TA Amulet lens experiment

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

My thoughts on Bass-signal content: Cuki, is it just me or have you also noticed that when bass is lacking in a pickup signal, that even after EQing in a goodly amount of bass with a preamp to compensate for the lack of bass, it just doesn't sound as full and distinct as having a strong bass content in the signal to begin with?

Ah ah.., remember my post about the 400,000Hz rule and New IR process? The whole idea underlying my new process is related to that observation you just made combined with the 400,000 Hz rule idea.

[SpruceTop]

Cuki, Please check my new sound file demo for my Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic 3.2: Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic 3.2 DIP-switch 3

[Cuki79]

I received the Stew & Mac 5" soundhole clamp.

I drew and 3-D printed the jig.

Only problem I forgot to leave room for the strings ball ends so I had to clamp without listening check.

No big deal, this is my first trial of Amulet install following the "SpruceTop old fashion way"



Note:
1) I did not cover the whole Amulet lens with redtape so it does not stick the jig and enable the sensor to "rock" a bit.
2) I used my own TESA red tape. (Gary Hull did not respond to my email but I can not blame him... I know he does not like what people write on the forum about the Amulet installation)
3) I exchanged the sensors place. The one I have put on the bass side is usually on the treble side.

12h (at least) to way before the next sensor...

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Cuki79

I received the Stew & Mac 5" soundhole clamp.

I drew and 3-D printed the jig.

Only problem I forgot to leave room for the strings ball ends so I had to clamp without listening check.

No big deal, this is my first trial of Amulet install following the "SpruceTop old fashion way"



Note:
1) I did not cover the whole Amulet lens with redtape so it does not stick the jig and enable the sensor to "rock" a bit.
2) I used my own TESA red tape. (Gary Hull did not respond to my email but I can not blame him... I know he does not like what people write on the forum about the Amulet installation)
3) I exchanged the sensors place. The one I have put on the bass side is usually on the treble side.

12h (at least) to way before the next sensor...

I'm looking forward to your results! By the way, Laurel Phoenix handles email and phone calls for Trance and doesn't always see or answer emails but she will definitely respond to a phone message.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

By the way, Laurel Phoenix handles email and phone calls for Trance and doesn't always see or answer emails but she will definitely respond to a phone message.

Thanks for the info. I don't expect them to support "non official" installation protocol...

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Cuki79

Thanks for the info. I don't expect them to support "non official" installation protocol...

Just tell them you're relocating your system to another guitar and need more tape.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Just tell them you're relocating your system to another guitar and need more tape.

I can't do that... Especially since I am publishing my experiment on the AGF

Anyway I am not sure the TESA tape I used is worse (I will soon know).

It's 205 microns thick and looks and feel very similar.

https://www.tesa.com/en/industry/tesa-4965.html

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Cuki79

I can't do that... Especially since I am publishing my experiment on the AGF

Anyway I am not sure the TESA tape I used is worse (I will soon know).

It's 205 microns thick and looks and feel very similar.

https://www.tesa.com/en/industry/tesa-4965.html

That looks like an excellent tape and should work well. It's also about the same thickness as Trance permanent tape. Maybe, it's what Trance uses for its permanent red tape?

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Maybe, it's what Trance uses for its permanent red tape?

Since it is a secret, we will never know.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by Cuki79

I can't do that... Especially since I am publishing my experiment on the AGF

I'd just tell them you're experimenting and would like more tape. I imagine they'd at least sell it to you. Gary told me quite gleefully once that people were experimenting with all kinds of approaches, sticking them in different places, etc. Their recommendations are what they think works best - and they likely have more insight into all the things people have tried, so I'd take them at their word. But it seems like they're happy to have people try whatever they want, and I'd think they'd be very interested in your scientific approach.

[LFL Steve]

What are you using to do the spectrum analysis and graphing?

[GanAinm]

Just to add some info to the discussion... The original glue that Trance used for many years before they switched to the red tape was a type of contact cement made by Barge (the “original Barge”):
http://www.bargeadhesive.com/products.html

Contact cement is the type of glue that you smear both sides with a thin layer, wait 20 minutes and press them together. Normally this might be softer than harder glues such as CA or epoxy or hide, providing a bit of dampener (?), but Barge might be in a class of its own. In my limited experience it works a lot better than other contact cement brands, and is used in shoe repair etc. It dries pretty hard eventually, and it used to be considered somewhat difficult to remove from a bridge plate (although it couldn’t be as bad as CA or epoxy?).

If you must use hard glue for pickups, why not try hot hide glue? It would be less damaging to the bridge plate than epoxy or CA (cyanoacrylate). It’s reversible with heat or steam, and would be relatively removable from the wood the same way. For this application you could probably use the hand rub or tack method (holding the two parts together for a minute or two and relying on the setting hide glue to pull the parts together, without clamping). It should stick ok to metal or plastic for this purpose, just making sure the surface is very clean and maybe roughed up a bit. Or because it’s not a critical wood joint, maybe the cold bottled hide glue would work fine and be easier than hot hide (old brown glue or even the titebond hide).

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

But it seems like they're happy to have people try whatever they want, and I'd think they'd be very interested in your scientific approach.

Thanks Doug,

if the TESA tape does not bring anything to the table, I'll call them.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by Steve-B

What are you using to do the spectrum analysis and graphing?

In this case, I used Melda Production free MAnalyzer

https://www.meldaproduction.com/MAnalyzer

I have other plugins, but I guess all RTA analyzer are the same. They just perform Fast Fourrier Transforms.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by GanAinm

Just to add some info to the discussion... The original glue that Trance used for many years before they switched to the red tape was a type of contact cement made by Barge (the “original Barge”) [...]

If you must use hard glue for pickups, why not try hot hide glue?

Thanks GanAinm,

I have never come accross Barge cement in France (where I live) and I have no idea what is the French word for that. As far as, hide glue it is a good idea. I bought some but never dared heating it because of the smell...

My goal was always to use the red tape because I like the idea of easy removal.

Honestly, I am perfectly happy with my Goldplus + internal mic plugged in tone. For me, as far as 100% analog tone is concerned, the cross-over design with an internal mic is the best way to go. Most of my sounboard transducer (SBT) experiments eventually lead to the need for strong EQ correction. (I guess most UST onboard preamps are voiced too)

If you evntually need outboard gear to EQ then you having a 2-channel blender pedal is no more a luxury.

If I could get a balanced tone out of the Amulet without having to cut all the high end with the tonewheel, I would have a nice "plug & play" solution. It would not sound as good as the dual source setup but would be perfect as a backup solution.