What don't you like about Taylor's ES2?

[Guitarplayer_PR]

Originally Posted by Taylor Ham

After doing a setup on my late 2018 324ce, I visited a local shop to activate the pickup. (backed off the sensors to take saddle out) Got a fresh battery, but don't remember the exact fishman amp played thru.

The ES2 sounded very natural and dynamic, and the tone controls were also satisfactory. Less crunchy sounding than some piezos I've heard.

So, I hear some hate it. That leaves me wondering if it's an issue with earlier variants, and how much better a pickup can get. To me, it was fairly transparent.

IMO, they're much better than many people give them credit for. The key is to actually know how to EQ it.

[mesquivel]

Originally Posted by Guitarplayer_PR

IMO, they're much better than many people give them credit for. The key is to actually know how to EQ it.

Exactly, that is the difference maker. I always reduce around the 700 frequency and that makes the ES2 sound very natural. Honestly I do that with most any pickup system and it always improves any pickup system.

[ataylor]

My dislikes are purely cosmetic. I don't like the visible artifacts of the pickup system in the bridge that look like screws. And Taylor's three-knob control setup, while elegant a couple decades ago compared to the "barn door" alternatives, is starting to feel a little long in the tooth compared to less-intrusive controls that other pickup systems hide under the soundhole.

[jonfields45]

I think an active K&K Mini like system would be less invasive, no extra holes in the bridge, not in the way of bridge saddle replacement/adjustment, easily removed when obsolete, but not unique enough to satisfy Taylor marketing.

As an EE I dislike all Taylor ES systems for their reliance on relatively high power consumption op amps. They don't get better battery life than an Aura! A discrete design could easily achieve 200+ hours for that level of simple EQ.

[fazool]

Originally Posted by JenniO

...
Ask any sound tech at a church (usually that’s where most Taylors are played) .....

I'm not a big fan of the ES2 and don't disagree with much of what you've written. But the above statement is an absurdity. Taylor ships hundreds of thousands of guitars and you claim most of them are played at a church?

[fuman]

Originally Posted by Shades of Blue

The only thing I don't like about the ES2 is the fact that you pretty much have to have the ES2. I don't like having the holes drilled in the guitar in case you decide you want to go with a different system. Give me an LR Baggs unit any day of the week so that I can swap out systems as I see fit...

I also don't like the fact that if the guitar doesn't have an ES2, resale value plummets.

These points seem to contradict one another; maybe the win-win solution is to buy a devalued Taylor used, without the ES2

[AVTaylor83]

I've tried a variety of pickups in my Taylors over the years...the Fishman barndoor, Fishman Matrix Infinity, Baggs Anthem, and K&K Pure Mini.

My current Taylor has the ES2, and I was skeptical of the ES2 after my disappointment with their move to the ES1 years ago (I do not like magnetic pickups). So I avoided getting new Taylors with the ES built in for several years.

I took a chance with my 514ce LTD and discovered that I really liked the ES2 system. Is it perfect? No. But it blew away the Fishman Matrix Infinity in my other Taylor, which had become my standard for years.

I find the ES2 easier to get dialed in. It cuts through really well, and I hear less quack than a typical ust. While many swear by the K&K Pure Mini, I found I had to go more out of my way to dial in a decent sound with it. I also noticed the string volume on my low and high E strings were lower than the rest, and that always bothered me as well. I feel like with the ES2 I can get the body that I did with the Pure Mini...but with less tweaking and better string balance.

Would it be nice to have more 'air' underneath the ES2? Of course, but so far it's the best single-source pickup I've ever used. And if Taylor finds a way to improve upon it, they will make it fit the current set-up similar to what they did with the ES1.

[Taylor Ham]

Good replies. I'm currently building a small 12 string, which I am putting a K&K mini into. I have heard good things about that system when used properly, so I'm excited to hear it in addition to the acoustic product. If I made any recommendations to Taylor, it'd probably be like what was said above: put in a K&K like system. It's probably lighter than the ES2 sensors, while still leaving the saddle alone. I get that it doesnt give you the most control, but it seems like a very good, unobstrusive starting point.

[mesquivel]

I find the ES2 easier to get dialed in. It cuts through really well, and I hear less quack than a typical ust. While many swear by the K&K Pure Mini, I found I had to go more out of my way to dial in a decent sound with it. I also noticed the string volume on my low and high E strings were lower than the rest, and that always bothered me as well. I feel like with the ES2 I can get the body that I did with the Pure Mini...but with less tweaking and better string balance.

Would it be nice to have more 'air' underneath the ES2? Of course, but so far it's the best single-source pickup I've ever used. And if Taylor finds a way to improve upon it, they will make it fit the current set-up similar to what they did with the ES1.[/QUOTE]

This is spot on, I agree with this 100% and have experienced the same thing in my Taylors. I would like for Taylor to add a mic to the ES2 system and make it possible for the end user to install it themselves if they already have the ES2 in there guitar. That to me would make it perfect. Just my opinion.

[Br1ck]

I've had to deal with scores of ES2 pickups back in the good old days at an open mic. They work competently, every time. That is once people learn about the LED battery light. Not my favorite pickup, but such a known quantity you can always make them sound ok. The biggest problem is with the knob twidlers who can't seem to leave them alone.

Not nearly as bad as K&Ks with no preamp, or the typical $400 guitar pickup system. The best plug and play is a friend's Cole Clark.

[jklotz]

Originally Posted by Br1ck

I've had to deal with scores of ES2 pickups back in the good old days at an open mic. They work competently, every time. That is once people learn about the LED battery light. Not my favorite pickup, but such a known quantity you can always make them sound ok. The biggest problem is with the knob twidlers who can't seem to leave them alone.

Not nearly as bad as K&Ks with no preamp, or the typical $400 guitar pickup system. The best plug and play is a friend's Cole Clark.

I take it you are a sound man? This kind of illustrates my point made earlier. Best pickup out there? No. A work horse that gets the job done every time? Yes. I have a guitar with a K&K pure mini in it. I wouln't dream of handing a cable straight out of it to a sound guy. It absolutely needs a significant amount of EQ and a preamp to sound decent, and most of the sound guys I have come across would prefer to be mixing Metalica and have no idea what a decent acoustic amplified sound is. They aren't expecting an acoustic signal that needs 12 db of bass cut and 10 db of treble boost. If they are any good, they'll figure it our half way through the set. My point being it works in a real world setting with the least amount of surprises or hassle. And that helps to retain the audiences attention. As a working musician, I appreciate that.

Unfortunately, knob twiddlers are going to screw up any system, not just the ES2. The Cole Clarks have a great pickup system, but you ever play one of those things acoustically? I did. I bought a used one. Returned it the next day. I'd take an off the rack plywood Ibenez, or ever a Cort over that thing. It sounded like a toy guitar. Granted, plugged in, it was really nice. I suppose if you can afford to have a guitar that you only use for live, it might be a good solution.

[varmonter]

I dont have anything specific
I dislike about the es2.
I've heard them sound pretty good.
Ive heard them sound pretty bad.
I guess I would rather pick my own system. I prefer passive pickups.
And all my gear outboard.
But that's me..

[JimAltendahl]

My issue with the ES2 is that it accentuates a variety of string noises that interfere with the otherwise nice tones that the pickup is producing. I am a fingerpicker that uses my fingernails when picking. The ES2 tends to really amplify the unwanted string noises caused by: my nails clicking on the string, my nails scraping down the winding of the strings, and an overall string-ping noise produced on the G and D strings. I know that these noises are part of the sound of an acoustic guitar, but the ES2 seems to accentuate them to the point of being distracting. I've resorted to using a parametric EQ to try to notch out some of the most offending frequencies, but the frequencies change with the string and fretted position. Also, please don't state the obvious technique fix, I've tried about everything and the noises are just to prominent. I'm at the point where I don't believe the ES2 is a good fit for my playing style. Perhaps it would be great for a strummer or someone who doesn't use nails.

[Br1ck]

I just do sound at an open mic a lot. ES 2s are a known to me at this point. Easy to deal with and they sound fine. My problem is with people wanting more guitar volume in their monitors so the turn up at the guitar instead of asking for more monitor volume. This after I ask folks if they have enough monitor. Maybe they just don't understand how is effects the house mix.

The worst by far are K&K owners who don't own a preamp. We finally had SunnAudio make us a custom blender DI and we run everything but ES 2s through it. We have a separate channel EQ'd for Taylors. We had one regular whose friend was a purported pro sound guy he would want to mix for him. It always sounded bad.

But really, the ES 2s always sound good through our QSCs. Not as good as Dazzos IMHO, but as a one system for all uses, pretty darn good, and I would not want Dazzos in a loud band scenario, were you can get the Tayors to work.

[euraquilo]

Originally Posted by Steeltoe

I wish Taylor would make more acoustic guitars. ..

Funny - I currently own three Taylor guitars and none of them came with an ES pickup system of any kind. The 314 I just purchased has the UltraTonic pickup in it. My GC3 has no pickup whatsoever. I always buy used and prefer to buy guitars with no pickup unless it's something like the UltraTonic that I know is better than average.

My GC7 has a Fishman Matrix that I want to remove for something better (and something that doesn't require a battery inside the body). The shop I take my guitars to tried to discourage me from removing it, saying it's a decent pickup, which it may be. But I have a number of better pickups on my shelf, adn I've been itching to try the Dazzo, too.

Dan