Never Going Back Again - Difficult Reach

[MisterOM]

So I'm strictly a fingerstyle player and have been a big Buckingham fan for decades. I can play a lot of his trickier tunes, but Never Going Back Again has revealed a limitation of mine. Despite having fairly large hands there is one bit that I just can't do. My hands have taken a beating over the decades and seem to have stiffened up and my fingers almost seem to want to curve inward, hard to describe.

There is another way to play this song that makes it easier (Capo 6, drop C vs Capo 4 Drop D), and I may go that route, but I can play the rest of it just fine with the capo on the 4th fret so I'm feeling stubborn.

I can fuel my GAS by shopping for a short scale guitar, so that is good news!
(current main guitar is a 25.4" scale Martin OM).

Here is the tricky bit:

--2--------2--------2-------|-----2--------2--------2----|
-----0--------5--------5----|--------5--------5----------|
--------2--------2----------|--2--------2--------2-------|
--------5-----------5-------|--------5-----------5-------|
--0-----------0-------------|--0-----------0-------------|
----------------------------|----------------------------|

Thanks for any advice!

Steve W

[Chipotle]

This is bars 5-6, right? Yeah, it's a bit of a stretch. I play it with my index barred across the first four strings at fret 2 (same position as it is in for the first 4 bars, so no need to move), ring finger fret 5 fourth string and pinky fret 5 second string. I can't think of an easier fingering.

I think the key, though, is hand & arm position. As I get to that phrase, my wrist moves away from the neck a bit and my hand rotates up a bit, and at the same time my elbow moves in towards my body and forward a bit. That gets my fingers at the proper angle to fret things cleanly. And, btw, the whole song is easier imo if you hold your guitar so you are closer to the headstock end--if you are already reaching out a ways to get to the frets, it's going to be much harder to get your wrist & arm in position for that passage.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by MisterOM

So I'm strictly a fingerstyle player and have been a big Buckingham fan for decades. I can play a lot of his trickier tunes, but Never Going Back Again has revealed a limitation of mine. Despite having fairly large hands there is one bit that I just can't do. My hands have taken a beating over the decades and seem to have stiffened up and my fingers almost seem to want to curve inward, hard to describe.

There is another way to play this song that makes it easier (Capo 6, drop C vs Capo 4 Drop D), and I may go that route, but I can play the rest of it just fine with the capo on the 4th fret so I'm feeling stubborn.

I can fuel my GAS by shopping for a short scale guitar, so that is good news!
(current main guitar is a 25.4" scale Martin OM).

Here is the tricky bit:

--2--------2--------2-------|-----2--------2--------2----|
-----0--------5--------5----|--------5--------5----------|
--------2--------2----------|--2--------2--------2-------|
--------5-----------5-------|--------5-----------5-------|
--0-----------0-------------|--0-----------0-------------|
----------------------------|----------------------------|

Thanks for any advice!

Steve W

Where did you get that tab? What I hear (and see) him playing for that section is this:

--2--------2--------2-------|-----2--------2--------2----|
-----5--------5--------5----|--------5--------5----------|
----------------------------|-----------2----------------|
--------5-----------5-------|--------5-----------5-------|
--0-----------0-------------|--0-----------0-------------|
----------------------------|----------------------------|

Fret 2 is barred (top 3 only). Still a bit of a stretch involved of course. The 2nd fret on 3rd string only happens once, and is hardly an essential element, so if you found it easy to just fret the 1st string and leave 3rd open it would still work. And then you could use the open 3rd instead of 5th fret on 4th string!

[Gitfiddlemann]

Originally Posted by JonPR

Where did you get that tab? What I hear (and see) him playing for that section is this:

--2--------2--------2-------|-----2--------2--------2----|
-----5--------5--------5----|--------5--------5----------|
------------------2----------|-----------2----------------|
--------5-----------5-------|--------5-----------5-------|
--0-----------0-------------|--0-----------0-------------|
----------------------------|----------------------------|

Fret 2 is barred (top 3 only). Still a bit of a stretch involved of course. The 2nd fret on 3rd string only happens once, and is hardly an essential element, so if you found it easy to just fret the 1st string and leave 3rd open it would still work. And then you could use the open 3rd instead of 5th fret on 4th string!

I agree with above. That's how I play it as well. But there was a note missing in that first measure. I added it in yellow.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by AndreF

I agree with above. That's how I play it as well. But there was a note missing in that first measure. I added it in yellow.

Yes, you're right. I'd still say that was relatively insignificant for the sound of the pattern, but it does prove (if we didn't have video!) how he is fingering that passage.
That in turn makes sense when you have the barre in place for the D chord either side. It makes the switch relatively straightforward.

Great shots of his left hand here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27QaDxG36DM

[MisterOM]

Thanks for the responses! I think I have to experiment with the way I'm positioning my hand, elbow, etc. as Chipotle mentioned. I just can't seem to handle the 2-5 reach as shown in the video that JonPR linked to.

Thanks for the tab correction too. I do have tabs that show it correctly, from an old magazine. That was just a copy and paste from one I had on the computer.

What do you all think of the variation shown in this video, around 3:30?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wvCrzzLMCQ&t=274s

Thanks.

Steve W

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Not to ruffle any feathers but there is a 'cheaters' way of playing it, tuning the guitar C-G-D-G-B-E and putting the capo on 6.

Similar to this.

[MisterOM]

Originally Posted by Brooklyn Bob

Not to ruffle any feathers but there is a 'cheaters' way of playing it, tuning the guitar C-G-D-G-B-E and putting the capo on 6.

Similar to this.

I have an old Guitar World Acoustic magazine that has it transcribed this way. It seems that this may be the original way Lyndsey played it on Rumors than changed it up later. If I really can't find a way to make it work I will resort to this arrangement.

Thanks.

Steve W

[Bob from Brooklyn]

It is pretty much note-for-note as the capo on 4 version. The right hand is tricky too so there are plenty of hurdles on this tune.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by MisterOM

What do you all think of the variation shown in this video, around 3:30?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wvCrzzLMCQ&t=274s

Nice, I like that.
All the notes you need are in that shape, the strings are just in a different order, so you need to re-allocate your RH fingers. For me, that's too much retraining (this dog is too old for that new trick...), but it's definitely worth a try.

BTW, your link needs a different time stamp: https://youtu.be/4wvCrzzLMCQ?t=209

[Gitfiddlemann]

Originally Posted by MisterOM

I have an old Guitar World Acoustic magazine that has it transcribed this way. It seems that this may be the original way Lyndsey played it on Rumors than changed it up later. If I really can't find a way to make it work I will resort to this arrangement.

Thanks.

Steve W

I have an old Guitar World Acoustic magazine (with Lindsey Buckingham on the cover) in which he confirms using drop D tuning capoed to the 4th fret on Rumours for that tune.
He goes on to say:
" I just drop the low E down to a D and play out of a 2nd position D chord shape. You have to stretch your left hand a little to play the A13 voicing"

(which is the troubling bit you are referring to, so even Lindsey admits it's one of the challenging spots. There is a video of him playing it in drop D, capoed on the 3rd fret, but I think it's more to accommodate his voice.)

Not to say that you can't use another tuning capoed on the 6th if you end up liking that better. Seems to work too!

Here's an excellent teaching video of the tune:

[MisterOM]

Originally Posted by JonPR

Nice, I like that.
All the notes you need are in that shape, the strings are just in a different order, so you need to re-allocate your RH fingers. For me, that's too much retraining (this dog is too old for that new trick...), but it's definitely worth a try.

BTW, your link needs a different time stamp: https://youtu.be/4wvCrzzLMCQ?t=209

Thanks for the reply. I am doing to see how my right hand does with this alternate approach. Like you I am quite firmly in the "this dog is too old for that new trick" camp but it's worth a shot!

Steve W

[MisterOM]

Originally Posted by AndreF

I have an old Guitar World Acoustic magazine (with Lindsey Buckingham on the cover) in which he confirms using drop D tuning capoed to the 4th fret on Rumours for that tune.
He goes on to say:
" I just drop the low E down to a D and play out of a 2nd position D chord shape. You have to stretch your left hand a little to play the A13 voicing"

(which is the troubling bit you are referring to, so even Lindsey admits it's one of the challenging spots. There is a video of him playing it in drop D, capoed on the 3rd fret, but I think it's more to accommodate his voice.)

Not to say that you can't use another tuning capoed on the 6th if you end up liking that better. Seems to work too!

Here's an excellent teaching video of the tune:

Thanks. I've watched that video (he's a good teacher), and it leads me to believe that my hands may not be able to handle it. I play it every day, being careful not to cause any pain. If the above Paul Davids method doesn't work out for me then I will resort to the capo 6 transcription.

Of course now I'm shopping around for my first short scale acoustic...

Steve W

[GBS]

Anybody have tabs to the instrumental break? I've tried over and over to follow this video, but can't seem to get the transition back to the main piece even close to correct.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwEVuQxPJ7U&t=25s

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by GBS

Anybody have tabs to the instrumental break? I've tried over and over to follow this video, but can't seem to get the transition back to the main piece even close to correct.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwEVuQxPJ7U&t=25s

Looks pretty straightforward to me. I mean, if you slow down the video to 0.5, it's easy enough to follow. But I can do a tab for you if you like. (I mean, I'll do it for myself anyway, and you can have it!)

EDIT: OK here you go:


Second time through, the first two bars are this:


- otherwise it's the same