Fingerstyle Guitar for older player? (BABYBOOMER ALERT)

[kmckenna45]

Need some help here, from other Baby-Boomers. I have to believe others are having the same issues.

I've reached the 3rd period of the "hockey-game-of-life" (60yrs), and I still love playing, but I need help[ to find a guitar that easier to play (finger style).

I'm not sure what will help - I already massage my forearm every night.

I'd like to find an acoustic that will give me the least strain/pain. My guess is that would look like the below - but (admittingly) I could be wrong about the desired result from each of these - I'd appreciate input on that too:

Shorter Scale (less reaching)
12 frets (I have big hands)
OM/OOO or OO body size (more comfortable to hold)

Does a 12 fret/short scale guitar have less string tension, or more - than a long scale? String tension is important, but I currently tune down one or two steps to reduce the tension.

What are your thoughts on the above features making life easier on my "guitar-arm"? And what acoustics (around $2500 used) fall into this list?

Thanks.

[JayBee1404]

In the Buy & Sell here on the forum is a Brook Torridge at an asking price of $2,650, hand-built in a three-man shop in Devon, UK which turns out around 100 guitars per year - you could do far worse than to consider that instrument. The specs are (from the Brook website)…

Description - 00
Scale Length - 630 mm
Body Length - 490 mm
Upper Bout - 280 mm
Waist - 218 mm
Lower Bout - 375 mm
Body Depth - 100 mm

Brook guitars are beautifully-built instruments, and though the the Torridge is a 14-fret, it’s a fine, OO-size, shorter-scale finger style guitar with a slim 1-23/32” neck.

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=616997

https://www.brookguitars.com/

The usual disclaimers apply......IMHO, YMMV etc.

[Skarsaune]

Short scale will have less tension.
Tuning down a half step also decreases tension.

12 fret doesn't change tension, but will decrease the reach your fretting arm has to make.

12 fret short scale triple 0, 1 3/4" nut, sounds right up your alley. I'm building myself one at the moment.

[TBman]

A different guitar might not be the answer (but don't let me stop you).

Have you tried wearing a strap and positioning the headstock higher more like the classical position? Also are your guitars setup well? Does putting a capo on make them much easier to play? If so, its time for a setup.

I wear a strap seated, and I like to push the headstock up. I'll also often play a tune with a capo on 2 just because it cuts down on the reach.

[musicman1951]

It seems like a reasonable list of requirements. I don't personally find more comfort with a 12 fret, but that doesn't mean you won't.

You don't mention tone, which may very well be a secondary consideration to your comfort requirement. There are a great many possibilities in your price range. I strongly suggest you visit a few music stores. When you think about how many hours a year you will play the guitar, a day of driving seems like a good investment.

I'd enter the store and tell them you're looking for a short scale guitar smaller than a dread. Too-high action can be corrected in the setup, but I'd keep looking until I found something comfortable. Personally, I would not want smaller than a 1 3/4 nut for fingerstyle, but that's up to you.

I'd buy used if I could find what I wanted, but you find the one buy it, new or used. There should be plenty of used 000-18's and maybe 000-28's. Or you may find you like a slightly smaller guitar. Go play some.

[SRL]

I agree that a 24-25" scale 00 or 000 with a 1.75" nut is a good choice. There are lots of good options out there at all different price points. There are also good short-scale 0 guitars out there, like a Larrivee parlor (24" scale) if you want to get something even smaller while still retaining a 1.75" nut.

Here's a list of things you can try for more comfort, although many have been mentioned:

Fretting arm list:

Guitar neck angle. There's a reason classical players use this position; it puts much less strain on the wrist and related muscles. Keep the wrist as straight as you can (avoids carpal tunnel issues), and keep the elbow bent at less than a 90 degree angle (often more like a 45 degree angle). This is #1 for avoiding pain in the fretting hand/wrist/arm, in my view. You can use a footrest like classical players, or a strap, or a small pillow under the guitar body to prop it up, or if seated against a wall or on a couch, lift the right leg up so that your knee is bent and rest the guitar's waist on that hip.
Guitar neck type: getting the right neck thickness/profile for your hand can make or break it for hand pain.
Scale length. Shorter scale = less tension on strings = less effort to fret notes. Also less effort to reach notes, so this can help everything from fingers to hands to elbow to shoulder.
String gauge. Lighter = less effort to fret. Mostly helps the fingers and hand.
String type. Some strings are softer than others, such as Silk and Steel (which are very soft). This can vary by brand too, for the same type and gauge of strings. Mostly helps the fingers and hand.
Action height. Obviously, if the action isn't properly set up for your playing style, this will make it harder to fret notes, putting strain on the hand and fingers. This often happens when people play fingerstyle on guitars set up for hard strumming.

Strumming arm list:

Body size: Smaller and thinner bodies take strain off the shoulder and often elbow as well. Even going from a 5" deep dread to a 4" deep dread can be great, but the more you reduce both dimensions of depth and lower-bout width, the better. I sold my dreads and my largest guitar is a Concerto, which is as wide and deep as a dread but the narrower waist allows it to sit lower on the leg, which lowers the arm a bit. Taylor Grand Auditorium size is very similar in size, but honestly, it's not nearly as comfortable as my smaller bodied guitars. There is a sweet spot for most people (usually 000 or 00), because if you get too small it can be cramped (I feel this way about very short scale guitars like the Taylor GS Mini).
Body contours: Check out a Taylor Builder's Edition, Eastman AC series, Cort Edge, etc. that put contours in various places on the guitar, kind of like how a Stratocaster body is shaped. A lot of these are big guitars, however; I haven't seen many contoured smaller guitars.
Sitting position. Slouching on the couch, versus sitting with the back straight, forward on a chair (a normal chair, not an soft armchair).
Belly issues I hesitate to bring this up, but it can actually be a big deal for playing comfort as we get older. If you've got a gut, this pushes the guitar out from your body and puts more strain on all the joints in your strumming arm (and sometimes fretting arm too). If that's an issue, try calorie counting apps like "My Fitness Pal" or a basic intermittent fasting plan (don't eat after dinner / before breakfast / between meals). Walk more, ride your bike, etc.

[MJScott]

I'm 74 and am experiencing similar issues to the OP. I just got a Larrivee P-03. The body seems larger than other parlors to me closer to an 00 vs an 0. 1.75" nut, 24" scale. All in all great tone. I too play mainly finger style. Highly recommend.

Hope this helps!

[MisterOM]

I'm in a similar boat, 55 but nerve pain down my left arm from a pinched nerve in my neck. I can offer some random thoughts:

I went from Light to Custom Light strings on my Martin OM. May have helped a little. Next string change I will try Silk and Steel.

I have not played any short scale guitars in a long time but plan to do so.

1.75" nut is a must for my somewhat large hands. But also pay attention to the string spacing at the saddle. I have a 2 1/4" minimum, anything tighter doesn't work for me. Many builders, Martin included, have moved to 2 5/32" or 2 1/8". So the balance of nut width and spring spacing have made my search more difficult.

Smaller bodies work well, and yes, I do have a bit of a gut. The 4" lower bout on my OM is about as large as I can go, and would not mind a bit shallower.

I'm also looking at nylon crossovers. I have a classical (but don't play classical), and the 2"+ flat board is a no-go. Some crossovers have radiused boards, and nut widths of 1.8-1.9" are common. This is not meant to replace the steel string, but add something new that also lightens the load on my left hand.

Posture is important as others have stressed. I do try the classical position but have not made my peace with it yet.

I wish you good luck in your search to find a way to play without pain. For me it's too important, it's my only escape from a stressful and somewhat painful life. If I find any specific makes and models in my search I will be sure to share them here.

Steve W

[jaymarsch]

Great replies here so far ad SRL posted a very helpful checklist. Over the years I have dealt with both shoulder, arm and hand issues and have changed up my guitar collection accordingly. My sweet spot is 24" to 25" scale length and I do play both 12 fret and 14 fret guitars. The neck shape, taper, and nut width also make a difference for me. I would say that a short scale grand concert or 00 could give you what you are looking for. I also play with a strap when I am seated as the angle of the neck can be very helpful in lessening the strain on the arm and shoulder. Good luck on finding the guitar that works best for you.

Best,
Jayne

[blindboyjimi]

Originally Posted by TBman

A different guitar might not be the answer (but don't let me stop you).

Have you tried wearing a strap and positioning the headstock higher more like the classical position? Also are your guitars setup well? Does putting a capo on make them much easier to play? If so, its time for a setup.

I wear a strap seated, and I like to push the headstock up. I'll also often play a tune with a capo on 2 just because it cuts down on the reach.

I agree. I think there are several ways to go, but I know if I were having issues I'd buy:

00 or 000 size
Short scale
Wider fingerboard like 1 3/4", 1 13/16" or 1 7/8"
Comfortable neck which may be flatter and thinner or V. For me the ModV is much more comfortable.
Light or extra light strings to further lower the tension. the volume will be plenty with 11's for playing at home.
Finally, positioning is everything. I use a NeckUp on the right leg to move the guitar into a semi-classical position and I sit on a SoundSeat which is worth its weight in gold.

This video by extraordinary AGF guitarist, teacher, and just cool guy Eric Skye changed my life and moved me from a painful uncomfortable 30 minutes a day person to someone who can play 3-4 hours a day.:



As I write this I am taking a 5-minute break. I take lots of breaks. I relax for 5 minutes every 30 minutes of playing. I get up and stretch and sit back down at the computer desk and the AGF is great for that mentally and physically. I am playing a 12 fret, 000, with a 24.9" scale, a ModV neck, with light strings, and using the NeckUp while sitting on a SoundSeat. I use Guitar Pro 7.5 to practice daily.

[Boozehound]

I'd look at a Taylor Grand Concert 712 or 812 12-fret or a Martin 000-28 or 000-18 if I were you. All should be able to be had within your price range. Short scale is definitely what you want to help with playability.

[MWB5007]

+1 ..... Everything Jim said, plus - try tuning down one half step. I have been doing it for years primarily due to my vocal range but it yields a very rich tone too.

Like Jim points out, I use a wider fingerboard (Jim's former 1 7/8 Froggy Bottom) and JP Silk and Phosphors or TI Plectrum .11s; very easy on the hands and fingers.

[zombywoof]

I have gone past 70 and only fingerpick.

The problem is that definitions of "easier" to play are going to be about as subjective as opinions of sound.

The only thing I would say that is if you want a guitar which feels more flexible the best way to go is with a shorter scale and strings wound on a round core. Not that either decreases string tension but they do give a guitar a less stiff feel.

As to other specs, I do not give a fig about body style. Mine range from a 13.5" to a 17 1/8" lower bout. But I do own three guitars which are pretty similar in that they have a 24.75" or 25" scale, 12 or 13 frets, a nut width of around 1 3/4" a string spacing at the bridge of 2 3/8" and a neck depth at the 1st fret between .93" and just over 1.0".

[buddyhu]

Other posts have already mentioned most of what I might recommend. What I can still add: buy low tension strings, like round cores (i like the DR strings that are wrapped around round cores), or Straight Up Strings, or Santa Cruz Parabolic. I use Straight Up Strings (their Medium, .12 - .53, or their Heavy gauges) on nearly all my long scale guitars, and that makes them feel like hex core strings .12-.53 on my short scale guitar. Lighter gauges than that feels a bit too floppy for me, though i may move to lighter gauges if something makes my hands less comfortable.

I like the specs you are contemplating. I think 000’s and OM’s are great for fingerpicking, and only go with a smaller body when i want a more bluesy sound, or a more penetrating tone. But I don’t have a specific guitar to recommend. I am a big fan of Collings guitars, but they usually cost more than $2500 used (especially in recent months, as used guitar prices have gone up considerably). I know some folks have high regard for Eastman guitars, including another Collings fan here on AGF. I have only played one: it felt good, but I thought my Voyage Air sounded better, which was much less expensive than the Eastman.

[kingofdogs1950]

I went through a similar search for a small, comfortable and easy
to play guitar recently and ended up buying a Blueridge BR341.
It's a under your price limit at ~$1,000.
Sitka/mahogany
24.75" scale - I use EB Earthwood 80/20 custom light strings
It has a very loose and easy to play feel. Bends are easy.
I was surprised at the loose feel. I have had other guitars with
short scales that did not play as easily.
1 7/8" nut/2.25" at the saddle
I haven't measured the nut but it feels narrower that 1 7/8".
Twelve fret, of course.
The overall construction is excellent with particularly nice wood.
The Sitka top is very even and tight grained..
I think the BR341 compared favorably to other small guitars I've
owned including a Collings 001A, Martin 00-42 and Martin 00-21.
I'm a geezer at 71 and was looking for a couch guitar for fingerstyle
playing.
I also currently own a Farida OT22 which is another possibility.
Completely different guitar, think Gibson (OT22) vs Martin (BR341).

Mark