Build #2 for Zandit75??!!

[Zandit75]

Wow, it's hard to believe that it's been nearly 6years since I completed my first build with the assistance of Aaron Fenech on the Aussie Gold Coast. And nearly 8yrs since I started bombarding the forum with questions and ideas!!

For those who haven't yet seen the questions, queries, weird speculation, umming and ahhing, building nerves, pure unadulterated terror and then delightful acoustic bliss....check here!!! https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...light=Zandit75
PS: The build doesn't even start until part way through page 6!!!

So, guess who's got the itch again??!!!

I wanted to jump in straight away for another build, as many here have done, but funding doesn't grow on trees!!!
My 50th B'Day is coming up in March 2025, so I'm planning a big present for myself.
Unfortunately, Aaron is no longer offering building classes, but there are still other options available. One of which is with the Australian Guitar Making School under the tutelage of Steve Toscano in the Sydney region.
This particular course covers three weeks instead of the 2 weeks I did in the last one, and hopefully I'll have the chance to do a bevel with this build.

Things I already have locked in mind(Time dependent of course):
Venetian Cutaway
Arm Bevel
Fishman Matrix Infinity Mic Blend Pickup, or see if I can can source myself one of Cole Clark's highly regarded PG3 systems.
Sound port
Inlay at the 12th fret, and a logo on the headstock.

Since I have the blackwood in my last build, I'll be looking at something different for this next build. Going through my list of guitars in my signature below, what would people suggest I look at?

Let's see how many pages we get through before this build starts!!

[TomB'sox]

Congrats on your next build. What woods to use is so hard to say. You have the Blackwood, a Walnut, and a Rosewood, that really covers the general categories of back and side woods nicely. So I don't think, in general, there is much in back and side woods that would be a whole lot different sound-wise then anything else you have (I am putting the Walnut nearer Mahogany BTW). Maybe just some really cool looking wood with a grain pattern that knocks you out. That could be straight grain if that is what you like or something really wild.

I see you do not have a redwood topped guitar. I would really recommend trying that. I have several and love them all.

[Zandit75]

Originally Posted by TomB'sox

Congrats on your next build. What woods to use is so hard to say. You have the Blackwood, a Walnut, and a Rosewood, that really covers the general categories of back and side woods nicely. So I don't think, in general, there is much in back and side woods that would be a whole lot different sound-wise then anything else you have (I am putting the Walnut nearer Mahogany BTW). Maybe just some really cool looking wood with a grain pattern that knocks you out. That could be straight grain if that is what you like or something really wild.

I see you do not have a redwood topped guitar. I would really recommend trying that. I have several and love them all.

Thanks Tom, really looking forward to it!!
Nice idea on the Redwood top, I like that!
I'm assuming this would include cedars?

[colins]

Wow, is it really six years?! I enjoyed your first build thread so I’ll look forward to the next one.

I looked up Steve Toscano; he seems to have a strong position in terms of private guitar building courses. Jim Cargill here in Victoria also does teaching at his property in Red Hill, but I’m way out of date on the details. I do know that Jim builds steel string guitars that sound amazing, and he has some amazing woods too.

As to choosing woods, have you finalised the top wood (and its voicing) so they suit your particular playing style?

[Zandit75]

Since we're in a new year, and my 50th is only next year, it's time for an update!!

I spoke with Steve Toscano last week, as his website hadn't been updated for some time, and there were no dates showing for 2024, let alone 2025.
He's in the process of moving his workshop to a place called Port Stephens near Newcastle, NSW.

As the new workshop is smaller than his current one, his course size will be reduced from 5-6 people to around 3. Not only will this reduce his own stress levels, but allow more 1-on-1 time with his students.

So, here's hoping things remain stable, and I can get on the list for next year, with no issues.

One other feature I forgot to mention in the earlier posts, Steve utilises the Falcate bracing system as designed by Trevor Gore.

Does anyone have input on this style of bracing? How does it compare A-B against the more common X-Brace? How does it compare on a redwood top?

TIA.

[Guitars44me]

I highly recommend a Manzer wedge and bevels front and back. Arm and belly both

If you want a bevel you already know about the ergonomic benefits.

The wedge will not affect tone, as long as you split the difference of the depths, if that makes sense…. I hope!

The cubic inches are what matters. Ask the hot rod guys! Hahaha

And make SURE you know what you want/need for neck dimensions and carve, BEFORE you get going

Oh to be 50 again…. You kids today

Cheers

Paul

[Zandit75]

Originally Posted by Guitars44me

I highly recommend a Manzer wedge and bevels front and back. Arm and belly both

If you want a bevel you already know about the ergonomic benefits.

The wedge will not affect tone, as long as you split the difference of the depths, if that makes sense…. I hope!

The cubic inches are what matters. Ask the hot rod guys! Hahaha

And make SURE you know what you want/need for neck dimensions and carve, BEFORE you get going

Oh to be 50 again…. You kids today

Cheers

Paul

Haha, I'm not even there yet, so I guess, I'm definitely a kid!!!

Yes, an arm bevel is on the cards, but since we're only talking about a 3 week build, throwing in a Manzer wedge and rib bevel might be pushing the friendship a little too far.

While my first build was only 2 weeks, Steve doesn't use as much of the jigs, forms, bending machines and other larger machines, so this will be more hands on this time around.

[Zandit75]

Another few weeks have gone by, and the research continues!!
Rosette designs, pickup selections, different timbers etc etc etc!!

The idea of a Redwood top and possibly some streaky Ebony has really started getting the creative juices salivating!!!

I started another thread on the general discussion page, looking for understated rosette designs that are simple yet elegant, but I didn't get much in the way of participation there. Hopefully, you guys can send some ideas my way!!

I keep going back over the Facebook page for the school I'll be attending, and there have been some really nice designs go through. Hopefully, I can keep the trend going!!

Here's some photos of previous student builds!

Ziricote


Pale Ebony




Good old Tassie Blackwood!


Rosette ideas




Finally, the Falcate bracing, which will be very interesting to compare side by side with the more traditional X-braced guitars




Thanks for tuning in!!

[TomB'sox]

I am glad you are giving serious consideration to the redwood tops. Check out some of Ben Wilborn's youtube videos on redwood tops, they can be amazing and he feels they sit right in a nice pocket between spruce and cedar.

Those rosettes are really cool, but they don't look all that simple to me!

[Zandit75]

Originally Posted by TomB'sox

I am glad you are giving serious consideration to the redwood tops. Check out some of Ben Wilborn's youtube videos on redwood tops, they can be amazing and he feels they sit right in a nice pocket between spruce and cedar.



Those rosettes are really cool, but they don't look all that simple to me!

Honestly, I'm getting a little sick of Ben's videos.... there's only so much beauty you listen to over a certain period of time!!!

Yeah, I should have mentioned that the school offers several different styles of classes. There's the intensive 3 week course that I'll be doing, and then there's the casual classes that locals can attend and do a 4hr session here and there at their own leisure. They pay per session, and the build takes a long as it takes. They get to put as much, or as little as they like into the build.

[colins]

Are you going to try the falcate bracing? It looks amazing.

[Zandit75]

Originally Posted by colins

Are you going to try the falcate bracing? It looks amazing.

Yeah, that's the basis of all of the steel string guitars they build at this school.
I believe Steve does a simplified version of Trevor Gore's design.
Should be an interesting project laminating the braces and bending them as needed, plus applying the carbon fiber strips to the braces. From what I've seen, they don't apply the carbon fiber underneath the braces, only on top.

[Zandit75]

Hmm, curve ball time!!
Prepare yourself for a journey through my troubled mind!!

So, my birthday for this year has come and gone, and the plot thickens!
A few other options have popped up on my radar that have muddied the waters!

Firstly, those of you who have looked through my original build, will have seen that my first option for building a guitar was with a Melbourne based luthier called Chris Wynne, who was conducting courses here in Tasmania, about an hour away from home.
While timing and money at the time didn't work for me, Chris ended up moving to Europe for a number of years, so I ended up building my guitar with Aaron Fenech.
Just the other week, Chris advertised a new build course right here in my home town of Penguin, Tasmania!!
Only issue is, the course is happening in May this year, and while the course is much cheaper(plus I won't have other expenses like accommodation and flight costs to consider), there are a number of other considerations that I won't detail here, but they have dissuaded me from taking this course.

Then, the wife comes to me with questions!
"Are you sure you want to do the build?"
"Are you sure that you can complete the build in the time frame?"
"What happens if you don't, considering how much money you're looking to outlay?"

Why were these questions asked, I hear you say?!!

It stems from a concern I raised about the time frame of the course.
Working on my first build with Aaron, I was able to utilise all of his workshop equipment, forms, jigs etc etc. It made things much easier and the build was completed in 11 days.
While the new class with Steve Toscano is 15 days in length, his workshop is smaller, and more focused on doing things with less tech involved. Hand bending the sides with a bending iron, minimal use of electric tools like joiners, dremels, sanders etc.
There is also the added fiddliness of the Falcate bracing system.
I'm not sure if I'm just over thinking things.

Enter the wife's third option
"How about you talk with Aaron about him building you a Masterbuilt Series guitar?"

Dammit, I hate having so many options to consider!!!

For those interested, please hit the link below to see a snippet of Aaron's offerings.
https://fenechguitars.com.au/fenech-...-built-series/

Depending on what appointments I go for, this route could be cheaper than doing the 3 week course when you consider accommodation etc.
I already have a great relationship with Aaron, and while I haven't tried one of his Masterbuilt guitars yet, he really does produce an excellent guitar.

His current waiting list is approx 6mths, and it takes him around 10 weeks to complete his Masterbuilt guitars.

Why is life like this??!!

[colins]

Interesting discussions going on in the Zandit household! Your post makes me wonder where you will get more enjoyment: out of building another guitar yourself or commissioning a custom build?

If it is the latter, I will state the obvious…play as many guitars as you can by that builder before you commit. There are many good builders around and they produce guitars with wide variation in characteristics, so the first step is to find a builder whose signature sound and playability suits you. As a silly example, no-one should commission a guitar from Taylor wanting it sound just like a Martin.

You mention a friendship with Aaron, which is great. With every luthier whose guitars I have selected for sound, a friendship has developed over the build process. It’s part of the fun.

The other comment that I would make echoes similar comments from a number of us on this page, namely to think about what you want out of the build process itself and select a builder with a similar approach. For example, if you want weekly chats on Zoom, don’t select a builder who is more comfortable with six months of solitude! The guitar could be great, but you may both end up with unhappy memories of the build.

But! I also recall you having the time of your life on your first build, so is that what you are really hankering for again? In that case, a bit of patience and more research might find you the “sweet spot” for a build course, that gives you the fun of the build without that valid concern about adequate time. There’s a wait for a custom guitar and there could be another wait for the right course, but in each case you are aiming for a fun experience and a special guitar.

Good luck!

[Zandit75]

All very good points Colin! Thanks for your response.

Yes, it's definitely not something I'm looking to dive into without any research.

While I haven't played any of Aaron's Masterbuilt guitars, his standard range of guitars are really good over all of the grades that he builds his standard range to.

More thinking time to be had!