#16
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Derek Coombs Youtube -> Website -> Music -> Tabs Guitars by Mark Blanchard, Albert&Mueller, Paul Woolson, Collings, Composite Acoustics, and Derek Coombs "Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." Woods hands pick by eye and ear
Made to one with pride and love To be that we hold so dear A voice from heavens above Last edited by rick-slo; 04-10-2010 at 10:45 PM. |
#17
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Most tricks to fake stereo, like slipping tracks, etc, end up sounding very noticeable to me. They sound dramatic at first, but once you tune into them, you can recognize them for what they are, and therefore are distracting. I've heard some very nice solo guitar recordings that were done with 1 mic, and simply had some reverb and ambience applied, which to my ear is a far better way to simulate stereo. You basically hear a point source in a "room", artificially created by the reverb. There are some free IRs out there that do a great job of this. Just put the single source "in a room" with a good stereo reverb.
On the other hand, I almost always prefer a true stereo recording, with 2 mics. We have 2 ears, and 2 mics comes closest to mimicing that. The phase issues with 2 mics tends to be exaggerated, I think. It's a real issue, but if you use any of the common micing techniques, the effect will be minimal. Phase differences are part of what gives an image it's stereo-ness, and are part of what our ears use as cues as well. It's only a problem if you do something that's extreme. Otherwise, slight phase and volume variations are part of a natural part of a realistic sound of a guitar. Every part of the guitar vibrates, and not every part is in phase, so even when listening to your guitar when you're playing, you're hearing phase differences, and they contribute to why the guitar sounds good!
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar |
#18
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Of course it comes down in the end, to personal taste and what sound one is trying to achieve. I do not see it as a question of right or wrong, better or worse, simply another tool in the producers arsenal. What led me try this method was two things actually First the goal being a wide, big, clean guitar sound. with the big being a primary goal. Second when I started experimenting with summing to mono. I found that two my ears, there was more phase issues going on in the the two mic method I was using, than when using the one mic and dup method. There are of course other methods one might choose, for different desired results. Thus the beauty of art.
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2024.3 Sonoma 14.4 |
#19
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2024.3 Sonoma 14.4 |
#20
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Ah, but the guitar isn't a single point sound source, nor are most solo instruments. And even if it was, what you hear when you play it is the way it interacts with the room, and that becomes part of the sound. Figuring out how to convey that to a listener, who is listening over unknown speakers in an unknown room is part of the art and challenge of recording. Maybe 1 mic does what you want, maybe it takes 2, maybe more. One of the nicer sounding solo guitar records I've heard lately is Tony McManus's the Maker's Mark. Very natural, "you are there" sound. I can't locate the photo at the moment, but he's using 6 mics in the oddball-est setup I've ever seen. Whatever works! And of course, it all depends on what sound you're going for. I've yet to achieve a sound I really like for my own recordings with 1 mic, but it may just be that that's not the sound I hear in my head.
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar |
#21
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Regards, Ty Ford |
#22
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I have no doubt that others have had the same experience as you, however, manufacturers offer matched sets of microphones for a reason.
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#23
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It sounds like your desired goal , is to replicate the sound you are hearing while playing correct ? So I am curious what is the exact configuration you use ?
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2024.3 Sonoma 14.4 |
#24
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KeyWind,
Mono or stereo both work. Record the way that sounds good to you. For myself with the recording results I get I feel stereo sound better and more realistic. For example this stereo recording I did with a spaced pair of mikes sounds tonally just like the guitar does live http://dcoombsguitar.com/Guitar%20Music/SayItOut.mp3 I tried mono and have taken stereo recording such as the one above and split right and left tracks and listened in mono and to me it just never sounded quite right. Since the sound of a guitar emanates from the from a broad area anything miked at the usual recording distance sounds a bit phasey to me. Listening to mono through right and left ears it still sounds phasey. Recorded in stereo that phasey sound more or less becomes interpreted by the ears as a sense of space. Since when playing the guitar live I hear it through right and left ears and since the right and left hears are hearing a different sound due to where they are positioned and pointed stereo recording just sounds more natural to me. Mono recording is great and easier to work with when the guitar is part of a mix and you want the guitar sound to sit in a particular position in the overall ensemble.
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Derek Coombs Youtube -> Website -> Music -> Tabs Guitars by Mark Blanchard, Albert&Mueller, Paul Woolson, Collings, Composite Acoustics, and Derek Coombs "Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." Woods hands pick by eye and ear
Made to one with pride and love To be that we hold so dear A voice from heavens above |
#25
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I've tried lots of micing approaches; the two that I mostly use today are M/S (usually with a pair of Schoeps), and spaced pairs (with the schoeps or a pair of Brauners). M/S is especially useful because it give you a choice. You actually have to get a good mono sound first, with the mid mic, and you can choose to leave it mono when you mix, or bring in the side mic for as much or little stereo sound as you want. It gives you that centered, focused sound of mono, with the sense of space of a stereo setup. On the other hand it doesn't sound as spacious as spaced pairs. Sometimes I record with both (4 mics) and either choose or blend as needed. When I play guitar, I feel like the sound is in 3D all around me . Stereo does a relatively mediocre job of reproducing that sound in 2D, and mono takes it down to 1D. But sometimes that's what you want - mono's probably the right way to go if the acoustic is just one instrument in a mix, but I almost never record that type of music anymore.
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar |
#26
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If you were really hinky about symmetry it would make more sense to XY the mics vertically across the bouts rather than bottom to top. That's a tip I got for George Massenburg. Once you accept that paradigm, though, it's difficult to get over concerned about matching pair. At this point, I don't think Neumann or AKG even offer matching pairs. They claim the tolerances are tight enough mic to mic so it doesn't matter. When I bought my second schoeps, I was told they checked the curve on the one I had bought so they could choose a proper mate. Regards, Ty Ford |
#27
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We just bought a matched pair of AKG C451Bs.
Bob
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
#28
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Sometimes I'll record with one mic and the guitar plugged in. Then the two tracks can be EQ'ed, blended and panned to taste (plus, maybe a little reverb on the plugged in one). It just gives a slightly different quality from using two mics, but it still sounds "acoustic" to most ears. Also, it's like getting twice the mic without twice the room noise.
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#29
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I would say that we are indeed after different sounds or perhaps different emphasis for the sound . My recording efforts are more in the singer/songwriter arena with the guitar as the main musical instrument but still must be part of a mix and must support the vocal as in these recordings ( have to hit the triangle play button upper left) http://www.reverbnation.com/tunepak/2556383
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2024.3 Sonoma 14.4 |
#30
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I happen to use a Brauner Phantom V, for vocals
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2024.3 Sonoma 14.4 |