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  #16  
Old 07-18-2020, 01:53 AM
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Oh dear..

I am learning a lot here so thanks all for the help.

I had assumed that because of the mics already pointing at 90 deg, that by not panning them at all I would get a stereo effect.

I had previously always used two mono tracks for AB because it offered more control over stereo width and also the ability to reversed pan the reverb to each channel, but will revert to a single stereo file and try again.

It’s also a good opportunity to practice mic positioning..
it's worth spending some time to understand stereo tracks. They're usually a lot easier to work with. And you still have lots of flexibility. For example, you can certainly cross-pan reverb even with a stereo track. The way I'd do that is to send the signal to a bus, place a plugin that flips channels on the bus, then add the reverb to the bus. But there are other ways - you could send the signal to two busses, panning the 2 sends in each direction, adding reverb to each, then panning the busses the other way.

I have never found that to be useful - I saw the David Paul video where he reveals that that's his "big secret" :-) but to me, it just sounds unnatural, at least the few times I've tried it. I tend to be trying to reproduce the guitar the way I hear it, and natural room reverb isn't reversed. But whatever works, of course.

Definitely not manipulating the stereo image in your DAW, and learning what effect mic placement has on it should be time well spent.
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  #17  
Old 07-18-2020, 03:57 AM
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Thanks Doug - it’s one less variable and that’s got to be good!

Have you tried an over / under mic placement? I saw a Nashville producer talk about using it with Tommy E and others and raved about it.
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  #18  
Old 07-18-2020, 08:51 AM
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it's worth spending some time to understand stereo tracks. They're usually a lot easier to work with. And you still have lots of flexibility. For example, you can certainly cross-pan reverb even with a stereo track. The way I'd do that is to send the signal to a bus, place a plugin that flips channels on the bus, then add the reverb to the bus. But there are other ways - you could send the signal to two busses, panning the 2 sends in each direction, adding reverb to each, then panning the busses the other way.

I have never found that to be useful - I saw the David Paul video where he reveals that that's his "big secret" :-) but to me, it just sounds unnatural, at least the few times I've tried it. I tend to be trying to reproduce the guitar the way I hear it, and natural room reverb isn't reversed. But whatever works, of course.

Definitely not manipulating the stereo image in your DAW, and learning what effect mic placement has on it should be time well spent.
So I re-recorded it in an A/B pattern into a stereo track - simpler EQ using the Robin Bullock original as the reference and a touch of reverb..

Let me know what you think?



Here is the reference track;

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  #19  
Old 07-18-2020, 10:53 AM
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You're back to stereo! Sounds good.
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  #20  
Old 07-18-2020, 10:58 AM
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Have you tried an over / under mic placement? I saw a Nashville producer talk about using it with Tommy E and others and raved about it.
Yes, Bob Womack, here on AGF often advocates it. Pete Huttlinger used it as well. To me, it's an interesting sound, but not as spacious as others, and every time I try it, I end up going back to other approaches.

if you haven't seen this demo of basic stereo mic placements, you might find it useful. The over/under, "vertical XY", whatever you want to call it, is one of the examples:


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Old 07-18-2020, 11:24 AM
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Did one up/down mike placement - thread here:
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=233089

I mainly stick to spaced pairs.
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  #22  
Old 07-18-2020, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by rick-slo View Post
Did one up/down mike placement - thread here:
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=233089

I mainly stick to spaced pairs.


Great - very interesting. I tried it and certainly found it more bass heavy and quite warm, but not as spacious.
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  #23  
Old 07-18-2020, 11:57 AM
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Default New mic position - critique?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
Yes, Bob Womack, here on AGF often advocates it. Pete Huttlinger used it as well. To me, it's an interesting sound, but not as spacious as others, and every time I try it, I end up going back to other approaches.



if you haven't seen this demo of basic stereo mic placements, you might find it useful. The over/under, "vertical XY", whatever you want to call it, is one of the examples:







Thanks, good to be
back to stereo ;-)

Thanks for the video.
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Last edited by Wrighty; 07-18-2020 at 12:09 PM.
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  #24  
Old 07-20-2020, 06:56 AM
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Have you tried an over / under mic placement? I saw a Nashville producer talk about using it with Tommy E and others and raved about it.
Gary Paczosa is a Nashville producer/engineer who uses the over / under approach a lot. His recordings (Tim O'Brien, Alison Krauss ...) always sound incredible. Here is a vid where he uses it (with Neumann KM54s) on Sarah Jarosz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9279NjqX5Y
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  #25  
Old 07-20-2020, 07:09 AM
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Vertical pairs are one of the 10 mic positions covered in the old "microphone placement guide for acoustic guitar use" on the Cakewalk website.

http://www.cakewalk.com/Support/Know...coustic-Guitar
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  #26  
Old 07-20-2020, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by guitarman68 View Post
Gary Paczosa is a Nashville producer/engineer who uses the over / under approach a lot. His recordings (Tim O'Brien, Alison Krauss ...) always sound incredible. Here is a vid where he uses it (with Neumann KM54s) on Sarah Jarosz: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9279NjqX5Y
That's a great sound he's getting there - thanks for sharing.
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  #27  
Old 07-20-2020, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
Vertical pairs are one of the 10 mic positions covered in the old "microphone placement guide for acoustic guitar use" on the Cakewalk website.

http://www.cakewalk.com/Support/Know...coustic-Guitar
Thanks - that's a really helpful article.
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  #28  
Old 07-20-2020, 02:20 PM
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Thanks - that's a really helpful article.
It was much better when they used to have sound samples for each mic position shown. I suppose they are archived somewhere...
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