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  #31  
Old 04-12-2020, 11:42 AM
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varmonter varmonter is offline
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Ah, nothing's ever easy, is it? :-). You don't have wi-fi for the ipad?

But nice job on the video!. You do get more control by doing it that way, animation and so on.
thanks... my first attempt..

It says I need permission to collaborate.
with the accapella file you sent me,??
I went over to the library to upload
The new version of that video. Figured I’d bring the mandolin.
Played it a few times through and when i went to record it said I need permission. I hit request and now it says sent.. assuming it’s in your hands now.
To grant permission. ? I live pretty rural our only connection is wireless
Through our cell phone. Hotspot doesn’t work..I think my provider figured
This video stuff was too much...ha. Only 1/2 a gig per file....

Last edited by varmonter; 04-12-2020 at 11:56 AM.
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  #32  
Old 04-12-2020, 12:30 PM
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thanks... my first attempt..

It says I need permission to collaborate.
with the accapella file you sent me,??
I went over to the library to upload
The new version of that video. Figured Iíd bring the mandolin.
Played it a few times through and when i went to record it said I need permission. I hit request and now it says sent.. assuming itís in your hands now.
To grant permission. ? I live pretty rural our only connection is wireless
Through our cell phone. Hotspot doesnít work..I think my provider figured
This video stuff was too much...ha. Only 1/2 a gig per file....

Permission granted. This is the one thing I either don't like or can't figure out how to bend to what I'd like - the workflow on this thing seems to be designed for a "viral" workflow. They want me to like post it on facebook, and then random people request to add a track, and I have to approve. Not so clean if you already know who you want to work with. I'd prefer to be able to create a joint project with my "band" and have everyone just be able to work on it simultaneously without the awkward permissions and mailing links back and forth.
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  #33  
Old 04-13-2020, 03:39 PM
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varmonter varmonter is offline
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Permission granted. This is the one thing I either don't like or can't figure out how to bend to what I'd like - the workflow on this thing seems to be designed for a "viral" workflow. They want me to like post it on facebook, and then random people request to add a track, and I have to approve. Not so clean if you already know who you want to work with. I'd prefer to be able to create a joint project with my "band" and have everyone just be able to work on it simultaneously without the awkward permissions and mailing links back and forth.
Yeah kinda the way i look at it.
Why i went with a video editor.
This app wants all my info and
agreement to auto renew before it will
even let me try...so much for free trial.
I have a disdain for this backdoor style
of business model.. Not that i dont want
to collaborate with your snippet.
Really i do..
probably just not with this app.
I know i can cancel at anytime before
my 7 days is up. Its just that they are
hoping ill forget or wont know how.
or i wont care the few times they
charge my apple account. or
ill get sick of the 9 bucks a month and
buy it outright..
Thats the backdoor i dislike .Also
there's no ownership accapella owns it
all. Not that im famous or am getting
paid for this.. just bugs me.
The video i posted above is certainly
amateur enough. But i think i can get
better(faster,) now that the learning curve has flattened a bit.

Last edited by varmonter; 04-13-2020 at 03:45 PM.
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  #34  
Old 04-13-2020, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by varmonter View Post
Yeah kinda the way i look at it.
Why i went with a video editor.
This app wants all my info and
agreement to auto renew before it will
even let me try...so much for free trial.
Hmm, I got the app free with no problem. Clicked on the app store, downloaded the free version, no payment, nothing up front. Just limited features (30 second limit). I only decided to pay once I thought it was useful enough that I might actually make some full length videos with it.

You actually can download the video to your device or desktop, and you can delete your video in the app, so they aren't going to own anything. My only objection is that the collab workflow isn't ideal for what I want to do. Probably perfect for kids who want to make viral videos with strangers.

The freemium model is definitely a mixed bag. Annoying to download something, only to find the features you want cost something. Of course, it'd also be annoying to pay for something up front that you can't even check out. I kind of prefer full-feature time-limited demos myself, but I'm not sure that's something the app store supports, since I haven't seen any apps doing it. Common on desktop programs.

Anyway, you got your video all figured out, so this isn't something you need. I was just impressed by how simple and slick it was to use,, as long as people in boxes is all you want, and it solves the issues you had. I watched a tutorial by a guy doing it the hard way using an app called WeVideo (which also was a monthly fee kind of thing), and it was incredible to watch how tedious it was for him creating a 12-person box, manually syncing every video, resizing the boxes, etc. And he was spending a lot more money, and doing hours of work, for what could have been "touch the box on the screen and play".

That hasn't stopped me from doing it the hard way for my recent videos, I just use Final Cut, which lets me (i.e "makes me") do a ton more. But if I was doing a big group project and was more casual about the result, Id probably use the app just because it's easier, especially when involving people who don't have the gear or experience with video.
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Last edited by Doug Young; 04-13-2020 at 07:42 PM.
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  #35  
Old 04-13-2020, 08:20 PM
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I had to try this to see what you were experiencing, so I shared the video with my wife. She had to download the app, and then yes, it does ask you to register, pick a user name and a password. I didn't recall that, but I just expect that with any kind of online service. Didn't ask me for anything about payment, just to make up a username, password, and provide an email. Anyway, apps may not be your thing, I know a lot of people get a bit put off by them - my wife was "OMG, I have to register?????", so I get it. I'm pretty much "why not? I can always delete it", but that's just me, pretty comfortable with apps and online accounts. So I get your objection anyway.

Sorry it was a bust for you. Still a cool little app, I'm just excited about ways to collaborate during this lockdown. If anyone else wants to try it, I'm happy to share the very mediocre base track I created.
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  #36  
Old 04-13-2020, 08:47 PM
gfirob gfirob is offline
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So, look, first of all I am a retired television producer so I have my own tendency to judge everything by professional standards, which is really not very helpful.

But here are some facts:
The number of variables in video are so huge that I can’t list them all, frame rates (frames per second), aspect ratio (the shape of the frame) problems with squeezing or stretching when aspect ratios don’t agree (the girl singer is squeezed in your video) resolution problems, contrast and color problems, codec mismatches, it just goes on and on.

And when you consider that there are probably different source devices (iPads, Android, computer cameras, actual cameras) and internet speed issues, lighting issues, framing issues, background issues, skin tone issues, I mean it is such a broad morass that it is difficult to even contain the information.

And then there are all the audio reasons why things might not sync correctly or might sound awful. I won’t even start.

I think this is a pretty hard task you have set for yourself. The musicians that I know who are streaming successfully tend to use the lowest level of tech, smallest number of devices and simplest mass market software and it seems to work for them.

Basic aesthetic issues of how the shot actually looks, the framing and composition, the lighting (not to mention hair and makeup) and background selection, all tend to be secondary to just making it work.

Remember that for no legitimate reason at all, viewers compare your production to very expensive music videos or movies, that is their psychological point of reference. This is a mountain no regular person can climb.

Trying to do a multi-source live stream musical performance in sync sounds so hard that it makes me want to cry. It makes more sense to me to just treat it as a multi camera production, get the best video from each source that you can, making sure everybody is using as close to the same system as possible and then edit in something like Final Cut Pro, professional software from Apple which costs about $200. But even this is beyond the technical reach of most civilians.

The model of Zoom, with a bunch of little awkward windows is something most people are used to now, but it is not nice to look at (as, with respect, your Pancho and Lefty video shows). Most amateurs are satisfied with very low standards, but sadly, most viewers are not.

As a kind of backyard effort, the Pancho and Lefty video is really pretty good and if the goal is simply to make it to the other side, it has succeeded. But I’m afraid that just makes it a novelty.

I apologize again for bringing more informational weight to this discussion that is probably helpful or sounding like a snob. I think it is a noble effort.
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  #37  
Old 04-13-2020, 09:11 PM
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Most amateurs are satisfied with very low standards, but sadly, most viewers are not.
I think for the short term that may not quite be the case. There's been a normalizing factor, where we see videos from even big names shot on a phone, and see bad skype video on cable news, and so on. It's almost refreshing that everyone's been reduced to the same lowest denominator. That may not last past this pandemic period, and I'd think people would overall appreciate higher quality, but right now, everyone seems to be pretty forgiving. Zoom sessions are like "hey, I can see and hear you! Fuzzy and gurgly, but it works. Yay!" :-). And maybe it will inspire people to jump in, and then find ways to get better.
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E-Book: Online Collaboration for Musicians
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  #38  
Old 04-13-2020, 10:05 PM
Jman21 Jman21 is offline
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Na Gfirob I'm with Doug on this. There is definitely a normalization. Varmonter nice work.
Hey Doug send me that base track.
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  #39  
Old 04-13-2020, 10:16 PM
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I've been making a number of non-music videos for work recently, and have found myself lamenting that I actually know a little bit about audio/video production... enough to go through a lot of extra effort to try to make things look and sound better, but without quite enough knowledge or gear to truly raise them up.

Ignorance would be bliss....
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  #40  
Old 04-13-2020, 10:27 PM
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Na Gfirob I'm with Doug on this. There is definitely a normalization. Varmonter nice work.
Hey Doug send me that base track.
Here you go, I'll just post it here. I *believe* the way this works is anyone can click on the link (on an ios device) and it will prompt you to get the app. Then I think, you can ask for permission to collaborate to add your part. I get a notice, and have to grant permission, then you can record. At that point, the dual video becomes "yours", with a new url that you can share. I haven't tried this, but I assume multiple people could add a part - I only set it up for 2 people, but your video could be me+you, and someone else could do it, and get me+them resulting in a completely different video. Haven't tried that, so it's a guess. I'm always up for playing with new toys, so we can see if that's correct, if anyone else is!

Don't expect much from my part. C,F, and G "verse", Am, F, A, G "bridge", alternating bass fingerpicking...

https://mixcord.co/acapella/p/edKSfdBtBLwyW15J5demtQ/
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  #41  
Old 04-14-2020, 09:33 AM
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varmonter varmonter is offline
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I had to try this to see what you were experiencing, so I shared the video with my wife. She had to download the app, and then yes, it does ask you to register, pick a user name and a password. I didn't recall that, but I just expect that with any kind of online service. Didn't ask me for anything about payment, just to make up a username, password, and provide an email. Anyway, apps may not be your thing, I know a lot of people get a bit put off by them - my wife was "OMG, I have to register?????", so I get it. I'm pretty much "why not? I can always delete it", but that's just me, pretty comfortable with apps and online accounts. So I get your objection anyway.

Sorry it was a bust for you. Still a cool little app, I'm just excited about ways to collaborate during this lockdown. If anyone else wants to try it, I'm happy to share the very mediocre base track I created.
Yes thats what it did for me.. once registered and agreement chked you get
auto billed on day 8 of your 7 day free trial...no other way to use it unless you agree ... If it gave me a choice i would have signed up..After day 7 shut me off.
But the autobill thing just bugs me..
.
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  #42  
Old 04-14-2020, 09:41 AM
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varmonter varmonter is offline
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Final cut pro and filmora pro are similar
softwares..Same company..Theres a
learning curve for sure and i paid up
front to download the
software...not cheap but its mine..
Now that i figured out why it wouldnt
sync up with my cajon players track
Which was the premise of my OP.
It will do fine.And its pretty full featured
with video fx and an audio mixer built in.
Theres a lot more i can do to the video
you see here..Just need to put in the time..
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  #43  
Old 04-14-2020, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by varmonter View Post
Yes thats what it did for me.. once registered and agreement chked you get
auto billed on day 8 of your 7 day free trial...no other way to use it unless you agree ... If it gave me a choice i would have signed up..After day 7 shut me off.
But the autobill thing just bugs me..
.
Hmm, somehow I got a totally free version. Limited to 30 seconds. Not paid, not auto-billed. I'll have to check this out later on my wife's ipad.
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E-Book: Online Collaboration for Musicians
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  #44  
Old 04-14-2020, 11:17 AM
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Final cut pro and filmora pro are similar
softwares..Same company..
Final Cut is made by Apple, only available on the app store for Macs. Filmora is made by Wondershare?
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  #45  
Old 04-14-2020, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by varmonter View Post
Yes thats what it did for me.. once registered and agreement chked you get
auto billed on day 8 of your 7 day free trial...no other way to use it unless you agree ... If it gave me a choice i would have signed up..After day 7 shut me off.
But the autobill thing just bugs me..
.

OK, I just finished downloading the app on my wife's ipad. Her experience was the same as mine. Totally free, no subscription, not even a time-limited one. There is a panel that you can bring up that offers an upgrade that says "try it free", which I assume is what you found. But I had to dig to find that, and there's no reason to do that. To just use it, and add to my video, all I had to do was register. I gave them an email not even related to my Apple account, no billing info, and the app store says it's free.

In any case, this was supposed to be a 30 second solution to your issue, not a multi-week ordeal :-) Sorry I led you down a confusing path....
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E-Book: Online Collaboration for Musicians
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CDs: Closing Time, Laurel Mill, Duets (With Teja Gerken)
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