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Old 11-10-2010, 01:59 PM
makikogi makikogi is offline
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Default better monitoring

Ok so I'm kinda glad I have this problem as I feel my ears are getting more and more discerning, but there is such a monitoring difference between things it's driving me nuts. I'll record something, and mix through my headphones, reference monitors, and PC speakers to get an idea of how it sounds compared to professional recordings, and just when I think I have the mix and mastering to my liking I play it through my car stereo and sounds like poo!!

I listened to my latest track today in my car and it just sounds super thin and brittle, the mids sound too scooped, and there's a bit too much presence in the high end that makes it sound a bit too shrill. Initially I was thinking (just like all us gas-y people) I should upgrade my pre's, but my digi002 has the older focusrite pre's (some argue these were better pre's than the more current 002 pre's) and my presonus eureka pre aren't bad pre's.

Any recommendations to help my issue? http://www.box.net/shared/m99euizq5y here's the track I'm reffering to...I just can't seem to get that fullness and meatiness that professional studio's put out...
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Rainsong WS1000
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Old 11-10-2010, 03:34 PM
wgmiller wgmiller is offline
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It's sounds pretty darn good on my old eMac.

Will
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Old 11-10-2010, 04:08 PM
Fran Guidry Fran Guidry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makikogi View Post
Ok so I'm kinda glad I have this problem as I feel my ears are getting more and more discerning, but there is such a monitoring difference between things it's driving me nuts. I'll record something, and mix through my headphones, reference monitors, and PC speakers to get an idea of how it sounds compared to professional recordings, and just when I think I have the mix and mastering to my liking I play it through my car stereo and sounds like poo!!

I listened to my latest track today in my car and it just sounds super thin and brittle, the mids sound too scooped, and there's a bit too much presence in the high end that makes it sound a bit too shrill. Initially I was thinking (just like all us gas-y people) I should upgrade my pre's, but my digi002 has the older focusrite pre's (some argue these were better pre's than the more current 002 pre's) and my presonus eureka pre aren't bad pre's.

Any recommendations to help my issue? http://www.box.net/shared/m99euizq5y here's the track I'm reffering to...I just can't seem to get that fullness and meatiness that professional studio's put out...
If it sounds good on three different playback systems but bad on one I would never think of replacing preamps. In spite of the bizarre fascination with preamps that has arisen in our postmodern world, their influence compared to most parts of the chain _should_ be quite small, and in my experience this has always been the case.

I'm hoping that you're listening to the same reference recordings on all your systems.

OK, I downloaded your track and played it through my Dynaudio BM6 monitors. What are your current ref monitors? To my ears this track was unbearably bright, so I'd say your car system is giving you better feedback than your reference monitors.

Are your tracking levels anything like the levels I see in your mastered version?

I think it's a lovely song, cool arrangement, great playing, but I can't listen to more than a second or two without my tinnitus kicking in.

Hmmmm, I turned the volume waaaay down and things are a bit easier to listen to. What is the sound pressure level at your monitoring position? If you monitor at a low level (which saves your ears) you still need to crank up to 85 dB every now and then because human hearing is non-linear with respect to volume. We rolloff highs and lows until the SPL gets near 85 db. Are you playing back louder in the car than in your recording room?

Fran
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Old 11-10-2010, 04:46 PM
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Bob Womack Bob Womack is online now
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Nice song, nice mix, except... The high hat, ride, and crashes are overbearing - way too loud. Okay, the voice is a little bright and so is the rhythm guitar. However... Here's a little rule of thumb for cymbals: Unless the cymbals are out by themselves without the ensemble, you shouldn't be able to hear all the details of their sounding. In your recording I could hear the bead of the stick go "ping" and zing as the waves travel across the face of the cymbal and ending whiz, all rather intimately. While I like to be that intimate with the cymbals, running them that loud dooms your mix to sound... thin and bright. Try backing them off and I bet your mix will fatten right up. Once you've gotten the cymbals back, listen to the voice and R. guitar.

Cheers!

Bob
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Old 11-10-2010, 05:23 PM
makikogi makikogi is offline
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good stuff guys! thanks a bunch...Fran, yea I listened to the mix through my krk rokit 8's and powered rokit subs at a much louder db level and that totalally did it! Heard all the crappiness...Bob, good suggestion, I will definitely back off some of the cymbals as those definitely caused me to cringe whenever they hit.

But now I'm wondering should I listen to the mix at louder dB's with my mixing phones also? (Beyer Dynamics DT 770 pro) I can't tell so much with those...
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Rainsong WS1000
Taylor "T6" Custom w/added element UST
USA Tele Deluxe
Ibanex SRX-500
Vox AC-15

Korg Pitch Black (2x), Fishman Aura 16, BBE Sonic Stomp, LR Baggs PADI, Boss TU-2, Sansamp Tech21 Bass Driver, Boss GE-7 Bass EQ, MXR Micro Amp, Keely BD-2, Fulltone OCD, Fulltone Fulldrive 2 Mosfet, Boss DD-20, BBE supacharger

Up next: Empress EQ, Radial J48
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Old 11-10-2010, 06:15 PM
Fran Guidry Fran Guidry is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makikogi View Post
good stuff guys! thanks a bunch...Fran, yea I listened to the mix through my krk rokit 8's and powered rokit subs at a much louder db level and that totalally did it! Heard all the crappiness...Bob, good suggestion, I will definitely back off some of the cymbals as those definitely caused me to cringe whenever they hit.

But now I'm wondering should I listen to the mix at louder dB's with my mixing phones also? (Beyer Dynamics DT 770 pro) I can't tell so much with those...
Don't damage your hearing. Phones are too risky for high volume stuff if you ask me.

Fran
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Old 11-10-2010, 07:24 PM
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You can establish the proper level (85db) on your monitor speakers using a DB meter like the one from Radio Snack and then switch back and forth until you get the headphones subjectively at the same level. Once you do that, you can mark the levels with a Chinagraph grease pencil. The Chinagraph can be removed with rubbing alcohol later. Like Fran said, protect your hearing.

Bob
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