why do fingerboards get wider up the neck?

[KarenB]

Is there a technical reason for this?

[charles Tauber]

It is a result of players wanting the strings spaced further apart at the picking/plucking hand than at the fingering hand. The fingerboard, more or less, parallels the spacing of the strings.

[KarenB]

Thanks Charles. That makes sense.

[lar]

Which is 1 reason why a guitar can't be easily modified for wider string spacing - for example by cutting slots in the saddle. This could be done, but the strings wouldn't be parallel to the edges of the neck, resulting in less string-to-fretboard edge clearance, especially at the higher frets.

I suppose if you had a guitar with a wider nut than you like you could make a new nut with smaller string clearance, then slot the saddle. Might work but sure would look funny. And if you want wider string spacing at the bridge, you probably want the same thing at the nut anyway.

[mercy]

There are 2 reasons, in the past there was no and then later inadequate strengthening of the neck to counter the stress of the strings so the neck had to be as thick as possible. The second reason is that the saddle spread is wider than the neck width so the strings get wider. In order to keep the strings from pushing off the fretboard there is a minimum amount of board required. Martin has finally realized that a neck with a modern truss rod doesnt need that girth so they now have a modern neck that is thinner in both width and height. Ive been playing a neck like that for years before Martin came out with it and it makes for faster, easier playing.

[KarenB]

Originally Posted by mercy

Martin has finally realized that a neck with a modern truss rod doesnt need that girth so they now have a modern neck that is thinner in both width and height. Ive been playing a neck like that for years before Martin came out with it and it makes for faster, easier playing.

So Mercy, what's the guitar you've been playing?

[Alan Carruth]

Strummed instruments, such as mountain dulcimers, don't need to have the wider spacing at the picking end, and often don't have tapered fingerboards. I've seen pictures of early citterns with non-tapered necks, too, so it's not just that the neck needs taper for structural reasons.

Those old citterns had some things that guitars and lutes of the time didn't have: wire strings, and metal frets. The frets are because of the hard strings, of course; the usual tied gut frets would not hold up. But it's hard to get tied frets tight on a neck that's not tapered, so I suspect that's one reason necks were tapered in the first place. Tied frets had the advantage that you could adjust them a bit to match the temperament of the keyboard or harp you were playing along with, or just to get things sweeter in different keys. With a jangle of doubled courses on a strummed cittern precise intonation may not have mattered as much. Once you had an instrument with wider string spacing at the bridge end it became easier to pluck individual strings, and new styles of playing could be devised. Maybe we don't use that type of cittern any more because it was not usable for the more 'modern' ways of playing.

These things are products of a form of evolution. They tend to adapt over time to suit new demands, but are limited (or enabled) by the features they already have. Those features can suggest other uses that lead in new directions, or foreclose further development along certain lines.

[mercy]

karen, it is a custom built by a single builder

[lar]

Originally Posted by Alan Carruth

tied gut frets

Tied frets - what an interesting concept. You can intonate each fret individually by sliding it up/down the neck. No need for a compensated saddle or nut.

I'm going to call Martin and see if they will make me a custom.

https://www.google.com/search?q=tied...iQtQWLy5-QDg20

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by lar

Tied frets - what an interesting concept. You can intonate each fret individually by sliding it up/down the neck. No need for a compensated saddle or nut.

I'm going to call Martin and see if they will make me a custom.

There is a very good reason that tied frets became obsolete and replaced by fixed frets. Lute makers and players tried just about everything to obtain "better" intonation: they well understood the issues. Tied frets offer no practical advantages. They only offer "another variable" one can adjust with no practical improvement. You could slide the frets to and fro, and angle them, to improve playing in specific keys, but if you changed to a significantly different key, you'd have to do it all again for the new key: you spend as much time moving the frets around, in the pursuit of "better", than playing.

If one really wanted to go to the bottom of that blind rabbit hole, The True Temperament system, with its wavy metal frets, eliminates the limitations of a straight-line fret - such as a tied piece of gut or nylon - to alter the "stopping" position for each string at each fret. It will take one all the way to the full implementation of the approach, both to achieve its advantages and its limitations.



As the old joke goes, lute players spend half of their time playing and the other half tuning.

[Bruce Sexauer]

Another reason why is that as the action gets higher going up the neck the fingers must push more deeply between adjacent strings and more spacing is needed to play cleanly.

[Alan Carruth]

Higher action is one reason classical guitars have wider necks than steel strings.

It was said that if a lute player lived to be eighty years old, they would spend sixty years tuning and fifteen getting the instrument repaired.

[KarenB]

Originally Posted by Bruce Sexauer

Another reason why is that as the action gets higher going up the neck the fingers must push more deeply between adjacent strings and more spacing is needed to play cleanly.

Thanks Bruce.

[TJN]

I liked Charles Tauber's first response . . . I'm going with that.

[Bruce Sexauer]

Originally Posted by TJN

I liked Charles Tauber's first response . . . I'm going with that.

This is not a case where one person’s information is more correct than another’s.