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  #16  
Old 12-01-2021, 02:57 PM
AcousticDreams AcousticDreams is offline
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Originally Posted by nomey View Post
I recorded most of my album with one of these and found it great. Its got huge value for money having bi and omni options as well. I found the vocals really smooth with it for males and females. Heres a clip of it in use on one of our singles. Its female lead but there are Male harmonies.

Really enjoyed this creation. Really sets a mood. Simplicity at its best!
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  #17  
Old 12-01-2021, 04:33 PM
rockabilly69 rockabilly69 is offline
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I'm as much of a high end mic chaser as most people, but I have found that this mic is the best deal under $1000 that I have ever heard.

https://www.pssl.com/products/mxl-re...-condenser-mic

Up to the point of buying one of these I would have NEVER considered buying any MXL microphone, but this one took me by surprise...

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=460719

https://gearspace.com/board/so-much-...-mic-deal.html
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  #18  
Old 12-01-2021, 05:48 PM
Glennwillow Glennwillow is offline
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Originally Posted by rockabilly69 View Post
I'm as much of a high end mic chaser as most people, but I have found that this mic is the best deal under $1000 that I have ever heard.

https://www.pssl.com/products/mxl-re...-condenser-mic

Up to the point of buying one of these I would have NEVER considered buying any MXL microphone, but this one took me by surprise...

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=460719

https://gearspace.com/board/so-much-...-mic-deal.html
I, too, have read that the MXL REVELATION II Multi-Pattern Tube Condenser Mic is a good deal. It's a very good sounding microphone at a very reasonable price of $450.

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  #19  
Old 12-02-2021, 12:13 AM
nomey nomey is offline
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Originally Posted by Knives&Guitars View Post
Really enjoyed this creation. Really sets a mood. Simplicity at its best!

Thanks so much, really appreciate it!
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  #20  
Old 12-02-2021, 03:33 PM
alohachris alohachris is offline
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Default Always AUDITION Vocal Mic's

Aloha Bonedigger,

ALWAYS AUDITION LIVE any kind of vocal mic, before you buy. Results are always voice-specific. There is no way around that fact, my friend. And online demo clips are very limited in the sonic information they provide, IMO. I feel strongly that you should never make a buying decision based on online recordings.

People seem to like the Warm mic's. To me, the company offers a line that's a step above the usual Chinese-made hyped & unbalanced mic's, that are within an affordable price range ($700).

I've heard the Warm WA-47 but not the 251. Even though every mic company appropriates the model numbers of the all-time great classic mic's to market their products, rare is the mic that even provides even a hint of the original. Again, that's why I feel it's important to live audition vocal mic's - before you buy, Bonedigger.

Warm's WA-47 sounded nothing like a classic Neumann U-47. I doubt the Warm 251 sounds that much like an original Soundelux Elux 251 either. That classic 60's LDC studio vocal mic was great on my voice. I mean, ABSOLUTELY GREAT! Just don't be swayed by the bogus copy-cat model numbers & casings. That's all about sales & marketing.

As a former high-end mic addict, I found that mic quality usually (not always, read below) improved dramatically as I went up the trough from the under $1K world. For vocal studio LDC mic's, there seemed to be a step up to better mic performance & quality when you spend around $2K+. There are several great choices. But I would not expect or consider any Warm LDC mic to be among them. Audition First!

Bonedigger, do some shoot-outs at home with 2-3 mic's or mic-pre combo's at a time. It's the only way to know & hear for sure the subtle sonic differences, & whether a given mic work's for your voice - or even the mic's build quality, off-axis detailing & performance, or where it puts your voice in a mix, etc. etc.

Why not do a shoot-out on your home rig with the Warm 251 & a Soundelux Elux 251 (used of course - no longer made) or even a $10K Telefunken ELA M251 if you can find one?

https://vintageking.com/soundelux-elux-251-0432-used

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IORPorYHP5Q

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...ser-microphone

Of course, you should probably keep your bass-heavy Shure SM7B, if it works well for your voice. But audition as many vocal LDC mic's as you can for comparison's sake. The Neumann U87ai variable pattern LDC is still the most popular studio LDC in the world, for good reason. Your SM7B is also one of the most popular vocal mic's ever (mostly for broadcast) & sounds great on many types of voices. Under $560 too! I'll bet it beats out the $700 WA-251 - on your voice.

Good Luck! Let Your Ears & Voice make the final decision on your vocal mic's, Bonedigger. Others' opinions or online recordings simply cannot do it as well or provide the real information you need. Audition.

alohachris

Last edited by alohachris; 12-02-2021 at 04:51 PM. Reason: more info was required
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  #21  
Old 12-02-2021, 05:04 PM
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KevWind KevWind is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alohachris View Post
Aloha Bonedigger,

ALWAYS AUDITION LIVE any kind of vocal mic, before you buy. Results are always voice-specific. There is no way around that fact, my friend. And online demo clips are very limited in the sonic information they provide, IMO. I feel strongly that you should never make a buying decision based on online recordings.

People seem to like the Warm mic's. To me, the company offers a line that's a step above the usual Chinese-made hyped & unbalanced mic's, that are within an affordable price range ($700).

I've heard the Warm WA-47 but not the 251. Even though every mic company appropriates the model numbers of the all-time great classic mic's to market their products, rare is the mic that even provides even a hint of the original. Again, that's why I feel it's important to live audition vocal mic's - before you buy, Bonedigger.

Warm's WA-47 sounded nothing like a classic Neumann U-47. I doubt the Warm 251 sounds that much like an original Soundelux Elux 251 either. That classic 60's LDC studio vocal mic was great on my voice. I mean, ABSOLUTELY GREAT! Just don't be swayed by the bogus copy-cat model numbers & casings. That's all about sales & marketing.

As a former high-end mic addict, I found that mic quality usually (not always, read below) improved dramatically as I went up the trough from the under $1K world. For vocal studio LDC mic's, there seemed to be a step up to better mic performance & quality when you spend around $2K+. There are several great choices. But I would not expect or consider any Warm LDC mic to be among them. Audition First!

Bonedigger, do some shoot-outs at home with 2-3 mic's or mic-pre combo's at a time. It's the only way to know & hear for sure the subtle sonic differences, & whether a given mic work's for your voice - or even the mic's build quality, off-axis detailing & performance, or where it puts your voice in a mix, etc. etc.

Why not do a shoot-out on your home rig with the Warm 251 & a Soundelux Elux 251 (used of course - no longer made) or even a $10K Telefunken ELA M251 if you can find one?

https://vintageking.com/soundelux-elux-251-0432-used

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IORPorYHP5Q

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...ser-microphone

Of course, you should probably keep your bass-heavy Shure SM7B, if it works well for your voice. But audition as many vocal LDC mic's as you can for comparison's sake. The Neumann U87ai variable pattern LDC is still the most popular studio LDC in the world, for good reason. Your SM7B is also one of the most popular vocal mic's ever (mostly for broadcast) & sounds great on many types of voices. Under $560 too! I'll bet it beats out the $700 WA-251 - on your voice.

Good Luck! Let Your Ears & Voice make the final decision on your vocal mic's, Bonedigger. Others' opinions or online recordings simply cannot do it as well or provide the real information you need. Audition.

alohachris
Chris I agree auditioning is by far best... But I thought I should clarify on thing (or maybe I am reading your post wrong ) But "the original" 60's 251 was an AKG built for Telefunken not a Soundelux the Soundelux Elux 251 was their take on the original Telefunken ELA M251 And was produced from 2000 to 2006 and is rumored to be the closest clone to the original (albeit the Bock 251 is still made and is from the same designer and company David Bock)
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Last edited by KevWind; 12-02-2021 at 05:23 PM.
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  #22  
Old 12-02-2021, 06:37 PM
jim1960 jim1960 is offline
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Originally Posted by KevWind View Post
(albeit the Bock 251 is still made and is from the same designer and company David Bock)
Bock was bought out by Universal Audio. There are no guarantees about anything moving forward although I did hear a big price increase is going to happen in 2022.
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2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce
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1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce

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  #23  
Old 12-03-2021, 09:56 AM
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Bock was bought out by Universal Audio. There are no guarantees about anything moving forward although I did hear a big price increase is going to happen in 2022.
Interesting currently on Sweetwater the Bock 251 is $6k
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  #24  
Old 12-03-2021, 03:56 PM
alohachris alohachris is offline
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Default Mahalo For Clarifying the History, Kev

Aloha Kev,

Howzit, my friend.

Thank you for clarifying the history & lineage of the 251 series. At this stage, my recall is not as sharp as it was & I don't trade mic's anymore.So I'd forgotten about that great mic's evolution. I owned a Soundelux Elux 251 briefly, not it's AKG-made predecessor. Sure sounded nice on my voice though..

And yes Jim1960, the Bock 251 is a nice sounding clone. That's a nice company, IMO.

But, what do you two AGF vets think about Warm mic's in general & their appropriation of the "251" or "47" model numbers in selling their mic's under $1000, Chinese-made "clone" - Ha! mic's. How do they sound compared to the originals. Any comparison at all? I was underwhelmed by their WA-47, even at that cheap price.

Whaddayathink, fellow great mic-afficionados?

I do swear by AUDITIONING MIC's & gear before you buy. Saves times, money & aggravation.

alohachris

Mahalo Kev & Jim!!!
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  #25  
Old 12-03-2021, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by alohachris View Post
Aloha Kev,

Howzit, my friend.

Thank you for clarifying the history & lineage of the 251 series. At this stage, my recall is not as sharp as it was & I don't trade mic's anymore.So I'd forgotten about that great mic's evolution. I owned a Soundelux Elux 251 briefly, not it's AKG-made predecessor. Sure sounded nice on my voice though..

And yes Jim1960, the Bock 251 is a nice sounding clone. That's a nice company, IMO.

But, what do you two AGF vets think about Warm mic's in general & their appropriation of the "251" or "47" model numbers in selling their mic's under $1000, Chinese-made "clone" - Ha! mic's. How do they sound compared to the originals. Any comparison at all? I was underwhelmed by their WA-47, even at that cheap price.

Whaddayathink, fellow great mic-afficionados?

I do swear by AUDITIONING MIC's & gear before you buy. Saves times, money & aggravation.

alohachris

Mahalo Kev & Jim!!!
I bet the Soundelux was great when I decided to look into a tube mic I had researched the 251 the 47 and 67 style offerings fairly extensively. Including the Bock.
But had only ever personally sung through a vintage U47 that was (just great) but for me too spendy ,, a Pearlman TM1 and another (escapes my memory just now ha)
My guy I have purchased most of my high end audio gear from suggested I come to his studio and audition some ADK Z Mods he had the 67 and 251 and I brought my Brauner Phantom V to compare all three . The 251 did sound slightly better on my voice ( it was close but noticeable, and enough that I was satisfied to purchase ).

I have never auditioned any Warm products so can't comment on performance.
As far as "appropriation" Personally I don't see it as an issue or any different then any other Mfg. that uses the those classic numbers in their model offerings
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  #26  
Old 12-03-2021, 05:03 PM
jim1960 jim1960 is offline
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Originally Posted by alohachris View Post
And yes Jim1960, the Bock 251 is a nice sounding clone. That's a nice company, IMO.

But, what do you two AGF vets think about Warm mic's in general & their appropriation of the "251" or "47" model numbers in selling their mic's under $1000, Chinese-made "clone" - Ha! mic's. How do they sound compared to the originals. Any comparison at all? I was underwhelmed by their WA-47, even at that cheap price.
From what I know and have observed, Warm products are hit or miss. Some are okay but some miss the mark and I have some concerns about corners that are cut in the process to keep the price down.

As for using the numbers of classic mics to name their own, I don't have a problem with it but I do have a problem calling any Warm products "clones" because they fall way short of that mark. That doesn't mean they're bad microphones; it just means that you can't, for example, pay $900 for a WA-47 and expect it to get the depth and breadth of sound you'd get from a vintage U47. You should expect it to be 47-ish and I think that's what Warm achieves, to varying extents, with their lineup.

There's a company out there called Signal Art Electronics. The owner, Chad Kelly, used to work for Warm and did the designs on a bunch of their early products. He left because he was uncomfortable with the corners being cut in order to reach a desired price point. He now offers upgrades to some Warm products to get them back to the quality level of his original designs. According to Chad, the early designs sounded a lot better than what the current lineup offers but the accountants felt the price had to be pushed downward and compromises were made and the tone suffered. From a business point of view, I can understand wanting to occupy a place in the market where you feel there's a hole (Warm clearly has been able to do that) but the gearhead in me hates the idea that a better quality product could have been offered and they chose to futz with the design to shave some dollars off the cost.

But here's the bottom line... mics don't have to be clones to work for anyone. Sure the WA-47 doesn't sound like an actual U47 but if the mic sounds good on the singer using it, that it falls short of the classic doesn't matter. A mic is usable or it isn't. That said, however, I do think ...and I've said this before... there are more solid choices out there, especially from some of the small boutique mic makers who are still doing small batches in their homes and don't have the overhead of a company like Warm. Overhead means dollars are diverted from the product to other things that don't land on our ears (in Warm's case, they advertise a lot more than most gear manufacturers and they have a HUGE factory/warehouse). But people will like what they like and if a Warm mic inspires someone to a better performance, that mic is doing its job.
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2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi
2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood
2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar
2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce
2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce
1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce

along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos.

YouTube

Last edited by jim1960; 12-04-2021 at 04:07 AM.
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