NGD: Taylor 717e Builder's Edition Grand Pacific Wild Honey Burst

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Gary, I'm surprised too, and was ready to be ho-hummed by the tone of the Taylor 717e compared to the Huss & Dalton T-DR. I still have the option of returning the Taylor within the trial period but won't as that's how happy I am with its tone. Being that my favorite guitar body-shape is the dreadnought, whether square- or slope-shouldered, I can readily accept that the 717e's acoustic tone may not be what many want to hear based on "traditional" tone but I hear it as a pleasing blend of old and new that sounds mighty fine to my old ears.

I agree completely. The 717e is a guitar that should not be compared as much to what you might expect given its traditional slope shoulder 'shape'. It really stands on its own delivering its own voice which is rich, balanced, organic and very very musical.People might dismiss the 717 is they expect it to be a J-45 clone. It's not. It does its own thing.

In ways, the 717 reminds me of a Dread crossbred with an OM. It has the detail and complexity and balance of an OM but with the fullness and richness of a dread ....without the bass overwhelming or clouding the detail of the other strings.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Groberts

I agree completely. The 717e is a guitar that should not be compared as much to what you might expect given its traditional slope shoulder 'shape'. It really stands on its own delivering its own voice which is rich, balanced, organic and very very musical.People might dismiss the 717 is they expect it to be a J-45 clone. It's not. It does its own thing.

In ways, the 717 reminds me of a Dread crossbred with an OM. It has the detail and complexity and balance of an OM but with the fullness and richness of a dread ....without the bass overwhelming or clouding the detail of the other strings.

And the nice thing is that whether it's a combination of the new, factory-installed Elixirs stiffening up a bit, and the guitar "opening-up" some with several hours of playing time, the 717e just gets more full, resonant and clear, even when digging in!

[sakar12]

Keep these posts coming

I pulled the trigger on a 717e yesterday, but because I'm a lefty, I need to wait 30-45 days. I think the only thing that'll get me through is reading posts like these and watching demos like Gary's!

Zach

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

And the nice thing is that whether it's a combination of the new, factory-installed Elixirs stiffening up a bit, and the guitar "opening-up" some with several hours of playing time, the 717e just gets more full, resonant and clear, even when digging in!

One side bar however. I personally think whoever placed the strap button on the back side of the neck heel should be reprimanded. That is a very awkward and insecure place for a the front of the strap to be placed. I am not a fan. I always felt the strap could come loose at any time.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Groberts

One side bar however. I personally think whoever placed the strap button on the back side of the neck heel should be reprimanded. That is a very awkward and insecure place for a the front of the strap to be placed. I am not a fan. I always felt the strap could come loose at any time.

+1! Although I haven't yet tried it with a strap, I feel that the Grand Pacific strap-button placement may tend to push the guitar away from the playing position I want to maintain. To be fair, though, it's almost a similar placement to where Gibson usually places their strap button on the bottom of the neck heel. I had a local dealer do this on my now long-gone 2007 Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom to try to maintain Gibson placement on the guitars on which they install a strap button. My Cole-Clark Fat Lady FL2AC had a similar Gibson placement. I tend to favor the regular Taylor/Martin factory placement on the treble side of the neck heel.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by sakar12

Keep these posts coming

I pulled the trigger on a 717e yesterday, but because I'm a lefty, I need to wait 30-45 days. I think the only thing that'll get me through is reading posts like these and watching demos like Gary's!

Zach

Hey, Zach, we'll keep ya stoked! Please give yourself a few days worth of playing time before you decide if you like your Taylor 717e. My initial impression was it's okay but maybe I'll return it for a refund. The more I've played it, however, the more its tone is developing and the more fun it is to play. Frankly, I'm beginning to feel my Taylor 717e is the most fun to play of any of my guitars as it's easy to play and sounds clear, full and resonant all over the fingerboard. Let me invoke Andy Powers if I may by squinting a bit, giving my head a bit of a side-wag, while clucking my cheek and saying, "The 717 Grand Pacific just kinda ... well ... just kinda feels comfortably old but fresh at the same time, kinda like a pair of old, worn jeans just washed, dried and put on."

[sakar12]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Hey, Zach, we'll keep ya stoked! Please give yourself a few days worth of playing time before you decide if you like your Taylor 717e. My initial impression was it's okay but maybe I'll return it for a refund. The more I've played it, however, the more its tone is developing and the more fun it is to play. Frankly, I'm beginning to feel my Taylor 717e is the most fun to play of any of my guitars as it's easy to play and sounds clear, full and resonant all over the fingerboard. Let me invoke Andy Powers if I may by squinting a bit, giving my head a bit of a side-wag, while clucking my cheek and saying, "The 717 Grand Pacific just kinda ... well ... just kinda feels comfortably old but fresh at the same time, kinda like a pair of old, worn jeans just washed, dried and put on."

Thank you! I love old jeans

[SpruceTop]

I can kind of describe the difference between the Taylor 717e and the Huss & Dalton TD-R as follows: The Huss & Dalton T-DR has the rosewood back-and-sides thing going on in all its highly-desired, rich glory compared to the Taylor 717e's rosewood's tone. The Taylor 717e has the rosewood back-and-sides thing going on in a "filtered" glory tone way that let's all the intricacies of individual notes and nuances sound forth without the Huss & Dalton's highly-desired, rosewood back-and-sides rosewood glory tone thing smearing all over everything when you dig in to play melodies and nuances. I like both guitars but the Taylor 717e just seems more compatible with making music without submerging it in ... well ... too much rosewood back-and-sides glory tone. The Huss & Dalton T-DR sounds great but needs self-control on the part of the player to get what it's capable of delivering. YMMV

[Shades of Blue]

Originally Posted by Groberts

One side bar however. I personally think whoever placed the strap button on the back side of the neck heel should be reprimanded. That is a very awkward and insecure place for a the front of the strap to be placed. I am not a fan. I always felt the strap could come loose at any time.

I'm with you. Honestly, these guitars shouldn't even be shipped with a strap button installed. Put it in the case and let the buyer decide. I will say, that I don't personally have an issue with the strap button there, other than I don't like it aesthetically.

How did you put the strap on that button Gary? Did you put the top/front of the strap touching the back of the body, or did you put the back of the strap touching the body?

[Groberts]

Originally Posted by Shades of Blue

I'm with you. Honestly, these guitars shouldn't even be shipped with a strap button installed. Put it in the case and let the buyer decide. I will say, that I don't personally have an issue with the strap button there, other than I don't like it aesthetically.

How did you put the strap on that button Gary? Did you put the top/front of the strap touching the back of the body, or did you put the back of the strap touching the body?

Front of strap was connected but it never felt secure or looked secure.

[RP]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

...I can readily accept that the 717e's acoustic tone may not be what many want to hear based on "traditional" tone but I hear it as a pleasing blend of old and new that sounds mighty fine to my old ears.

Originally Posted by Groberts

I agree completely. The 717e is a guitar that should not be compared as much to what you might expect given its traditional slope shoulder 'shape'. It really stands on its own delivering its own voice which is rich, balanced, organic and very very musical.People might dismiss the 717 is they expect it to be a J-45 clone. It's not. It does its own thing...

I agree and have been saying from early on that the Grand Pacifics' tone should be assessed on their own and not compared to that of Martin, Gibson or other vintage dreads. I also felt that Taylor did these guitars a disservice by calling them dreadnoughts rather than just Grand Pacifics because prospective buyers had a built-in preconception as to what they would and should sound like...

[jklotz]

Originally Posted by Shades of Blue

I'm with you. Honestly, these guitars shouldn't even be shipped with a strap button installed. Put it in the case and let the buyer decide. I will say, that I don't personally have an issue with the strap button there, other than I don't like it aesthetically.

How did you put the strap on that button Gary? Did you put the top/front of the strap touching the back of the body, or did you put the back of the strap touching the body?

The neck heel is sculpted and rounded to eliminate hard edges and give a little better high fret access. My guess is they felt the slimmed down heel wouldn't give the structural support the strap button required, as the screw would have had to be shorter.

[jklotz]

Originally Posted by RP

I agree and have been saying from early on that the Grand Pacifics' tone should be assessed on their own and not compared to that of Martin, Gibson or other vintage dreads. I also felt that Taylor did these guitars a disservice by calling them dreadnoughts rather than just Grand Pacifics because prospective buyers had a built-in preconception as to what they would and should sound like...

Maybe, but the body size feels like a dread when I play mine.

[SpruceTop]

The more I play it, the better the 717e sounds. That "string-ping/sitar-thing" on the 4th string has gone away. Acoustically, the guitar is magic, and the ES2 sounds terrific through my just acquired, used but mint condition UltraSound AG-30. I'm a firm believer in V-Class Bracing and love the Grand Pacific tone and shape!

[SpruceTop]

Although its amplified tone sounds good, my one niggling point about my new Taylor 717e Grand Pacific Builder's Edition is the newest preamp: Why, Oh, Why did Taylor put this newer preamp in their ES2 system instead of retaining the full-size, more powerful 2016 circuit board preamp version of the ES2?

My 2016 Taylor GS Mini-e Koa has the full-size ES2 circuit board in it and with its Volume control at its detent position, it satisfactorily drives every amp and PA preamp I plug it into with their gain/volume knobs in their middle-range positions. The new preamp just doesn't have the power to drive an amp's or PA speaker's input without being augmented by a pedal of some sort, eg., Session Acoustic DI, ToneDexter. Without a pedal between the guitar and amp/PA input you have to turn the ES2 preamp's Volume control way up past its mid-volume detent position or turn the amp's or PA's gain/volume controls way up past their middle positions. The newest ES2 has about the same low output power as a Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 and a Trance Amulet M-VT.

I wonder if Taylor would exchange the current 2019 ES2 preamp for a 2016 ES2 preamp? It would likely be an installation no-brainer as long as the wiring connectors are the same.