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  #1  
Old 05-04-2015, 08:21 AM
The Colonel The Colonel is offline
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Default Ribbon Mics and Preamps

Does anyone know whether you need a special (or really high-end) preamp to work with a decent ribbon mic, or can I use my Apogee Duet?

Thx,

The Colonel
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  #2  
Old 05-04-2015, 08:30 AM
fdwill fdwill is offline
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Default Ribbon Microphones

I've had no problem recording with my Beyer ribbon microphones through a Presonus interface with no need for a preamp. I don't believe you will need one with the Duet.
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Old 05-04-2015, 08:38 AM
paulp1960 paulp1960 is offline
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These Cloudlifter devices are meant to be great for ribbon mikes or even dynamic mikes.

They take 48 volt phantom power to give about 25 Db extra gain:

http://cloudmicrophones.com/cloud12/?page_id=222

The phantom power is not passed through to the microphone.

Made in the US as well.
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Old 05-04-2015, 08:57 AM
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Doug Young Doug Young is offline
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This will depend on the map, but you should be fine. The main thing you need with passive ribbon mics is lots of clean gain. The duet has 75db, i believe, which should be plenty. Try it and see. What ribbon mic(s) do you have/or are getting?
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Old 05-04-2015, 10:45 AM
The Colonel The Colonel is offline
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Doug,

I am eying the Royer line. I know they are expensive, but you know my penchant for stereo recording my acoustic, so I thought would be an excellent choice for a mid-side set up, even if I have to use one channel of my Rode Nt4 as the "mid."

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Old 05-04-2015, 11:07 AM
rockabilly69 rockabilly69 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulp1960 View Post
These Cloudlifter devices are meant to be great for ribbon mikes or even dynamic mikes.

They take 48 volt phantom power to give about 25 Db extra gain:

http://cloudmicrophones.com/cloud12/?page_id=222

The phantom power is not passed through to the microphone.

Made in the US as well.
I have a Cloud JRS-34 microphone that has a built in Cloudlifter and it sounds GREAT, and also I own two of the Cloudlifter Z preamps and I use them with my other Ribbon mics, THEY ARE FANTASTIC! Another good pre for a Ribbon is a Focusrite ISA One, which I've had very good luck with.
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Old 05-04-2015, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
Doug,

I am eying the Royer line. I know they are expensive, but you know my penchant for stereo recording my acoustic, so I thought would be an excellent choice for a mid-side set up, even if I have to use one channel of my Rode Nt4 as the "mid."

Regards,

The Colonel
What I was mostly referring to is that some ribbons are active these days, while traditionally ribbons are passive. Acitve ones don't need a lot of gain. Passive ones do. Passive ones can also be affected by impedance. Royer makes both active and passive.

Another thing to watch out for is that some ribbons, including Royer's are designed to have different frequency response on one side than the other. This would tend to affect the normal mid-side math. What that means in practice is hard to say, might be exactly the right magical combination, or might not. I use an AEA R88 for mid-side, and that works well, tho it's a very dark mic. I'd like to try a Royer SF-24 someday and see how that works for mid-side.
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Old 05-04-2015, 11:35 AM
The Colonel The Colonel is offline
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Doug,

The active version of the Royer may be a wiser choice, havnig looked at the technical spcs. The one you cited above is a stereo mic, and so is ready for mid-side right out of the box.

I've heard samples of other Royer stereo mics on the web, and they sound fantastic.

I was interested to see in the video on your web site that you combine the sound of a spaced pair with mid-side to come up with a stereo blend. The M/S adds an ambience that gives the recording that something extra.

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Old 05-04-2015, 12:25 PM
rockabilly69 rockabilly69 is offline
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Colonel - Just a thought...

The Cloud JRS-34 already has the cloudlifter pre built in and it would sound great for what you are doing for the S part of the equation. What are you using for your mid mic? I've used one in this setup many times and I love it. I personally use a Neumann U89 as my mid. One thing to consider is, if you use a ribbon with another high quality condensor you get the clarity of the condensor, with the warmth of the ribbons. If you use the SF12 - SF24 it would be all ribbon. And for the money spent on a SF24 you could get something like the CAD E-100s and the Cloud JRS-34 for a lot less money than the Royers. I have used the Royer SF122 (the single channel figure 8 Royer) many times and it is a fabulous mic, but IMNSHO no better than the Cloud which has many of the same attributes (high power handling, extended top end, uses 48 volts). And the Cloud also sounds great on vocals and electric guitar! I had bought some of the cheaper ribbons out there and although I could get decent tones (Cascade Fathead IIs with Lundahl transformers, and SHINYBOX 23's with upgraded transformers), when I got the Cloud recording got easy, and with no preamp needed, it sounds great right into my RME UCX, RME Babyface, and Apogee One interfaces!

Cloud JRS-34 http://www.samash.com/cloud-micropho...FVKAaQod3g8AIA

Cloud E100s http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...G&Q=&A=details

Last edited by rockabilly69; 05-04-2015 at 12:32 PM.
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Old 05-04-2015, 12:32 PM
The Colonel The Colonel is offline
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Right now, all I have is a Rode Nt4 -- a stereo mic, so I would use one of the Rode mics (left or right) as the "mid."
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Old 05-04-2015, 12:36 PM
rockabilly69 rockabilly69 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Colonel View Post
Right now, all I have is a Rode Nt4 -- a stereo mic, so I would use one of the Rode mics (left or right) as the "mid."
Well if you are going to spend the big money on a Royer seriously consider purchasing the E100s as a mid!!! Read the reviews I had one but sold it to buy my U89 which cost me an arm and a leg! But the E100s was a great mic. Clean and NO noise!
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Old 05-04-2015, 12:56 PM
sdelsolray sdelsolray is offline
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A few things:

1) Passive vs. active ribbon mics - passive ribbons needs a lot of gain, so a preamp capable of providing it cleanly is needed. An Apogee Duet will do that. An active ribbon uses balanced phantom power similar to a condenser mic.

2) Cloudlifter - adds gain to a passive ribbon before the preamp, in essence making the passive ribbon mic an active one.

3) Front and back response - If you are going to use a ribbon for M/S recording, make sure the frequency response of the ribbon mic is the same for the front and the back. Some ribbon mics have different frequency responses on the front and back (e.g., AEA R92).

4) Storage - always store the ribbon mic vertically when not in use.

Ribbon mic to check out --> AEA N22
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:09 PM
rockabilly69 rockabilly69 is offline
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AEA N22
Another great mic! And AEA also makes of of the best preamps for ribbons the TRP!
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:32 PM
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The TRP is a nice preamp. I used it for a while, then switched to the RPQ, which AEA released about the same time, and has shelving EQ that comes in handy with ribbons, and also has the option to have phantom power, so I can use it with other mics as well.

But the Duet should be fine for passive ribbons, and preamp gain is a non-issue if you're looking at active ribbons.
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Old 05-04-2015, 01:47 PM
rockabilly69 rockabilly69 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
The TRP is a nice preamp. I used it for a while, then switched to the RPQ, which AEA released about the same time, and has shelving EQ that comes in handy with ribbons, and also has the option to have phantom power, so I can use it with other mics as well.

But the Duet should be fine for passive ribbons, and preamp gain is a non-issue if you're looking at active ribbons.

Yes the RPQ is even better And what really hasn't been mentioned here is if the ribbon is going to be used up close you have to deal with proximity effect and the shelving EQ can really help with that, although I haven't to deal with that any time I've used a ribbon as a side mic, it's been mostly an issue with vocals, or when using the mic in a, up close - straight on, config.
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