Advice for a potential Taylor newbie

[brimcfarland]

Hi there

I’m looking at possibly my first Taylor, very intrigued by the sound and play of the Grand Auditorium models, as they seem sort of like an OM with a Dread-like depth.
I am long time Martin owner, and just like I’m impressed with how Martin's M36 takes a 000 or OM body depth and puts it in a wider body, it seems like Taylor went the other way with their thinking and makes the body depth 4 5/8” deep on a "OM-ish" bout size? The sound is distinctly different.

A couple questions, are there eras to avoid in Taylor’s? For example, 70’s and 90’s Martins tend to be their less desirable years (YMMV), for workmanship. Did Taylor have any less perfect periods?
And, this new V-class bracing, is it worth looking and paying new prices. I’ve been traditionally a Used buyer.

Looking at a very nice clean 714e non cutaway right now, mid 90’s era. I believe it’s Sitka Top, EIR back and sides. Just enough bling to be pretty, but not overdone for my taste. Would $1500 be a reasonable price with case?

Thanks in advance for any answers to my multiple questions, I think it’s time to have one of these nice Taylors in the stable.

[SpruceTop]

$1500 seems quite reasonable for that '90s-era 714e but it likely has a barndoor preamp, correct? It also won't have the desirable, IMHO, Taylor NT Neck Joint. If you like the Martin tone and the Taylor Grand auditorium shape, let me suggest you consider a Taylor 314ce thru 814ce Series guitar from the 2014 to 2018 era. These models will have Andy Powers-designed changes that bring more bass resonance to the typically well-balanced Taylor sound. These guitars will also have the ES2 pickup/preamp system. Having auditioned a new Taylor Grand Pacific 317e and having just bought a Taylor Grand Pacific 717e Builder's Edition, I also like the new V-Class braced guitars. All the acoustic guitars in my signature are 2014 and newer but I've owned many brands of guitars from 1975 to 2014, including many Taylors and Martins, so I think I can give you a well-informed albeit still subjective view into the tonal characteristics of several brands.

[RP]

First of all, welcome to AGF. You'll probably get lots of responses, but all will be personal opinions and not necessarily gospel. I love Taylors but freely admit that my opinions will not necessarily agree with other diehard Taylor fans (or haters for that matter.) The easy one to answer is that I don't believe that there are any eras to avoid. Taylor is known for innovation in its short history so I believe that you'll find differences, but not really good and bad years. I think that Taylor's Grand Auditoriums are the perfect size.

Some people feel that somewhere in the 90s were the Golden Age of Taylor Guitars. I don't necessarily agree but many will. I really don't think that Taylor has been around long enough to have a Golden Age, especially for a company that is so innovative. Having said that, a mid-nineties Taylor may be just the ticket, and someone who touts that era as the gold standard may think that $1500 is reasonable. Obviously condition is a big factor so it's hard to objectively assess.

Tone is clearly subjective, and the V-Class Taylors have both their proponents and detractors. Your questions are good ones, but unfortunately, answers will probably come down to, "It just depends."

[GCWaters]

I have a ‘99 814c....It’s as good as one from any other era...love it!

[brimcfarland]

Thanks for the answers so far, I appreciate them and I know that there will be a lot of opinions. That’s the beauty and the "curse" of this wonderful new Interweb world.

What type of bracing is used in these 90’s models? Is it the standard X-bracing that seems to cross over from other makers like Martin? Or was Taylor starting to do some of their "Performance" bracing on the 700’s back then yet?

I’m kind of wondering how much of this is all just different terminology for the same build techniques, or if it is actually significantly different engineering than what I’m used to hearing about Martin guitars.

Like, the "Relief Rout", lol. Sounds like where the band goes during a break.. we had one in an old KingAir I used to fly. 😎

[donlyn]

Originally Posted by brimcfarland

. . . I think it’s time to have one of these nice Taylors in the stable.

Just, yeah.

To echo what RP wrote, while Taylors may not be everyone's cup of tea, I believe that if nothing else, they have the best consistency in producing quality product 'time after time'.

Best answer to most searching questions is to always to play as many guitars as possible. At least until you find one that says 'take me home tonight'. And you will know it's right when you imagine Ronnie singing in your ear, 'be my little baby'.

Just so you know where I am coming from, I am a big fan of Taylor guitars, and an even bigger fan of their bigger guitars. But all my Taylors were made before V bracing. So try 'em all, from the Concerts to the Orchestras. I was impressed by a new deluxe Auditorium model recently. A couple of the nicer Taylors that were certainly purchase worthy over recent years were 816 Grand Symphony models. Ever so slightly larger size than an Auditorium but made for a bigger voice. Oh, and there was this one 812ce 12 fret Concert that I still think about sometimes.

Enjoy the chase.

Don
.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by donlyn

A couple of the nicer Taylors that were certainly purchase worthy over recent years were 816 Grand Symphony models. Ever so slightly larger size than an Auditorium but made for a bigger voice.

Enjoy the chase.

Don
.

To further expand on potential models to consider, the Taylor Grand Orchestra models seem to have gotten lost in all the noise and hype over this brand and that brand and this model and that model but they are really a sonic feast for the ears for players who don't mind a fairly large guitar, I've had both the 818e First Edition and subsequently, my current 618e. I think players would also be rewarded by auditioning any of the 2015 to 2018, 600 Series models as they offer something IMHO that maple back-and-sides guitars hadn't sounded like until these redesigned models arrived.

[AZLiberty]

Originally Posted by brimcfarland

Hi there

I am long time Martin owner, and just like I’m impressed with how Martin's M36 takes a 000 or OM body depth and puts it in a wider body, it seems like Taylor went the other way with their thinking and makes the body depth 4 5/8” deep on a "OM-ish" bout size? The sound is distinctly different.
.

What Taylor actually did was copy Guild's 16" mini-Jumbo size. My 1973 Guild G-212 and my Taylor GA3-12 are almost exactly the same size.

The GA ends up being much closer to a 0000 than an OM body.

[vindibona1]

I think you have to play the instrument for yourself. Taylor, while generally accepted as a good guitar brand has a fairly wide window of consistency from unit to unit. Expand that to various years of manufacturing and iteration and any guitar could be a gem or a dog.

It is my personal opinion that while Taylor has been extremely innovative in many ways while some things have been improvements to the sound, playability or adjustment of the instrument, they have not always been improvements, sometimes tradeoffs between player benefits and company benefits, but sometimes exclusively margin boosters that they have marketed the daylights out of as improvements or the newest/latest/greatest thing which the marketplace would largely accept... and on occasion did not.

I would never recommend buying an acoustic guitar not personally auditioned, especially a used one. The price seems fairly reasonable. But again, only you can determine if the deal suits you.

[jazzer44]

Originally Posted by brimcfarland

Hi there
And, this new V-class bracing, is it worth looking and paying new prices. I’ve been traditionally a Used buyer.

It depends on what you want the guitar to do for you. For instance if you enjoy playing Wildwood Flower around the campfire, for fun, with few or no other musicians, any X brace swirl tone guitar like Martin would suit your needs fine, especially for the beginner.
If you need to depend on your guitar to come through in many different situations, play in a larger group setting, getting into more advanced stuff say beyond G, C, D7, more soloing, or accompany a singer then V brace or any parallel brace true tone guitar (like archtop) be the wiser choice. Reason is the strings ring truer on true tone guitars, so there aren't as many conflicting frequencies which cause poor intonation, uneven response, and overall noisy sound.

[zmf]

Originally Posted by jazzer44

..... getting into more advanced stuff say beyond G, C, D7, then V brace or any parallel brace true tone guitar (like archtop) be the wiser choice.

That's a bold statement, sir.

I've been known to occasionally throw in a relative minor among those three mentioned chords, and x bracing seems adequate.

[donlyn]

brimcfarland,

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

To further expand on potential models to consider, the Taylor Grand Orchestra models seem to have gotten lost in all the noise and hype over this brand and that brand and this model and that model but they are really a sonic feast for the ears for players who don't mind a fairly large guitar, I've had both the 818e First Edition and subsequently, my current 618e. I think players would also be rewarded by auditioning any of the 2015 to 2018, 600 Series models as they offer something IMHO that maple back-and-sides guitars hadn't sounded like until these redesigned models arrived.

Last time I checked Taylor's website, the only Grand Orchestra model that wasn't discontinued was the 818ce. I suspect they will be converted to V bracing soon.

For what it's worth, my 818e is my desert isle guitar. I've had it for the better part of 5 years. I fingerpick everything, and I string it with Elixir PB HD lights (light bass gauge with medium treble gauge, .013 - .053). Kind of equalizes the bass a bit to go with the medium trebles. It's very responsive to light fingerpicking. I also have a 12 string spruce/rosewood Grand Orchestra.

Try to find some new or used Grand Orchestras out there to try. Again, it's worth it to try all the Taylor models, from Grand Concert to Grand Orchestra. Even better if you can try them with the same wood combination to get the best comparison.

Don
.

[zmf]

Originally Posted by brimcfarland

Hi there

I’m looking at possibly my first Taylor, very intrigued by the sound and play of the Grand Auditorium models, as they seem sort of like an OM with a Dread-like depth.

Looking at a very nice clean 714e non cutaway right now, mid 90’s era. I believe it’s Sitka Top, EIR back and sides. Just enough bling to be pretty, but not overdone for my taste. Would $1500 be a reasonable price with case?

The only Taylor I've owned was a GA (514), and I found it to be a comfortable guitar with a big enough sound.

I'd suggest that, unless you want to amplify, you might search for one without electronics.

[brimcfarland]

Thanks for all the thoughts, info and opinions!

I’ve only ever bought one guitar that I hadn’t played before buying, a ‘78 Guild F412 that I’ve never regretted buying, and the price was just too good to pass on.

Having said that, I probably won’t do it agin with anything that’s gonna be a real keeper, and the problem I see out there is that even as prolific as Taylor seems to be with production, I don’t see as many Used ones to try out as I do Martins. Maybe I just haven’t been looking as much, and now that I’m sort of GAS-ing over one, I’ll come across them.

Thanks for the suggestion on the 600 series, I love the Maple projection of my Guild. And the Grand Orchestra models are something I’ll be watching for as well.

I’m confused about the term "swirl tone" in regards to Martins, and "True Tone", which must be the Taylor version of Martin superiority that I hear on the Martin-only forums, LOL. Maybe if I learn an Am, some Sus chords and some Mixolydian, I’ll be good enough to play a Taylor? ;^)

CHEERS all, lots of stuff to ponder, now to go find some to play!

[AndrewG]

Whilst I have owned a couple of nice Taylors (314 and 25th Anniversary D), it would seem that, like Ovation, non-electro models appear to be getting fewer as the years go by-especially in the more affordable series. Everything seems to be 'e' or 'ec'. It would be nice to see the pure acoustics return-and yes, I know they can be ordered, but I prefer to play before I buy; especially when shelling out a considerable sum. The least expensive non-electro I could find on Taylor's website was the 317 at $1700.