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  #16  
Old 04-10-2017, 05:23 PM
Tom2 Tom2 is offline
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For me, neck profile defines playability more than any other parameter. My preference is a deep C. Taylor is a shallow C. Rainsong is a modified U, which is boxier than a C, sort of the opposite of a V. If a V is pointy in the center and flat at the shoulders, a modified U is flat in the center and gets pointy at the shoulders. Not as flat and pointy as a classical neck, but not as round as a Taylor. It's been a while since I played a Blackbird, but I vaguely remember the neck to be rounder, and more comfortable, than a Rainsong.
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  #17  
Old 04-10-2017, 09:35 PM
Chipotle Chipotle is offline
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I have a recent Composite Acoustics GX. Not sure if the Legacy neck is different, but the GX neck is very Taylor-like, with that shallow C. In fact, CA and Taylor (814) were in the running for my last guitar, and I took a GX in to Guitar Center and played it side-by-side with various Taylors. The neck was very similar.

I'm happy with the action on my GX, it's nice and low and easy to play. Not as low as my electrics, but still very comfy, especially with light (.12-53) strings. The GX doesn't have a truss rod, so if you want different relief than it comes with, that might be an issue. But mine's not excessive at all.
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  #18  
Old 04-11-2017, 12:19 PM
Ted @ LA Guitar Sales Ted @ LA Guitar Sales is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chipotle View Post
I have a recent Composite Acoustics GX. Not sure if the Legacy neck is different, but the GX neck is very Taylor-like, with that shallow C. In fact, CA and Taylor (814) were in the running for my last guitar, and I took a GX in to Guitar Center and played it side-by-side with various Taylors. The neck was very similar.

I'm happy with the action on my GX, it's nice and low and easy to play. Not as low as my electrics, but still very comfy, especially with light (.12-53) strings. The GX doesn't have a truss rod, so if you want different relief than it comes with, that might be an issue. But mine's not excessive at all.
The necks on CA are very close to Taylor, but as noted already, I think playability is a combination of features, not just the neck. For instance over the years I noticed that I prefer a different neck on large guitars than I do on smaller ones. So given that the OP is looking for something that feels like his 214ce, I think overall, the combined shape, feel, tone, and setup, of the Rainsong WS will be hard to beat.

But I do think the Composite Acoustics GX is an outstanding acoustic guitar. Although heavier, and with a warmer tone than the OP's Taylor, it's an amazingly versatile acoustic.
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  #19  
Old 04-11-2017, 02:09 PM
Doubleneck Doubleneck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom2 View Post
For me, neck profile defines playability more than any other parameter. My preference is a deep C. Taylor is a shallow C. Rainsong is a modified U, which is boxier than a C, sort of the opposite of a V. If a V is pointy in the center and flat at the shoulders, a modified U is flat in the center and gets pointy at the shoulders. Not as flat and pointy as a classical neck, but not as round as a Taylor. It's been a while since I played a Blackbird, but I vaguely remember the neck to be rounder, and more comfortable, than a Rainsong.
This really is correct in my experience. To say the Rainsong N2 is similar to a Taylor in profile is nonsense really. You can however say that the exactness of a Rainsong neck and build will definitely give you the ability to have a setup every bit as good as a Taylor. If as the poster says he can get used to various necks profiles easily, it very well may be the right guitar for him. It will never be my favorite profile but I make it work.
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  #20  
Old 04-11-2017, 03:39 PM
Ted @ LA Guitar Sales Ted @ LA Guitar Sales is offline
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Originally Posted by Doubleneck View Post
This really is correct in my experience. To say the Rainsong N2 is similar to a Taylor in profile is nonsense really. You can however say that the exactness of a Rainsong neck and build will definitely give you the ability to have a setup every bit as good as a Taylor. If as the poster says he can get used to various necks profiles easily, it very well may be the right guitar for him. It will never be my favorite profile but I make it work.
Perhaps I missed it, but I don't think anyone said the Rainsong N2 was similar in profile to a Taylor standard carve neck. What I, and a few others said was that overall, a Rainsong is the closest in feel to a Taylor.
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  #21  
Old 04-11-2017, 04:34 PM
Doubleneck Doubleneck is offline
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Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales View Post
Perhaps I missed it, but I don't think anyone said the Rainsong N2 was similar in profile to a Taylor standard carve neck. What I, and a few others said was that overall, a Rainsong is the closest in feel to a Taylor.
Feel is subjective but it's hard for me to think two guitars with such different neck profiles can feel the same to most players? Put a blindfold on me and I guarantee I could pick up the difference.
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  #22  
Old 04-11-2017, 04:54 PM
Ted @ LA Guitar Sales Ted @ LA Guitar Sales is offline
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Originally Posted by Doubleneck View Post
Feel is subjective but it's hard for me to think two guitars with such different neck profiles can feel the same to most players? Put a blindfold on me and I guarantee I could pick up the difference.
Steve, once again, no one said the two guitars would feel the same, only that the Rainsong would be the closest in feel, overall.
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  #23  
Old 04-11-2017, 10:02 PM
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As far as feel goes, the X20 feels nothing like a typical Taylor but is still the reason I haven't bothered to get a nicer Taylor. It's close enough in all the right ways (like playability) and better ergonomically than the Taylor. I can't really think of any CF that would fool me in a blind taste test, but christ on a bike, as long as it's got enough of the right stuff I am happy enough.
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  #24  
Old 04-12-2017, 08:13 AM
Captain Jim Captain Jim is offline
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Re: the right stuff. My Taylor 814ce has been "the favorite" since I got it. I have added other guitars, wood and cf, since. The 814 has remained at the top of the heap. Until the X20. The X20 is just a delightful instrument: sounds great, just as "playable" as my Taylors, and even more comfortable. And, no fussing with humidity issues.

All that said, "the favorite" isn't always the guitar I pick up first. "The favorite" has to have the best sound and looks. But, the guitar I pick up the most often is still the X7. It is just SO comfortable! Do I need to re-define?
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  #25  
Old 04-14-2017, 03:53 AM
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Another factor that influences playability for some is fretboard radius. For me, it is a huge factor, with flatter boards being much harder to play.

I've tried a couple of Rainsongs, but I just could not abide their nearly flat fretboards (20" radius). I'd love to try a CA or an Emerald with their more reasonable () fretboard radii, but I have never even seen one of those guitars.

For those interested, below are the fretboard radii used by the CF manufacturers I have looked into. (For reference, Martin uses a 16" radius [generally the flattest board I can play comfortably], Taylor a 15" radius, and Gibson a 12" radius, and the smaller the number, the more arched the board)

Composite Acoustics: 14" radius
Emerald: 16" radius
Blackbird: 16" radius
Rainsong: 20" radius
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Last edited by Ed-in-Ohio; 04-14-2017 at 04:11 AM. Reason: added Blackbird radius
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  #26  
Old 04-14-2017, 10:11 AM
mot mot is offline
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Good info Ed. Like I said, the Emerald is close enough for my purposes such that I haven't bothered to get another Taylor. I really like the Rainsongs, but never quite enough to get one. Maybe it was because of the radius. I hadn't thought about it before.
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  #27  
Old 04-14-2017, 11:45 AM
Ted @ LA Guitar Sales Ted @ LA Guitar Sales is offline
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[QUOTE=Ed-in-Ohio;5304639]Another factor that influences playability for some is fretboard radius. For me, it is a huge factor, with flatter boards being much harder to play...
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Originally Posted by mot View Post
Good info Ed. Like I said, the Emerald is close enough for my purposes such that I haven't bothered to get another Taylor. I really like the Rainsongs, but never quite enough to get one. Maybe it was because of the radius. I hadn't thought about it before.
[quote]

Fretboard radius is one of many things that will affect playability, for some, like Ed it's rather important, to guys like me, much less so. For me, the Emeralds X20's light weight, non traditional balance, and synthetic tone means it would be the last to consider if I am looking for something similar to my Taylor.

Keep in mind that I personally own three Taylors, as well as examples of all the current CF builders, that included an X20 for a short time. Besides my extensive personal collection, we keep over 100 Taylors, and over 100 CF models in the store, so I've had some time think about this. I find that the overall feel, playability, and tone of the Rainsong WS is as close as you will get to a CF version of a Taylor GA. Were I looking to buy a CF companion to one of my Martin OM, or 000, the Composite Acoustics OX would be my choice.
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  #28  
Old 04-14-2017, 12:09 PM
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^ - Ted, such great information! Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales View Post
...snip... Were I looking to buy a CF companion to one of my Martin OM, or 000, the Composite Acoustics OX would be my choice.
Excellent! and I think this is a great looking model too. Ted, how would you compare/contrast the playability of the CA OX with that of a Martin OM or a Taylor GA? Since these do not have a truss rod, where do they set the neck relief? I'd assume around .008"? Also, can the propitiatory CF saddles be sanded like conventional saddles to adjust action?
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  #29  
Old 04-14-2017, 12:36 PM
Captain Jim Captain Jim is offline
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Ted, my friend, my experience is different from yours. You know I am a Taylor fan, but the X20 I recently bought competes nicely with the 814... playability is similar (same scale and nut width), the Emerald is more comfortable, and... dare I say it: I prefer the sound of the X20. The neck profile on the X20 is closer to the Taylor than the N2 neck of my RainSong.

I would never compare my experience with various guitars to yours, but I have been playing for over 50 years and know what feels "just right" to me. The 814 has been my "just right" guitar for years, but the X20 is "just righter." I understand that everyone's mileage WILL vary. I have tried a couple CA guitars, including a pre-Peavey OX (no experience with the Peavey models). It was a decent guitar, but (at the time) I preferred my Shorty.

Lots of guitars, lots of options. I picked the Shorty based on the "most like a Taylor" at the time, but I have since come to regard each guitar on its own merits.

Best wishes,
Jim
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  #30  
Old 04-14-2017, 02:13 PM
Ted @ LA Guitar Sales Ted @ LA Guitar Sales is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed-in-Ohio View Post
^ - Ted, such great information! Thank you.



Excellent! and I think this is a great looking model too. Ted, how would you compare/contrast the playability of the CA OX with that of a Martin OM or a Taylor GA? Since these do not have a truss rod, where do they set the neck relief? I'd assume around .008"? Also, can the propitiatory CF saddles be sanded like conventional saddles to adjust action?
I would need to measure to be sure, but factory setup on the two guitars feels similar, which is really all that matters. More importantly the OX has a more Martin-like tone

And yes, CA and Rainsong use the same Tusq saddles Taylor has been using for decades, in fact, Bob Taylor designed them, so adjustment is very straight forward.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Jim View Post
Ted, my friend, my experience is different from yours. You know I am a Taylor fan, but the X20 I recently bought competes nicely with the 814... playability is similar (same scale and nut width), the Emerald is more comfortable, and... dare I say it: I prefer the sound of the X20..
So then they are not really the same, are they? In fact you were not looking for a guitar that would feel and play like your 814ce when you bought your Shorty from me, if you were you would be the owner of a CO-WS1000N2. I'm guessing getting as close to your 814ce was also not a priority when ordering your Emerald either. Or was it? The fact that you like your CF guitars as much, or more than your 814ce is not proof that they are similar, it's proof that like me, you enjoy some variety in your guitars.

BTW, sending you an email.
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