Tonedexter Review in Acoustic Guitar Magazine

[BluesKing777]

Acoustic Guitar Magazine features a review of the Tonedexter in their gear reviews:


http://acousticguitar.com/gear-revie...xter-preampdi/


I think they may have re-packaged Doug Young's video review we have seen here already but added a text by Adam Perlmutter?


Either way, I am glad I bought mine before the rush! Part of my acousti-electronic furniture now!

BluesKing777.

[shufflebeat]

Interesting and thanks for the link.

It's all a bit info-mercial, probably to be expected I suppose. There is a useful, in depth review of this little box to be written, maybe in a more critical style (given the price tag) based on a longer period of assessment.

The TD will not be for everyone but this kind of writing does not help to differentiate between those for whom it will be a staple tool and others for whom it will be an expensive mistake.

[martingitdave]

Here's my $0.02:

I classify pickup systems into two categories: ones that are truly "plug and play" and those that require pedals and preamps. I define "plug and play" as a system which can do two jobs: first, it requires no major outboard EQ and can be inserted directly into any flat response PA system and get a natural sound. Second, it has the ability to correct for non flat response systems on the fly. That's a tall order. The number of truly "plug and play" pickup systems on the market can be counted on one hand. And, with the exception of LR Baggs Anthem, most are only found in proprietary guitar packages like Maton, Martin, Taylor, Takamine, etc. Internal microphones are a whole different issue of course.

In the second category is everything else. I mean EVERYTHING. And, they all require some sort of outboard EQ from a pedal, digital mixer, qualified sound-person, etc. just to sound natural into a flat response speaker. And, you can forget about compensating for bad PA systems. That's NOT plug and play. That's plug and pray. :-)

So, my argument is this: Not everyone can or will buy a guitar and put a "plug and play" pickup in it. There's a lot of stuff in the guitar to make those pickups sound their best. Lots of people simple don't play out enough to warrant that. So, if you're going to spend money on a pedal to make a lower impact pickup sound better, why on Earth would you buy anything but the ToneDexter for $400 (tip: Shoreline music offers a 10% discount to AGF members) which makes your guitar sound like it was studio mic'ed? Buy once. Cry once. Other pedals that don't do that range in cost from $200 to $400 anyway. And, if you're going to use a pickup with the ToneDexter, why use anything but the lightest weight simple passive K&K?

Anyway, this is my justification for having a few systems. One truly plug and play Fishman Aura system for a security blanket when I don't know what I'm going to find on the other end of the guitar cable. And, the K&K/ToneDexter pairing for situations when I can accommodate a pedal. Oh, and a LR Baggs Lyric mic just to make my life impossibly complicated. LOL

[shufflebeat]

I would endorse your post 100% if this were guaranteed:

Originally Posted by martingitdave

...which makes your guitar sound like it was studio mic'ed...

but that is a big claim which might be supported in some cases but will certainly not be the universal experience.

Also, as was suggested in the review, in some circumstances the super-clacky 2d sound of an unreconstructed piezo UST is just what's required. This is not an opinion I would have subscribed to as a player but as a sound-tech I find it much more appealing.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by shufflebeat

I would endorse your post 100% if this were guaranteed:
but that is a big claim which might be supported in some cases but will certainly not be the universal experience.

Don't we get get the luxury of a little poetic license? LOL In all seriousness, my experience with ToneDexter has been fairly miraculous. But, like all systems, it is GI/GO. The user has to take at least a minimum level of care, and use a competent mic to do the training. If they do, I'm confident they will get studio mic'ed results.

[gfirob]

Much better review at prosoundweb.com:

https://www.prosoundweb.com/channels...ment-preampdi/

But the Acoustic Guitar review linked here is a good mainstream outlet and I’m happy for Audio Sprockets. Not a terribly well written review, but I hope it creates a greater understanding of the device.

I agree with Martingitdave’s read on the Tonedexter, and while I also agree that it is not going to be the best bet for 100% of performance situations, I think it is the best bet for any situation where the true quality of the guitar’s acoustic sound is important to the performer (and the audience).

I also think that sometimes conversations about the Tonedexter split way too many hairs, and get lost in the weeds of technical and/or geek nuance. At the very least the Tonedexter dramaticaly solves a basic and common problem—how to amplify the sound of an acoustic guitar while preserving the genuine character of the instrument. Nothing else comes even close to the Tonedexter in this regard IMHO.

[caballero59]

After trying many other things, I tried the Tonedexter. It showed promise but I returned it. One of the most difficult concepts for me to grasp is "...my guitar only louder" is simply not a practical concept for live and the more members of the band, the more impractical. Where I stand at the moment is the sound of the Palathetic in my Takamine TF360SBG into a good preamp with a studio-grade compressor in the effects loop (to dampen that initial attack) is about as good as I can get for practical, amplified tone. I'm considering adding a Dazzo to the Palathetic for a dual source but there we go again...

Ignoring feedback for the moment, I'm starting to believe that a good live acoustic tone is not the sound of your box sitting in your lap. That tone is too easily covered up.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by caballlero59

Ignoring feedback for the moment, I'm starting to believe that a good live acoustic tone is not the sound of your box sitting in your lap. That tone is too easily covered up.

Several folks have made a similar statement. And, I think it a loud ensemble it is important to be able to have a guitar with a punchy tone. You're correct that the mic'ed acoustic tone can get lost in the mix. But, as stated above, if you are looking for that "guitar only louder" tone, and many of us do, it's probably the best option available today.

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by caballlero59

After trying many other things, I tried the Tonedexter. It showed promise but I returned it. One of the most difficult concepts for me to grasp is "...my guitar only louder" is simply not a practical concept for live and the more members of the band, the more impractical. Where I stand at the moment is the sound of the Palathetic in my Takamine TF360SBG into a good preamp with a studio-grade compressor in the effects loop (to dampen that initial attack) is about as good as I can get for practical, amplified tone. I'm considering adding a Dazzo to the Palathetic for a dual source but there we go again...

Ignoring feedback for the moment, I'm starting to believe that a good live acoustic tone is not the sound of your box sitting in your lap. That tone is too easily covered up.

I have said this before so I hate to repeat myself, but I too came to a similar conclusion. For me though, the main thing with the Tonedexter was turning the blend down to something like a 50/50 mix. I just found the wavemaps to be too natural and it didn't work in a live setting. Bringing more of the piezo pickup back in really helped.

The Dazzo is an intriguing option, especially now that they have teamed up with sunnaudio to create an active system. I am just hesitant to invest that much money into another experiment.

[shufflebeat]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Don't we get get the luxury of a little poetic license? LOL

Fair enough, I may have lost my sense of perspective when I first saw the pricetag.

In all seriousness, my experience with ToneDexter has been fairly miraculous. But, like all systems, it is GI/GO. The user has to take at least a minimum level of care, and use a competent mic to do the training. If they do, I'm confident they will get studio mic'ed results.

I think I'm (relatively) well practiced in mic-pointing and button pushing over many painful and (relatively) expensive years and, while I would certainly acknowledge an impressive improvement over the dry pickup, the TD has not earned a first-team place on my pedal board yet. I'm a long-term Fishman Aura and Yamaha AG Stomp user but neither option was simply "plug & go", there was an extended process of "try, tweak & learn to love" which left me with two distinct but pleasing outcomes. I would expect the same with the TD.

My main issue with such a full throated endorsement is that many folks I know who would benefit from a well set up TD will never get past the training process. There are a significant number of users who have not achieved "studio mic'ed results" but an unusable hollowed out mush. A better training process might have transformed their experience but not everyone is equipped with the gear or the skill to get there and £460 (the UK price) is a hell of an entry fee into that lottery when other, less sophisticated but more reliable (and cheaper) options exist.

For the record my most impressive outcome so far has been with a Barcus Berry (piezo) fitted fiddle and a Rode nt3 and as a result have contacted several other players who I know would be interested to explore the possibilities.

Onward and Upward.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

The Dazzo is an intriguing option, especially now that they have teamed up with sunnaudio to create an active system. I am just hesitant to invest that much money into another experiment.

I've been down the same road with the same reservations, and whilst I respect the enthusiasm and support that surrounds the Tone Dexter, I let mine go. I have recently rolled the dice on the Dazzo / SunnAudio combination, and am delighted with the results.

[gfirob]

I’m sure people like me (for whom the Tonedexter really was a game changer and essential problem solver) will provide full throated endorsements and people who (for whatever reason) didn’t have that experience won’t. I have simply never used or heard a pickup/preamp combination that comes anywhere near the Tonedexter’s ability to reproduce the genuine sound of the guitar. And I have used it in a performance setting, as a solo performer many times. I find the training process simple and enjoyable. I borrowed the best mikes I could.

But I have not used it as part of a group. And I accept the realities of sometimes needing a plug and play situation and just living with the K&K’s as they are under those circumstances. Given the cost of a good pickup and a good preamp, the Tonedexter’s cost (together with a K&K) seems about average, at least here in the States.

So to each his own. I stick with my full throated enthusiasm. If your mileage differed, well, God bless you…

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by AndyC

I've been down the same road with the same reservations, and whilst I respect the enthusiasm and support that surrounds the Tone Dexter, I let mine go. I have recently rolled the dice on the Dazzo / SunnAudio combination, and am delighted with the results.

Have you tried the K&K or Amulet M before? Would like to know how the Dazzo compares in your opinion.

[The Kid!]

Awesome! I’m so glad I got mine when I did.

[Gordon Currie]

I have the Dazzo in one guitar and K+K in all others. I also use ToneDexter.

So far I like the Dazzo somewhat better. I think of it as the K+K without the midrange accentuation (which does help in some situations) and with more of a pronounced attack, making it sound more "alive."

Although I want to try out the Dazzo with the SunnAudio stage DI, I have no illusions that it will in any way "equal" the ToneDexter. It may get me to a sound where I can leave the ToneDexter at home for certain gigs, and it will be worth it for that.