Upgrading from Scarlett 2i2

[verstft]

I don't need more inputs but the headphones amp output is quite weak and it's not strong enough to drive my 250ohms DT880 Pro headphones.

Rather than get a headphone amp, maybe I could upgrade my interface. Any recommendations?

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by verstft

I don't need more inputs but the headphones amp output is quite weak and it's not strong enough to drive my 250ohms DT880 Pro headphones.

Rather than get a headphone amp, maybe I could upgrade my interface. Any recommendations?

Something from RME perhaps - Babyface or some other of their larger units.

[Xtremca]

If you are monitoring direct from the interface signal, then you may need to get a headphone amp. If you monitor back through your DAW via the interface, then you should be able to get much more volume. I believe the interface source monitor out is designed to prevent clipping so it's not a high output out. I use a focusrite saffire 6 and if I'm monitoring what is coming from the interface, it's hard to hear over my own vocals. If I click monitor in my DAW, which feeds back to the Saffire, then I can boost it to level that I can drown myself out.

Chris

[sdelsolray]

Originally Posted by verstft

I don't need more inputs but the headphones amp output is quite weak and it's not strong enough to drive my 250ohms DT880 Pro headphones.

Rather than get a headphone amp, maybe I could upgrade my interface. Any recommendations?

The headphones cost more than the interface. Talk about the tail wagging the dog. And good luck getting meaningful specs on the headphone amps in interfaces, even expensive interfaces. A headphone impedance of 250 Ohm is difficult. Even if you have a more "powerful" headphone amp, an impedance mismatch can still occur, rendering an inaccurate frequency playback.

Perhaps you could sell the headphones and get a pair with lower impedance.

[philjs]

Originally Posted by verstft

I don't need more inputs but the headphones amp output is quite weak and it's not strong enough to drive my 250ohms DT880 Pro headphones. Rather than get a headphone amp, maybe I could upgrade my interface. Any recommendations?

I have two pairs of the 80 ohm DT770 Pro headphones for tracking and have no problem driving the pair of them (on a 25' headphone extension cable (!), as well as a pair of AKG 240s mixing phones) with a Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 (which has a pair of headphone outs but likely has the exact same amp circuit as your 2i2). I think the problem is not your interface but the high impedance of your headphones...

Still, if you're happy with the phones and the mic pres in the 2i2 you might try something like the Presonus HP4 which is pretty cheap but would, I'm sure, solve your volume issue.

Phil

[verstft]

Thanks for the advice everybody.

The headphones cost more than the interface.

Well I'm slowly upgrading my rig. I'm recording solo fingerstyle on an OM28V with a matched pair of MC 930's. I'm mixing through good quality speakers and heaphones. I would rather start upgrading all my components rather than downgrade my heaphones to the weakest link whatever that may be. (I believe my Scarlett might be the weakest link right now..I think)

A headphone impedance of 250 Ohm is difficult. Even if you have a more "powerful" headphone amp, an impedance mismatch can still occur, rendering an inaccurate frequency playback.

They seem to be a popular choice for mixing and tracking, so surely there's got to be a way to make it work...maybe not with my current setup.

Something from RME perhaps - Babyface or some other of their larger units.

RME seems to have really good price to quality ratio. I would definitely consider upgrading to a RME interface if that made sense. Searching the forum, Apogee pres seem to get high praises as well. Thoughts?

Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 (which has a pair of headphone outs but likely has the exact same amp circuit as your 2i2)

When I bought my 2i2 I was under that same impression. That even though the interface was budget minded, the pres were similar to the higher end units. The 6i8 and up pres have more gain than the 2i2 so that might not be entirely true.

If you monitor back through your DAW via the interface, then you should be able to get much more volume.

I can indeed boost the master during playback but while my levels show they are clipping, the volume from the headphone are surprisingly low (it's workable, but not ideal). Doing a little searching on the internet, revealed I'm not alone. The 2i2 headphone output seems to have a reputation for being a little weak.

You might try something like the Presonus HP4

Where would something like this or another headphone amp fit in my signal chain. The Scarlett only has TRS outputs on the back and that's going to my monitors.

[philjs]

Originally Posted by verstft

When I bought my 2i2 I was under that same impression. That even though the interface was budget minded, the pres were similar to the higher end units. The 6i8 and up pres have more gain than the 2i2 so that might not be entirely true.

I was actually referring to the headphone amp circuit, not the mic preamps.

Originally Posted by verstft

Where would something like this or another headphone amp fit in my signal chain. The Scarlett only has TRS outputs on the back and that's going to my monitors.

The HP4 takes its input from those monitor mains then has "through" output connections to your monitors (see the media page for photos of the front and back panels of the HP4). There's also a monitor gain control (which might seem redundant but the monitor gain on your 2i2 would set the input gain to the HP4) AND a mute (bypass) switch for the monitors (so you can hardware switch the monitors off when tracking) as well as individual level controls for up to 4 sets of phones.

Phil

[Rick Shepherd]

The Presonus HP4 is a great little headphone amp, and very versatile.

[verstft]

The Presonus HP4 does sound really useful! I get an amp, additional headphone outputs and a cut off switch for my speakers. Oh..and a mono switch to check the phasing of stereo tracks.

"through" output connections to your monitors

Its this fairly transparent or will it affect the signal going to my speakers?

[Rick Shepherd]

There is no compromise in the signal, no worries. The monitor mute button comes in very handy. However, I now use a different passive headphone amp that is very good, a SM Pro Audio M-Patch 2 Passive Volume Control/Switch Box

[philjs]

Originally Posted by verstft

The Presonus HP4 does sound really useful! I get an amp, additional headphone outputs and a cut off switch for my speakers. Oh..and a mono switch to check the phasing of stereo tracks.

I think the mono switch is actually intended for the headphone mix while tracking. If you're like most people then you start panning/mixing as you go. The problem is that many people like to track with only one side of a headphone set so the mono switch makes sure that they hear the entire track in that ear, not just the left or right side (as the case may be).

The HP4 is a great little headphone amp. You can also connect multiple units in series...if you ever need more than 4 sets of phones, you can just add another HP4 with only the last unit in the chain connected to your monitors. And each is unit is just 1/3 of a rack space so putting three of them together gives you 12 sets of phones in a 1U space.

Phil

[ukejon]

You might try an Apogee Duet 2. Gorgeous headphone tone.

[dneal]

I'll make it easy. Objective 2 headphone amp. I have one, and it does what it says. I drive BeyerDynamic DT880 Pro's off of it.

This was designed by an engineer who put his money where his mouth was, and angered a lot of "audiophiles" in the process. The plans, parts list and directions are free; if you don't want to buy the JDS Labs version.

Some background with a recent article: NWAVGUY, the audio genius who vanished

and

NWAVGUY's blog, which describes the what's and why's.

[ukejon]

As you suggest in your earlier comments, I think the key question for you is this: "Is it logical to amplify what may well be the weakest link in my signal chain?"

[verstft]

As you suggest in your earlier comments, I think the key question for you is this: "Is it logical to amplify what may well be the weakest link in my signal chain?"

Are the pres and conversion in Apogee and RME hardware really that much better than my 2i2?

I realize my " headphone output is too low, get a new interface" logic is a bit weird. But thinking of my setup as a whole, investing over $100 for a H/P amp when I could put that money toward a better interface that wouldn't have a weak headphone output almost makes sense.

Sounds like I'm going to need an amp if I keep my cans regardless. So this might be a moot point.