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  #1  
Old 11-13-2018, 01:42 PM
Stringmaster Stringmaster is offline
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Default Another PA/Rig Question

So I'm still trying to wrap my head around setting up/purchasing a system. I've pretty much decided on one of the QSC speaker pairs== CP's or K.2's. Both have built in mixers. Is an external mixer needed? If using an external mixer is a separate preamp also needed (such as the Redeye?). I understand that a separate mixer will give more tonal options (and more channels which I likely won't need), but if a preamp is needed on top of that, couldn't a preamp only go directly into the built in QSC mixer? I anticipate potentially using magnetic and piezo pickups, and perhaps a SBT down the road. The only effects I'll use is maybe a little reverb or delay. I'd like to keep things as simple as possible, yet still get good sound.
Thx again
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:12 PM
jonfields45 jonfields45 is online now
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Another problem a mixer solves is having those controls (and maybe an acceptable reverb for your needs) in a more convenient location than the back of the speakers. I think at least a small mixer like a Yamaha MG06XU is really handy. Also the K.2 series has a menu to deal with which is not what you want to have to remember how to use at a gig.
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Old 11-13-2018, 04:55 PM
Guitaurman Guitaurman is offline
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I Often use my K 10.2s for gigs. You really need a mixer and a DI/Preamp to get the full potential out to the QSCs. While you can just plug a guitar in one channel and a microphone into the other you really don't have the level of control you need for a live show. A mixer is a definite requirement and should offer at least reverb. it's nearly impossible to tweek volume and tone while on stage going directly into the speaker, and of course no effects are available. Also a DI/preamp for the guitar would be needed for impedance matching on some pickups like the K&K.

Getting good sound isn't always cheap but it's worth the effort to me at least.
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Old 11-13-2018, 05:33 PM
gfa gfa is offline
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What will be going into the system? I.e., how many performers with what instruments/vocals?
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Old 11-13-2018, 07:06 PM
Stringmaster Stringmaster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gfa View Post
What will be going into the system? I.e., how many performers with what instruments/vocals?
Just solo guitar/vocal initially, but later might look to expand.

Thanks all for the great input
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:04 PM
Irish Pennant Irish Pennant is offline
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External mixer, yes. Preamp, maybe yes maybe no. It depends on your guitar, it's pickup, which mixer you get and what you think is a good sound. If you do decide to get a pedal, IMO the first pedal someone new to this should get is a Para Acoustic DI (PADI). It's easy to use, solidly built and has improve the sound on just about every guitar I've plugged into it. I host an open mic and I use my old PADI for many of the players that show up. Never had a complaint from any of them on the sound, usually just the opposite, amazement at how well their guitar sounds.
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Old 11-13-2018, 08:08 PM
Stringmaster Stringmaster is offline
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[QUOTE=Irish Pennant;5889542]External mixer, yes. Preamp, maybe yes maybe no. It depends on your guitar, it's pickup, which mixer you get and what you think is a good sound. If you do decide to get a pedal, IMO the first pedal someone new to this should get is a Para Acoustic DI (PADI). It's easy to use, solidly built and has improve the sound on just about every guitar I've plugged into it. I host an open mic and I use my old PADI for many of the players that show up. Never had a complaint from any of them on the sound, usually just the opposite, amazement at how well their guitar sounds.[/QUOTE

Thanks I have an older PADI that I used to use with a Hawaiian resonator guitar in a band—so that could potentially get me going
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Old 11-14-2018, 12:42 AM
The Kid! The Kid! is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitaurman View Post
I Often use my K 10.2s for gigs. You really need a mixer and a DI/Preamp to get the full potential out to the QSCs. While you can just plug a guitar in one channel and a microphone into the other you really don't have the level of control you need for a live show. A mixer is a definite requirement and should offer at least reverb. it's nearly impossible to tweek volume and tone while on stage going directly into the speaker, and of course no effects are available. Also a DI/preamp for the guitar would be needed for impedance matching on some pickups like the K&K.

Getting good sound isn't always cheap but it's worth the effort to me at least.
Great post.

Agreed. I wouldn't ever want to mix on the back of the speaker. Way too inconvenient imo.

Get more channels than you'll need! For solo gigs, I used to use an Allen & Heath Zed 10FX and I'd bring a Zed60 14FX for acoustic trio gigs.

Now I use a Soundcraft EFX 8 and use it for solo, duo, trio, & quartet gigs. Fits in the same space as my Zed 10FX, has twice as many XLR's, and sounds better.

I have a MixWiz 16 if I need more channels and I recently sold a Touchmix 16.

When it comes to mixers, I like having options.

I recently ran a small setup for a singer at a wedding. She played guitar and sang. I brought the Zed 10 and a powered speaker. The Zed 10 is also nice if I ever need to sub mix something into the main board. It was also easy enough for me to show her how to operate so that I could leave.

I now have:

EFX 8 (gets used most)
Zed10FX (2nd)
MixWiz 16 (3rd but rarely)
Zed60 14FX (Probably never because the EFX 8 does the same job, but does it better)
Probably going to sell the Zed60 14FX.

Having the board within reach while you're playing and having the speakers where they need to be, is the way to go. You have everything at your fingertips for EQ, Monitor, and FX adjustments. Imagine having to get up every time something needed to be tweaked.

Last edited by The Kid!; 11-15-2018 at 09:53 PM.
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Old 11-14-2018, 01:06 AM
The Kid! The Kid! is offline
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I'll add:

Don't be too proud to ask for help. When I started out years ago, one of the best things I ever did was ask one of the best sound guys in the area to teach me how to run a PA. For the cost of a few beers, I got a really good foundation.

Fast forward to today, I still get help from the best cats around because I'm always trying to learn more and get better than I was the day before. It has made a big difference.

Last edited by The Kid!; 11-15-2018 at 09:53 PM.
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  #10  
Old 11-14-2018, 06:18 AM
rmp rmp is offline
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Yes, I would agree, ya need a mixer, it opens up a lot of options and potential possibilities. you can get em for pretty easy money these days, especially if you want to get something slightly used. I like to use the phone jack for a pair of ear buds for my own monitoring (acoustic solo work), I can keep the speakers out in front of me a bit too.
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Old 11-14-2018, 09:41 AM
Mandobart Mandobart is offline
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If you select a mixer with high impedance (HI Z) inputs (at least 1megohm) you don't need a preamp for impedance matching. The mixers that offer HI Z usually just have it on 2 channels.
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Old 11-14-2018, 11:31 AM
Stringmaster Stringmaster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandobart View Post
If you select a mixer with high impedance (HI Z) inputs (at least 1megohm) you don't need a preamp for impedance matching. The mixers that offer HI Z usually just have it on 2 channels.
I’ve pretty much decided on the Soundcraft EFX8, which I believe has that option?
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Old 11-14-2018, 02:56 PM
The Kid! The Kid! is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stringmaster View Post
I’ve pretty much decided on the Soundcraft EFX8, which I believe has that option?
No, but don't let that stop you. Plenty of ways to tackle the impedance thing. The EFX sounds amazing. I went from The Zed stuff to it and I'm thrilled.
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Old 11-14-2018, 03:18 PM
Stringmaster Stringmaster is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Kid! View Post
No, but don't let that stop you. Plenty of ways to tackle the impedance thing. The EFX sounds amazing. I went from The Zed stuff to it and I'm thrilled.
Thanks--that's the one I'm gonna go for!
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  #15  
Old 11-15-2018, 04:48 PM
takatsukimike takatsukimike is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stringmaster View Post
I’ve pretty much decided on the Soundcraft EFX8, which I believe has that option?
I personally think the Yamaha MG series are better value at a similar price point. Look at the MG10XU perhaps?

Pros: Inbuilt compression, wider range of effects
Cons: No sweepable mids on the EQ

Last edited by takatsukimike; 11-15-2018 at 04:51 PM. Reason: added more info
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