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Old 09-19-2023, 11:47 AM
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Default Car shopping....what a zoo

I paid off the lease on my 2020 Accord a few weeks back and have tons of equity in it, and have been sniffing around a bit...some of the exchanges I've had were just outright bizarre, and lease prices have pretty much doubled in the last three years - some cases more than that.

I've had a couple instances where the salesman quoted me one time pay lease prices that were more than paying it over time - which makes no sense at all to me during this time of higher rates on simple investments like CD's.

As most of you know I've never driven anything but Hondas for 45 years but have been looking at other brands a little bit.

I never thought of myself in an SUV or a Buick, but the new Envista looks like a pretty cool ride.

Haven't seen one in person yet - I know they are smaller, but I don't need much.

Not your Grampa's Buick...and they are built in Korea and China, so that's a consideration too.
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Old 09-19-2023, 11:51 AM
Dirk Hofman Dirk Hofman is offline
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We bought recently. Most of the popular cars we were interested in were marked up $5000-$8000 over MSRP. Ridiculous. We found one that wasn't which we liked a ton, but agree, "zoo" is the right word for it. Crazy out there...
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Old 09-19-2023, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Dirk Hofman View Post
"zoo" is the right word for it. Crazy out there...
I called and inquired about a car at a dealer about 30 miles from me the other day. I got a call back and they told me it had just come off the truck, I couldn't drive it yet because it hadn't been inspected, but I could come look at it.

I got there, and the salesman didn't know the difference in the trim levels, and the one that came in was the base trim. I was VERY specific about what car I was interested in. Then when I asked for a quote on the 3 year one time pay lease on the car that was supposed to be there, it was 2000.00 over what I was already braced for.

I just laughed and walked away.

The more I experience, the more I think I'll be driving my ultra clean, low mileage Accord for a while yet.
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Last edited by fitness1; 09-19-2023 at 12:32 PM.
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Old 09-19-2023, 12:45 PM
Steve DeRosa Steve DeRosa is offline
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Think shopping for a car today is a zoo - think back to the '60s-70s:
  • AMC Eagle, Hornet (rights assumed by Chrysler after buyout of AMC)
  • Buick Wildcat
  • Chevrolet Impala, Stingray (FYI the Camaro was originally going to be called the Panther - at least one prototype exists with that badge)
  • Dodge Super Bee
  • Ford Bronco, Maverick, Mustang
  • Mercury Cougar
  • Plymouth Barracuda, Road Runner
  • Shelby Cobra
  • Sunbeam Tiger
- and who can forget the VW Rabbit...
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Old 09-19-2023, 01:06 PM
Earl49 Earl49 is offline
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I feel sorry for anyone shopping right now. With a 2016 F150 and a 2019 Forester, we are probably out of the new car market for the rest of my days. I've never felt the need to have the "latest and greatest". We typically buy new and keep for 12-14 years / 150,000 miles, with good maintenance and no abuse. The only exception would be an accident that forces us to replace something. [knock on wood]
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Old 09-19-2023, 01:11 PM
imwjl imwjl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitness1 View Post
I paid off the lease on my 2020 Accord a few weeks back and have tons of equity in it, and have been sniffing around a bit...some of the exchanges I've had were just outright bizarre, and lease prices have pretty much doubled in the last three years - some cases more than that.

I've had a couple instances where the salesman quoted me one time pay lease prices that were more than paying it over time - which makes no sense at all to me during this time of higher rates on simple investments like CD's.

As most of you know I've never driven anything but Hondas for 45 years but have been looking at other brands a little bit.

I never thought of myself in an SUV or a Buick, but the new Envista looks like a pretty cool ride.

Haven't seen one in person yet - I know they are smaller, but I don't need much.

Not your Grampa's Buick...and they are built in Korea and China, so that's a consideration too.
A neighbor has been very happy with her Chinese Buicks and like you leasing pointed out she doesn't much care how good it is in the long haul because she won't own it. I don't know how they rank for safety.

We just put the buy idea to bed again but the recent shopping found lots of vehicles and brands where it is becoming a buyer's market again. There are exceptions with a few really popular and/or constrained models.

Nothing financed that we'd want to own looked very appealing because beyond interest rates, the deals are not on models with the best reputations.

It is an Acura vs Honda but same financing and components so one family member in your situation with an Acura will just keep it.

Part of our putting off a purchase is a gasoline powered vehicle with significant warrant left and wanting the convenience and performance of an EV. You are really close to some new models coming out.

It would be a little older time frame than your Accord but my pal who got a Model 3 for slightly more than his wife's loaded Accord now has the lower cost and more reliable vehicle. In the I think 2017/18 to now the Model 3 has only consumed tires. In same time the Accord has consumed brakes, belts, oil changes and a water pump costing around 5x more to move.

Some friends who don't drive a real lot got the Bolt EUV and love it. Chevy has new ones about to or maybe ship should you be looking at the Buick. One is from your state and with some understandable pride wanted what was made where they grew up vs China.

My own hope is tomorrow's appointment for water pump in an 8 year old car with new tires gets us 1-2 years into a changed market while our other one still has new car warranty.

I get excited about autos but every year of life gets me less excited about spending money on them.
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Old 09-19-2023, 01:25 PM
imwjl imwjl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve DeRosa View Post
Think shopping for a car today is a zoo - think back to the '60s-70s:
  • AMC Eagle, Hornet (rights assumed by Chrysler after buyout of AMC)
  • Buick Wildcat
  • Chevrolet Impala, Stingray (FYI the Camaro was originally going to be called the Panther - at least one prototype exists with that badge)
  • Dodge Super Bee
  • Ford Bronco, Maverick, Mustang
  • Mercury Cougar
  • Plymouth Barracuda, Road Runner
  • Shelby Cobra
  • Sunbeam Tiger
- and who can forget the VW Rabbit...
That's the peak of the WWII era vets' good work right into the malaise era where a few of my purchases explained if hell exists, it is for any auto exec and assembler who worked in those times. I think most of the world always knew a Rabbit was a Golf and while not perfect, they didn't sit at top of best seller's list for decades from being total junk.

I thoroughly enjoy some of the Rare & Classic Cars YouTube guy analysis of some of the best and worst but to a big extent analysis of some 1960s stuff that really was world's best.

For the Cougar, I often thought the the Canadian Ford/Mercury mashups were neat and at times better than some of the US brands but in all fairness, chasing after cheese elegance was a 1960s and 70s thing and Mercury did that.
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Old 09-19-2023, 01:40 PM
frazervalley frazervalley is offline
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I bought a 2021 Honda Accord Sport 2.0T a year ago, it had 10k miles on it and looked new. Love the car. Fun to drive, spacious, handles well, seats four comfortably, great ergonomics with an attractive Honda interior with very good sight lines. It has a large trunk and is surprisingly quick, though I tend to drive very conservatively.

I traded in my BMW 3 series. Great car, but it was six years old and i knew it was only a matter of time before expensive maintenance would be required.

I am a “car guy” and my vehicles are pampered, garaged, washed, detailed and maintained as per the factory maintenance schedule. For example, I never drove my BMW in the rain, as I have another vehicle as a daily driver, which is nineteen years old. Yes, it is treated the same, except I drive it even if it’s raining or snowing. It is a Toyota 4Runner, V8, full-time four wheel drive with very low mileage, never been off-road, never towed, no accidents and it will likely outlive me.

The point of all this is, I buy quality made vehicles, pamper them and I have practically zero problems with them. This works for me and as a bonus, I always get compliments on how they look by other car guys. For example, one of my new neighbours approached me a few years ago and said “cool, did you get a new truck?” I said no, I bought this SUV fourteen years ago. He did not believe me, so I reached into the glove compartment and showed him the registration. He was stunned. He said do you drive it? I said yes, it’s my daily driver, my “toy” car is in the garage. We still laugh about this conversation.

I do many months of research before I purchase a vehicle, because I will likely keep it for many years - I am a car guy. I am a fan of German and Japanese automobiles. But at this point in my life, I don’t want to spend the kind of money required for another BMW.

Check the reliability of cars before you consider them for purchase. I look at Consumer Reports Magazine, online car forums, car reviews, and YouTube videos posted by owners who are past the honeymoon period. I avoid the first two or three years of a new model. This gives the manufacturers time to correct any problems. In Consumer Reports Used Car editions, for example, you can see which manufacturers quickly address a problem and the ones that let them linger for years unresolved.

Good luck on your search.
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  #9  
Old 09-19-2023, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frazervalley View Post
I bought a 2021 Honda Accord Sport 2.0T a year ago, it had 10k miles on it and looked new. Love the car. Fun to drive, spacious, handles well, seats four comfortably, great ergonomics with an attractive Honda interior with very good sight lines. It has a large trunk and is surprisingly quick, though I tend to drive very conservatively.

.
I definitely love my Accord - this is about the 8th or 9th one with the same amount of Civics and one Acura Integra. They pretty much do everything well for a very fair price.

That said, the new design of the Accord and Civic don't really do anything for me - even the interiors have become kind of industrial looking - compared to the elegant interior of the '20.

They are still number one in their categories according to Car and Driver though I may end up with a new Civic hatchback Sport.
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Old 09-19-2023, 04:42 PM
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I spent two days in the nearby big town a week ago getting my first new (to me)
car since 2005...



-Mike "2015 R58 coupe"
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Old 09-19-2023, 05:02 PM
6L6 6L6 is offline
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I've owned far fewer cars during my 77 year lifetime than most folks. The biggest reason is I had higher priorities (family) for my money than cars (although I do consider myself a "car guy").

But when I do buy a car I usually buy something high end that I really like and then drive it for 15 to 20 years. I rarely log less than 150,000 to 200,000 miles before selling. I live in California, so things like rust are a total non-issue.

Being a "car guy" I am really big on preventative maintenance over and above what the book calls for. As a result, my ownership expenses have been low to the point I've saved a LOT of money over many years of ownership.

AND... if you think the new ar prices today are high, hold onto your seatbelts because the auto strike will make things much worse.
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Old 09-19-2023, 05:14 PM
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David Eastwood David Eastwood is offline
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My wife and I have her 2019 Mazda CX5, with about 27,000 miles on it, and my 2021 Subaru Crosstrek, currently sitting at just under 40,000 miles.

Both are paid for, and are dealer-maintained, on schedule.

We recently toyed with the idea of trading them both for a single vehicle of some sort. Try as we might, we canít make it make any kind of sense, economic or otherwise. My younger sonís recent experience of having his Honda in the shop for over 3 months after an accident, waiting for *one* small part, pretty much cemented the decision. His insurance, and the Honda dealer, covered a loaner for all of that time, but thereís no guarantee that that might be repeated if our hypothetical single vehicle was out of commission for a similar event.

Looking forward to seeing that 100k roll by on the Subaru as we road-trip our retirement around the US
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Old 09-19-2023, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6L6 View Post
I live in California, so things like rust are a total non-issue.

.
They don't even need a reason to throw salt here....they just do it to use it up.

Another thing I forgot to mention is that in the recent past I have lost total faith in my local-ish Honda dealers service department. Last time I went in they tried to turn an already 65 dollar oil change into a 300 dollar affair by trying to sell me things I didn't need. Then when I left and was halfway home I noticed they got grease all over my passenger seat (which is light gray) I keep my car as clean as the ones on their showroom floor, and they used to respect that. Now they are a bunch of 25 year olds with their hats on backwards that don't seem to care.
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"One small heart, and a great big soul that's driving"

Charis SJ Koa/BC Sitka
Mcknight/Poling GC Koa/Italian
Taylor custom GC Mahogany/Sitka
Loriente Clarita EIR/Engelmann



Last edited by fitness1; 09-19-2023 at 05:20 PM.
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Old 09-19-2023, 05:27 PM
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David Eastwood David Eastwood is offline
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Originally Posted by fitness1 View Post
They don't even need a reason to throw salt here....they just do it to use it up.

Another thing I forgot to mention is that in the recent past I have lost total faith in my local-ish Honda dealers service department. Last time I went in they tried to turn an already 65 dollar oil change into a 300 dollar affair by trying to sell me things I didn't need. Then when I left and was halfway home I noticed they got grease all over my passenger seat (which is light gray) I keep my car as clean as the ones on their showroom floor, and they used to respect that. Now they are a bunch of 25 year olds with their hats on backwards that don't seem to care.
In contrast, my Subaru service tech told me that my cabin air filter would be up for replacement at the next service. He told me to buy one from Amazon, and look for the YouTube video for how to replace it.

Saved me about $40 - that’s three sets of strings
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Last edited by David Eastwood; 09-19-2023 at 05:45 PM.
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Old 09-19-2023, 05:46 PM
frazervalley frazervalley is offline
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Good to hear you are a Honda/Acura fan and of the Accord in particular. I bought a new Ď88 Accord EX, 4 dr sedan, sunroof, 5 speed manual. Had it for ten years, zero problems. I was much younger then and spirited driving was common. It was a fun car to drive with a fully independent double wishbone suspension. Rare in a volume passenger car in those days, unless you went considerably upmarket.

I did not care for the styling of the 2018 tenth generation Accord when it arrived. But after a few years, the styling started to grow on me and after a test drive, it felt just right. I now think the styling is very nice, especially the front and side views. The interior is spacious, elegant and stylish to a mature gentleman like myself. I recently took it on a scenic drive down to Anacortes, Washington. There are some beautiful and curvy stretches of highway there where the Accord really shines. There is a reason the Accord has been in Car and Driverís top ten list for over thirty years. Yes, I am a fan of Car and Driver and I read it thoroughly every month.

You probably know this, but when a car manufacturer does a mid cycle refresh they often address issues and upgrade some of the features.

Cheers!
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