Jordan Spieth - Signature Significance

Rondoraymundo · #1 06-22-2015, 06:04 AM

There is a concept I am borrowing here from the baseball guru Bill James: signature significance. Defined it means the smallest data point that one could use to predict future success or failure. James first used this term in his 1985 Baseball Abstract when discussing the 1984 season. You may recall that in 1984 the Detroit Tigers won the world serious, crushing the San Diego Padres 4 games to 1. James pointed out that the signature of Detroit greatness that year could be found in the way they started the season with a record of 35-5. Yeah, that's right, they lost 5 games in their first 40. That's signature significance.

That brings me to Jordan Spieth. There are five other golfers who have won both the Masters and the US Open in the same year: Craig Wood, Ben Hogan, Arnold Palmer, Jack Nicklaus, and Tiger Woods. With the exception of Wood, that list IS the list of the greatest golfers of the last 80 years. (Bobby Jones started the Masters after his peak playing days or he surely would be on the list too.)

That's rarified air to be in that list. It's also signature significance. We will be hearing a lot more of Spieth in the future. He is now generation's greatest golfer...even more so than Rory. Unless some unforseen tragedy strikes him, the 2015 US Open will not be Jordan's last major.

rmyAddison · #2 06-22-2015, 06:33 AM

DJ kind of choked but that takes nothing away from the greatness of the win.

What's cool to me is a bit of a connection, vicarious to be sure. My next door neighbor's kids went to school with Jordan, and a doctor friend of mine kids have played many rounds with him when they were younger and he's been over their home many times.

I belonged to the same Country Club (Brookhaven) so I may have seen him when the locals high schools played there or he was playing rounds with friends, some of those kids sure could blast tee shots when they were on the adjacent course.

I don't know him at all but it's kind of cool that I have friends and neighbors who do and have stories about when he was younger. And I agree, Justin and Rory may become the Nicklaus/Palmer, Woods/Mickelson of this generation........

Earwitness · #3 06-22-2015, 07:34 AM

He sure didn't get to be the newcomer/underdog for very long. Six months ago, no one outside golf regulars (and our local UT fans) probably knew who he was. (He did come 2nd at the Masters last year....) Anyway, after the Masters win this year and the other wins, he had to play the role of odds-on favorite wire-to-wire, and all these competitors, who have 10x experience to him, were the underdog chasers. He seems very natural in that role, though.

The signature significance for me was that I didn't think Spieth even played all that well Saturday and Sunday, yet he won. Usually, the winner of a major is a star or superstar who is just fabulously hot in that particular week. Also, with Tiger and Rory, when they came on so young, it was marked by these amazing athletic shots that no one else could make (out of trees, or whatever) (also the type of shots only young people can usually make). Spieth, though, was basically just playing solid par golf on a very difficult course, rolling in a putt once in a while, and voila--he's the champ.

My point is that it is an eminently repeatable formula.

That said, Rory McIlroy and Dustin Johnson are both tremendous golfers, still capable of winning anything.

aknow · #4 06-22-2015, 11:49 AM

Shocking Ending to a pathetic tournament which I totally enjoyed. The greens on some of the holes were like putting in my backyard, not a compliment.
Way to back into a major.
The USGA needs a dose of reality. Greg Norman should have yanked the official from the USGA by the necktie and pulled.
Good commentary by Greg Norman, and Brad Faxon. The other commentator needs to stick to baseball.

Earwitness · #5 06-22-2015, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aknow

Shocking Ending to a pathetic tournament which I totally enjoyed.

pretty funny!

Same here--I complained and complained, and watched and watched.

rbock · #6 06-22-2015, 01:14 PM

I had a pretty good idea after watching Tiger and Ricky crash and burn on the first day, seeing the conditions on the course, and watching the trains roll by a sand wedge distance from the playing area, this was going to be a classic example of "last man standing." So it went. And the thick black smoke from what appeared to be a nearby factory fire wafting over the course on the final nine was a fitting image for the entire tournament.

6L6 · #7 06-22-2015, 01:53 PM

As usual, I watched every minute of coverage and enjoyed it immensely.

From where I sat, Luis Oosthuizen was clearly the best in the tournament. If he could have shot even 2 over par in the first round, he would have won the tournament by 4 strokes. The 29 he shot on the back nine yesterday was incredible! I think he got caught up in the bad aura of playing with Fowler (81) and Woods (80) that first round when he shot 77.

Regardless, Jordan Spieth knows how to WIN. He's certainly not the most gifted swinger of a golf club on Tour, but he certainly knows how to WIN.

If you look at the prodigies who win the National Junior Championship (Jordan won it twice), it's a very good indicator of what's to come. No doubt Rory and Jordan will be the leaders of their generation and it will be fun to watch.

Tiger? It was a good run, but he's done winning Majors as is Phil IMHO.

D. Shelton · #8 06-22-2015, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aknow

Shocking Ending to a pathetic tournament which I totally enjoyed. The greens on some of the holes were like putting in my backyard, not a compliment.
Way to back into a major.
The USGA needs a dose of reality. Greg Norman should have yanked the official from the USGA by the necktie and pulled.
Good commentary by Greg Norman, and Brad Faxon. The other commentator needs to stick to baseball.

Yes, send Joe buck (and Troy Aikman with him) to Baseball !!!

Those greens were unforgiving , and a bit unpredictable. Speith is one cool
customer. He really held together , and kept focused enough to drain a critical one when he needed it, after many close misses .

aknow · #9 06-22-2015, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbock

I had a pretty good idea after watching Tiger and Ricky crash and burn on the first day, seeing the conditions on the course, and watching the trains roll by a sand wedge distance from the playing area, this was going to be a classic example of "last man standing." So it went. And the thick black smoke from what appeared to be a nearby factory fire wafting over the course on the final nine was a fitting image for the entire tournament.

Good call!! It really did go down in smoke.

aknow · #10 06-22-2015, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6L6

As usual, I watched every minute of coverage and enjoyed it immensely.

From where I sat, Luis Oosthuizen was clearly the best in the tournament. If he could have shot even 2 over par in the first round, he would have won the tournament by 4 strokes. The 29 he shot on the back nine yesterday was incredible! I think he got caught up in the bad aura of playing with Fowler (81) and Woods (80) that first round when he shot 77.

Regardless, Jordan Spieth knows how to WIN. He's certainly not the most gifted swinger of a golf club on Tour, but he certainly knows how to WIN.

If you look at the prodigies who win the National Junior Championship (Jordan won it twice), it's a very good indicator of what's to come. No doubt Rory and Jordan will be the leaders of their generation and it will be fun to watch.

Tiger? It was a good run, but he's done winning Majors as is Phil IMHO.

You are so correct about Luis. Golfers know, when a low handicapper gets stuck w/ a 90's to 100's shooter, they usually balloon their score, to mirror the duffer.

#11 06-23-2015, 02:42 PM

The interesting thing about Speith is that he has very significant swing flaws. But he has such great targeting ability that he makes them work for him.

Smitty70 · #12 06-25-2015, 07:40 PM

He wins and then reacts with a maturity beyond his years. He comes across, to me, as a fine young man with great gift to play the game.

aknow · #13 06-25-2015, 11:53 PM

I wouldn't get on the Spieth bandwagon the way he backed into that win.
That was the worst coverage of a major golf tourney in the history of golf.
Missing and lost camera coverage of shots, totally innane stupid commentary, and deplorable golf course conditions. If you've ever watched "World Series of Golf" from the '60's, the camera coverage 50 years ago was superior to that travesty by Fox news, which should stick to lying to the public.

jseth · #14 06-26-2015, 12:39 PM

Well, aknow, I couldn't disagree more! I thought the coverage was far better than the usual "Johnny Miller" patter... Fox had the good sense to have a plethora of "expert" players on their rota, again far more than other networks have done...

I really think a lot of Jordan; his game is testimony to the paramount importance of the short game in golf... ESPECIALLY now that players are hitting the ball so far, more than ever, GETTING THE BALL IN THE HOLE is the whole deal, really... and Jordan finds a way to get that done with startling regularity!

The final hour or so of that tournament was fairly amazing... seemed that every minute, some other player looked good to win, or tie at least... I am not a huge fan of Dustin Johnson, but had to admit that he had won the thing when he hit that 5 iron (?!) to the 18th green... I know that Jordan felt the same way...

As DJ stood over that putt, kept looking at it... hesitating when Jason Dey asked him if he wanted him to mark his ball or finish, and DJ hesitated a long while before answering, all of a sudden it occurred to me that, if Dustin 3-putted, Jordan would win... I still thought DJ would tie, at least, when he faced that final 3 1/2 footer...

Funny, Dustin had said, the evening before, that he "knew what it takes" to win a Major... my immediate thought was, "Well, you know what it takes to come in second!". Only announcer I heard that took note of that was Brandel Chamblee on the Golf Channel... I guess DJ needs to figure out some things about himself and the game before he's going to win a Major...

I definitely had "opinions" about Chambers Bay... but, to the USGA's credit, they kept it a bit soft and playable, such as that was... as a former scratch player (still a 7 at age 64) and caddie, I have come to embrace Alister MacKenzie's philosophy that a GREAT golf course is not necessariy the most difficult, but the course that is challenging for ALL levels of play, from the 25 handicap duffer to the "scratch man"...

The Tour's policy about restricting player's comments regarding any particular course infuriates me! Let the guys say what they really think... of course, IF you are competing in any event, you had better find a way to fall in love with it, or you have no chance, whatsoever, of winning... especially true in golf. Even though the greens were brutally poor, the guys had to suck it up if they wanted any chance at all... double-edged sword regarding "telling the truth" about a course, I know.

As much as I like Jordan, I also realize that it is far too easy to "crown" the new king too quickly... I agree that he is the best player on the planet right now, though, and am excited to see how his career develops through the years. Hopefully, he can keep his head screwed on straight in the avalanche of accolades and publicity that is already a tempest...

H165 · #15 06-26-2015, 02:31 PM

There have been lots of predictions about golfers. Most just blow away over time. The Woods predictions confidently seeing him earning more green jackets than anyone in history come to mind. I suppose they'll keep doing it, as once in a while a lucky guess comes true and makes the predictor look smart, while the thousands of non-starters are conveniently forgotten.

Oosthuizen is in an odd and unique "recognition" world of his own, with the albatross shot. I was standing at the 18th green when that shot was made, and the roar from the #2 green crowd remains the loudest and longest I've heard. We wondered if one of the "look at my Gulfstream" flyovers so common at that tournament had finally come down on the course. The shot and the roar continue to reverberate, and will keep Oosthuizen known to golfers throughout history. The fact that he's a fine golfer has so-far been made a footnote to this shot.

As for Spieth, the Slam is like the Triple Crown. Winning the precursors looks much easier than winning them all.

I'm an expert on golf myself, shooting far more shots per round (and thereby having vastly more applied experience) than anyone I know