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  #1  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:58 AM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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Default Sloane tuner upgrade fitting

Iím getting a new Martin crossover 0-28 nylon string. I have a brand new set of Sloan tuners and donít like the idea of paying Martin 2 1/2 Times what they cost to buy. Especially when I have the same thing just sittin here... was wondering if anybody might know what cheap tuner Martin might sell that I could remove and put the Sloanís on that the screw holes would match up with? I donít mind putting a new screw hole in but donít want the old hole to show. Filling it in never looks a good as having had the right one in to begin with. Thought somebody might have a little knowledge from putting Sloanís on as an upgrade of something else.

Thanks
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  #2  
Old 12-02-2017, 10:24 AM
charles Tauber charles Tauber is offline
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Contact Martin and ask them. From your description, it sounds like they offer the Sloane's as an option and should know the relative sizes and spacings of the tuning machines they offer.
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Old 12-02-2017, 02:19 PM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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I had that idea too. They sell Sloans and they have the other ones right there so I did, but couldnít get an answer out of em. I donít think itís an easy answer to actually come up with. Asked stew Mac also and they said they didnít have the information either. Iím thinking about making a one to one size tracing with screw holes and sending it to Martin To see if that would work.

If I canít find this out Iíll go with the gotohís and return the Sloans. But Iíve used Sloans and they feel and work really slick. Never used the gotohís and they may be good also. Just that they make several styles and I have no idea what Martin puts on. I have some pictures coming from them. Just donít think I could live with myself paying over two times as much for something that I have sitting right here and anybody can buy brand new For the same price I paid. Itís not like they donít put tuners on anyway. just donít think I could live with paying over two times as much for something that I have sitting right here and anybody can buy brand new. Itís not like theyíre doing something extra by putting Tuners on that they wouldnít have to do anywayÖ I do understand its Martin Tho and thereís nothing I can do about it
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Old 12-02-2017, 03:09 PM
AndreF AndreF is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operacaster View Post
Iím getting a new Martin crossover 0-28 nylon string.
Thanks
Is this a custom order? I don't recognize this model at all in a nylon stringer.
Just curious.
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  #5  
Old 12-02-2017, 03:09 PM
charles Tauber charles Tauber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operacaster View Post
I had that idea too. They sell Sloans and they have the other ones right there so I did, but couldnít get an answer out of em. I donít think itís an easy answer to actually come up with. Asked stew Mac also and they said they didnít have the information either.
Here's what I would do. I'd return the $300 Sloans, made by Stewmac's subsidiary. I'd buy the guitar from a different guitar manufacturer.

It is not difficult to determine if one brand is dimensionally interchangeable with another. On Stewmac's website, they provide dimensions for the Sloan tuners. http://www.stewmac.com/Hardware_and_...aseplates.html

One need only compare the relevant dimensions to a similar drawing for the other options that are offered (e.g. from Martin). I have no doubt that similar drawings exist for each of the other options. That shouldn't take more than a few minutes.

Neither company is willing to put in the effort to answer your relatively simple question. I'd take my business elsewhere for both.
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Old 12-02-2017, 04:00 PM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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Yes, itís a Martin custom shop guitar. They only make one Standard nylon string and itís not close to what I want. Taylor offers some but theyíre smallest body has a bigger lower bout than I want, and when I tried to get info from Larrivťe they just want to guide me towards their Normal classicals which isnít what I want. Tried a guitar from another company and it got returned because of too many problems with it. I have other martins and like them, itís just a little tough figuring out how to order. Might end up ordering an N20 which comes with Sloanís, the neck I want with the right nut width, ebony fretboard and then paying an upchard to get a Radiused fretboard having it turned into a single 0 size.

I may even think hard on whether or not to go flat fretboard... not sure if they donít really help me all that much or if Iím just equally bad with either one.
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Old 12-03-2017, 08:08 AM
AndreF AndreF is offline
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Quote:
....Yes, itís a Martin custom shop guitar. They only make one Standard nylon string and itís not close to what I want....Might end up ordering an N20 which comes with Sloanís, the neck I want with the right nut width, ebony fretboard and then paying an upchard to get a Radiused fretboard having it turned into a single 0 size.
You know, I'm a big fan of Martin guitars (own 3 incl. an old nylon), and I have absolute faith that the custom shop would do its very best to accommodate your requirements.
That said, I'm not sure that I would be going down that road if it were me, i.e. the 0-28 body in a nylon string. That might have an unpredictable outcome tone wise. I'd personally feel a lot more comfortable with a custom steel order than nylon for that particular 0-28 size. I know what you mean about liking Martins, but build and top-bracing wise, it's challenging to transpose from steel to nylon. It might not be at all what you expect.
With an N20, I would hesitate to mess with existing specs the way you're planning.
Certainly not trying to discourage you! Just wanted to give you an opinion before you commit big funds for this type of custom order.
As an alternative, you might want to consider standard crossover designs from other builders, ones that specialize in nylon string guitars.
Cervantes comes to mind as an example. He has a Crossover I (radiused board, narrower neck) and Crossover II (flat board, classical width) in standard models which are likely much less money than a custom shop order. He uses quality materials (and tuners). Here is a Crossover I close-up:

There are others.
Just food for thought! There's no harm in broadening your search.
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  #8  
Old 12-03-2017, 12:10 PM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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Put this on another post but I guess not on this oneÖ

I have a Credit at a store that Iíd like to use on this. If I didnít I probably look for vintage model. I have a Barberra pick up Iím going to put in. Itís a very sizable creditÖ ( ok... iím sure people are going to be wondering, itís $1500 ) I have choices of Martin, which I have two custom shop already and like them very muc. I realize Martin isnít known for building the greatest classical guitars, but Iím not looking for a Classical. More of a folk or crossover. For my purposes Iím pretty confident that it would be fine. Also I could get a Taylor but I donít like the lower bout size for what I wanted for. Itís big and Iím looking for and easy on the fingers nighttime couch guitar. Could get A Collins or a Kopp But I donít think they make nylons. Cordova or Yamaha which I canít get what I want from. Takamine tc135 would work but they donít carry them .

Unfortunately a lot of the ones that people recommend arenít available to me if I want to use the credit. My biggest problem with Martin is trying to figure out how to order, and thereís always a matter of price. It almost seems like theyre wanting to punish me to order nylon. I had always heard that the 0-ny models sounded great if you ordered a nylon and that they had built a couple in Rosewood. Iím sure theyíve got this all figured out thereís no way I can win, but thereís a lot on the N20 model I want. Like I said, comes with Sloan, right size nut, I could get my MOD-V which I have thought another question shop Martin and I like. If I got it in mahogany would come with black binding which looks kind of nice if I got mahogany and not that much more if I jumped to Rosewood. Donít disslike the sound of mahogany. 25.4 scale Then I could pay the upgrade to have it made in a 0 size or maybe even a New York if itís not too planets away from what the original model is. Kind of thinking that changing the size is about 200 bucks but I could be wrong. Thought making this change would give me what I want. Iím afraid if I got a flat fretboard Iíd always have trouble playing a barred F chord.
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  #9  
Old 12-04-2017, 12:14 PM
rob2966 rob2966 is offline
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In addition to the screw holes, don't the Sloane's need a slightly larger barrel hole to accommodate the bearing?

I have a set of Sloane's on my custom flamenco and love them.

Later
Rob
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  #10  
Old 12-04-2017, 01:10 PM
smwink smwink is offline
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If you're placing a custom order and you want to use the Sloane tuning machines you have in hand, can you just send them your tuners with the instructions to use them and not charge you for theirs? Seems to me that if you're dropping custom shop money, then they should accommodate this request.
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  #11  
Old 12-04-2017, 01:21 PM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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Smwink...

Thatís a really good ideaÖ

I wish I could describe to you how hard they laughed when I asked em that question

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Old 12-04-2017, 01:41 PM
smwink smwink is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operacaster View Post
Smwink...

Thatís a really good ideaÖ

I wish I could describe to you how hard they laughed when I asked em that question

So now I'm with Charles Tauber on this one. Why give your money to a company that is making this so difficult? Could you just sell your store credit to someone else and cash out?
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Old 12-04-2017, 02:28 PM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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Yea, I know what you mean. they sure ainít making it easy. Sometimes I think about taking up flutophone playing.
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  #14  
Old 12-04-2017, 02:59 PM
charles Tauber charles Tauber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smwink View Post
Why give your money to a company that is making this so difficult?
As hard as Martin "sells" being "handmade", yada, yada, yada, they are a factory that mass-produces a product. They allow "mass customization", meaning you can choose from a combination of pre-ordained choices, much like buying a car and the options they provide.

What you are asking them to do - having them use the tuners you send them - is rather like asking Ford to use on your next car the windshield you have in storage in your garage. If you want something - or some service - beyond what their factory lines accommodate, you're barking up the wrong tree.

Ask the same question of a small luthier and you're likely to get a positive response: "Sure, I can do that". Different business model.

Think about what havoc would result in a factory setting having individual customers send in parts they want used on their mass-produced objects. It isn't a question of "quality", mass-produced vs. one-off, it's a question of what demand each is in business to address and what services each offers to address that.
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  #15  
Old 12-04-2017, 03:08 PM
operacaster operacaster is offline
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Yea, I realize that. I just thought if I could find the cheapest tuners they have that had a matching screw hole pattern that I could switch out myself since I already had
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