new retail/online experience cannot replace is the fellowship and friendships that are built over time in a brick and mortar store.

Coming from an independent retail family, I saw this coming and left the business long ago. I still prefer most shopping in person. I have built friendships with workers and look forward to spending my dollars in those shops---in person where you are met with a smile and someone that knows your name.

I've never been in a Sam Ash, even though there is/was one approximately an hour away. Often when the visionary leader passes, shortly so does the business. Competing with an online competitor is difficult at best...the cost of maintaining retail space, keeping experienced employees, and drawing customers in when they can get the same product in their pajamas from home often at a lower price requires creativity and passion.

I salute our smattering of shops that still offer a brick and mortar experience.

[LAPlayer]

I’m confused. The title is about the “post Sam Ash era” but the entire OP is just knocking GC with no mention of Sam Ash. I find very little similarity between the two companies.

[6L6]

For mom and pop stores to be successful it sure helps to be situated in an affluent area.

Gryphon in Palo Alto, CA has just that situation being located in the heart of Silicon Valley. Add to that their staff is top notch, the store is wonderful, and you can play anything in the store. Their repair staff is without equal IMO.

All of the staff is very knowledgeable about the instruments they sell and store owner Richard Johnston has written books on Martin guitars with Dick Boak. All of the workers are excellent players as well.

No instruments make it to the sales floor without new strings and a perfect setup by the staff. Buy a guitar at Gryphon and you KNOW it has no issues.

That said, don't look for a big discount at Gryphon. This kind of service doesn't come free. But to those of us who live here, it's worth their price to buy from them. And, of course, they stand 100% behind any instrument they sell.

[GoPappy]

Originally Posted by abn556

For me it shops like Fullers. Shops that have a big inventory of nice guitars where I can go play them all before I buy. I prefer to deal with this kind of shop now. If Wildwood was open, I would consider flying up to Denver to buy something. Same with Music Villa.

Sweetwater’s customer service called to check on a bulk string order a few weeks ago and asked what kind of guitars I had bought lately and where. When they asked if I would consider using them for guitars, I asked them how do you replace the ability I have at Fullers to pick the best J-45 or D-41 out of a group of them? Their answer was to offer free shipping if I wanted to send one back. That’s kinda not the point I was making…..

+1 to this post. I've got a very well-equipped local shop that offers of large selection of new and used acoustics and electrics. I can go in and play them and see how they feel and sound with no risk of getting a mail-order dud that I have to send back. I've bought at least 6 guitars there in the last 3 or 4 years.

I've gone there several times with the intent of buying a particular guitar I've seen online, only to be sorely disappointed with the feel and/or sound of the guitar once I got my hands on it. Conversely, I've bought a couple of guitars there that I would have NEVER ordered online, but I happened to play them in the store and was pleasantly surprised by how good they played and sounded.

[GoPappy]

Originally Posted by 6L6

. . .

That said, don't look for a big discount at Gryphon. This kind of service doesn't come free. But to those of us who live here, it's worth their price to buy from them. And, of course, they stand 100% behind any instrument they sell.

That's the thing. For a guitar you're going to own and play for the next 5, 10 or 20 years, or perhaps the rest of your life, what difference does an extra $200, $300 or even $500 really make if it's the right guitar for you? I will compromise in other areas of my life if I need to in order to afford the right guitar.

[TBman]

Hopefully Guitar Center isn't going anywhere, but I have my doubts sometimes. I think the last guitar I bought in a store (from GC) was a J-45 that was purchased in 2016.

Recently I was in the GC near me and saw the Cordoba Stage. I played one a while and went back a week or so later to play it again. They didn't have the Traditional Stage so I bought one online from Sweetwater as I have a good buying history with them and I have confidence in them. I have read too many horror stories about buying from GC online (damaged guitars, not as advertised, etc).

Locking up the "good" guitars, which is what I would buy if I was shopping for one, has really stopped my buying guitars from GC. I don't want to have to ask a salesman every 5 minutes to get me that one or this one many times over the course of an hour or so while I make a purchase decision. Plus if I decide not to purchase that day I would feel as though I put the salesman to work for nothing.

I used to enjoy spending time at the Sam Ash near me. It was a comfortable store to shop in. They had tons of sheet music and unlocked guitars.

[brad4d8]

Originally Posted by sinistral

Small, independent bookstores were among the first to succumb to this phenomenon. First Borders and Barnes & Noble, then Amazon....

Interestingly, around here, there have been a number of indie bookstores that have opened in the last few years and seem to be surviving.
Brad

[tommieboy]

I am glad I grew up in an era of mom-and-pop music shops, bookstores, cigarette vending machines, beer vending machines, etc. The younger generations don't miss what they never had. It's more about smartphones and social media now.

Tommy

[Moldstar]

Originally Posted by LAPlayer

I’m confused. The title is about the “post Sam Ash era” but the entire OP is just knocking GC with no mention of Sam Ash. I find very little similarity between the two companies.

right, very, very different companies. GC is doing great btw, despite Phillip McNight's constant lies and obsession with hating them. They have been making record profits the past 4 years. I don't really like GC all that much, but I hate it when people lie to make a point. I don't see GC moving in Sam Ash's footsteps. They are making way too much money. They may close low performing stores, or stores where there is duplication in the market, but I don't see them failing or closing stores because they have to, any time soon.

[cip]

It's a myth that small store offer better customer service. I've had bad customer service from Music Villa in Bozeman.