|
|
#1
06-17-2020, 03:56 PM
|
|||
|
|||
Tango en Skai rolling diminished chords ?
Hi.
I've been playing this a long time now and have it memorized.. But I've always had lots of trouble with the RH execution of the 5 inverting diminished chords.. it's mostly the tiny triplets before each one. No matter how many times I try to keep tempo when the first one appears, plus the remaining 4, I can't get the triplets smooth and feathery at each one. Lately I've been skipping the triplets and just arpeggiating/sliding the chords PIMA PIMA PIMA (or a variation of this)..This makes it a cinch. But then I feel guilty for cheating.... Might someone instruct me on how to do get it the way Dyens wrote it ? Thanks, M (note: Yet I have no problem with the tremolo in Recuerdos de la Alhambra !).. Last edited by MarkinLA; 06-17-2020 at 06:24 PM. 
|
|
#2
06-18-2020, 01:33 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Not sure if this is helpful, or makes sense, but consider the AMI triplet similar to an arpeggiated chord.
Or, rather, play the top three notes as a chord, then strum the four-note chord with the thumb almost claw-hammer style. Once you have the timing tight, just loosen up the AMI timing until it's a perfect triplet. In other words, instead of building up from a tremelo perspective, deconstruct a IMA chord into three notes.
|
|
#3
06-18-2020, 05:04 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Cobalt, this sounds good. Do I understand that instead of tremolo-ing the 3, instead, pluck all 3 at the same time as a separate chord. Then when all 5 diminished chords are going smoothly this way, arpeggiate them on out; no longer tremolo ?
|
|
#4
06-19-2020, 12:48 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
It's been a while since I've had the piece active in my practice, but I do recall my teacher using that method, in addition to others. Another practice is to play the whole piece at whatever slower tempo you need to play 100% perfectly - it gets a bit painful so a metronome and patience helps! So yeah, I found it good to practice a combo of slowly playing the whole piece, slow focus on tough passages, and also modifications to the tough passages that "break apart" the left from the right hand.
I was lucky to see a few masterclasses from Roland Dyens and he consistently stressed the idea that this piece was meant to be rhythmically quite strict, noting that many players apply too much rubato in the harder passages. I'm sure he'd support the value of you practicing the strict rhythm ... it's a Tango after all!
|
|
#5
06-20-2020, 07:42 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
When you say play the top 3 notes as a chord, do you mean pluck the tremolo's F with AMI all cupped together in one stoke, and immediately thumb (pulgar) the five Dim. chords as usual ? And, that this should eventually lead back to the old tremolo being way easier to execute ? See, my problem is not doing tremolo itself. It's the quick change after it to thumbing the chord, both basically belonging in 1 beat ..
Thanks very very much for your attention, CB...Mark PS. If I do get you right, no need reply. Last edited by MarkinLA; 06-23-2020 at 05:27 PM.
|
|
#6
06-23-2020, 05:41 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Sorry, I have to refer to my OP question again because nothing is working.. What is it that Roland Dyens does that seems so smooth and easy, leave alone at that fast a clip ??
Something I've always wondered about was that my P finger does not bend back at the 1st joint. I.E. My thumb can only become straight. And maybe this is the factor which makes the execution so problematic... If I can't cure the problem I guess I'll just have to skip the the 3 tiny ones and just roll and slur the 5 chords on out...
|
|
#7
06-24-2020, 01:43 AM
|
|||
|
|||
|
would you be willing to post a video? Even a temporary one? I'd be interested to see your best attempt "at speed" as well as an attempt that is "as slow as needed to get the rhythm perfect."
But yeah, there are certainly some pieces that you may just want to put some vaseline on a small section just to enjoy playing the piece, and maybe return to the passage later...
|
|
#8
07-10-2020, 04:24 PM
|
|||
|
|||
|
Hi..Sorry for delayed reply..
I've no camera equipment and don't want to deal with the camera on this PC.. One thing I have become aware of is that I need to brush by the a.m.i.-s much lighter..I do still have trouble though and am likely going to just skip them and roll the 5 diminished inversions with p.i.m.a. or even a just a downward thumb and leave it at that since I'm not going to be concertizing at 72... Ya win some; ya lose some...Maybe I'm just loathsome !!!  Thanks, M
|
