Strat trem questions

[Jimi2]

So my main electric is a strat -my first and only. Had it set up at a shop and they floated the trem, which I actually love since I can pull up or even just push the bridge down with my hand while fingerpicking for a little texture. No real problem with tuning stability. However, I would like to be able to change tunings and string gauges now and then....I had assumed this would be hugely problematic with a floating trem, as string tension would be all out of whack. However, guys that set it up tuned me down a half step without my asking....I’ve since tuned up to standard with no problems. Surprisingly, as I just tried going into drop d and couldn’t get all the strings tuned right at the same time. So, what about different strings? I’d like to go just a little bit heavier from 10s, but only on the wound strings. Should this be doable? Can anyone help me understand what’s going on here better?

[Paleolith54]

Originally Posted by Jimi2

So my main electric is a strat -my first and only. Had it set up at a shop and they floated the trem, which I actually love since I can pull up or even just push the bridge down with my hand while fingerpicking for a little texture. No real problem with tuning stability. However, I would like to be able to change tunings and string gauges now and then....I had assumed this would be hugely problematic with a floating trem, as string tension would be all out of whack. However, guys that set it up tuned me down a half step without my asking....I’ve since tuned up to standard with no problems. Surprisingly, as I just tried going into drop d and couldn’t get all the strings tuned right at the same time. So, what about different strings? I’d like to go just a little bit heavier from 10s, but only on the wound strings. Should this be doable? Can anyone help me understand what’s going on here better?

Simple. Changes in the tension of a string affect the tension, therefore tuning, of the others. It’s more noticeable with a trem, even more with a floating one. You really have to tune, check, tweak, check, maybe tweak again. It’s not really that big a deal, you’ll get used to it.

[pieterh]

As Paleolith54 says it is often just a question of bringing up to tension, tuning, adjusting, tuning etc.

The whammy springs are hooked on to a plate in the spring cavity which can be adjusted to compensate for increased pull by the strings. At some point that isn’t going to be enough though and you may need to add a spring!

I have an Ibanez RG that needed a fourth spring when I changed from .009s to .010s! It didn’t suit the guitar though so I quickly reverted to .009s.

My son’s PRS SE is strung with .009s from the factory and came with an extra spring, I assume to prepare for players who want to use higher gauge strings.

[Paleolith54]

Originally Posted by Paleolith54

Simple. Changes in the tension of a string affect the tension, therefore tuning, of the others. It’s more noticeable with a trem, even more with a floating one. You really have to tune, check, tweak, check, maybe tweak again. It’s not really that big a deal, you’ll get used to it.

Also, if you "deck" the trem (Google it, basically adjusting to be flush with the deck) the problem disappears for all practical purposes.

[Jimi2]

Originally Posted by Paleolith54

Also, if you "deck" the trem (Google it, basically adjusting to be flush with the deck) the problem disappears for all practical purposes.

Right. Yeah, I’d rather keep it floating. I have another electric I can keep for alternate tunings if need be....went through several “tune, check, tweak” cycles trying to get into an open tuning on the strat and still wasn’t quite getting there but I guess it’ll just take a while. But as long as I can put some different gauge strings on I’ll be fine.

[FrankHudson]

Yes alt tunings on a Strat floating trem are an annoying combination, and as already mentioned, you deal by lots of going back and forth checking each string more than once as their tensions interact markedly. So, if going in and out of alt tunings is regular thing for you, I wouldn't advise the common floating trem Stratocaster as your guitar. On the other hand, if you always or nearly always play a half-step down or drop D, it's not a big deal.

Changing string tension in other ways (like down-tuning a step or half-step) or changing string gauges can also impact the floating trem, changing action height. If you like the way your Strat trem feels now and want to change string tension, measure the back of your bridge plate's gap exactly, then change your strings, and then using the claw in the spring cavity, restore the gap to the same as it was before you made the change.

There are devices that attempt to mitigate some of these issues with the standard Strat setup, for example the Tremsetter. Other players just live with it and accept the annoyances because the other things they like about the Strat's trem outweigh the little hassles.

If for some reason you want to go with a heavier bottom/lighter top set of strings, this is a common variation sold by most of the major electric string brands.

[Jimi2]

Originally Posted by FrankHudson

Yes alt tunings on a Strat floating trem are an annoying combination, and as already mentioned, you deal by lots of going back and forth checking each string more than once as their tensions interact markedly. So, if going in and out of alt tunings is regular thing for you, I wouldn't advise the common floating trem Stratocaster as your guitar. On the other hand, if you always or nearly always play a half-step down or drop D, it's not a big deal.

Changing string tension in other ways (like down-tuning a step or half-step) or changing string gauges can also impact the floating trem, changing action height. If you like the way your Strat trem feels now and want to change string tension, measure the back of your bridge plate's gap exactly, then change your strings, and then using the claw in the spring cavity, restore the gap to the same as it was before you made the change.

There are devices that attempt to mitigate some of these issues with the standard Strat setup, for example the Tremsetter. Other players just live with it and accept the annoyances because the other things they like about the Strat's trem outweigh the little hassles.

If for some reason you want to go with a heavier bottom/lighter top set of strings, this is a common variation sold by most of the major electric string brands.

Thanks. Just swapped out my 10-46s for 10-48s. Did take a while to get everything in tune, but I’m good to go now. Definitely gonna use my old SG for open tunings I think.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Paleolith54

...if you "deck" the trem (Google it, basically adjusting to be flush with the deck) the problem disappears for all practical purposes.

In pre-Floyd days it used to be called the "Van Halen mod" (as in the late EVH) and IME it not only offers increased tuning stability but increases sustain (and lends a nice natural reverb) thanks to the coupling with the body; FWIW last time I went to my semi-local GC all their Strats (regardless of price) were set up this way - as they were in Leo's day - so apparently players are catching onto the advantages of a semi-fixed tailpiece...

[Pnewsom]

There is a way you might be able to have you Trem work well and also be able to to retune to alternate turnings quickly. Provided that your alternate tunings only involve lowering the tension, such as a drop D tuning, and that you are ok with only being able to Trem down in pitch, but not up.

It is based on the Balanced Trem set up method, where the springs are adjusted to balance the tension of the strings.

The typical way of doing this set up involves blocking the Trem to the desired height above the body using a wedge(one side of a wooden clothes pin works), placed between the back of bridge plate and the body. The springs(two springs), one on each end of the block are over-tightened so that the wedge is held firmly by spring tension. The guitar is then tuned to pitch and the block is removed.

Because the springs were over tensioned the guitar should then go out of tune(sharp). While using a tuner, use a screw driver to loosen the springs on each side until the guitar returns to pitch for both E strings. The Trem is now balanced and will normally return to pitch after wiggling the whammy bar.

However in your case, you could set the Trem height so that it's balanced just barely touching the body with the guitar tuned to standard. Dropping string tension with alternate tunings shouldn't cause a problem because the body prevents the Trem from moving down. It also helps keep the guitar in tune if you break a string in the middle of a song.

Sounds more complicated than it is.