String Advice and strap question

[steve617]

Im brand new to classical guitar. I just purchased a J Navarro CN-61. I know that they are made in China but to me it sounds fine and im happy with it. Anyway I'm wanting to get new strings, it came with Savarez med tension. Im going to use the guitar for accompaniment myself singing mainly at church on slower hymns. I've read were perhaps a ball end dean markley may be my best bet. I'm not against buying strings. Just want to get a good string that will fit what im going to play. Also since they are no strap pins was thinking on getting the Levy-nylon uke/classical soundhole strap. Thats for advice.

[dosland]

In my experience, Savarez make better strings than Markley, and in your position I might explore different string tensions within the Savarez brand than move to a different brand. If you're committed to a different brand, d'addario makes a number of different strings that are also better than the Markleys, and you might also have good luck with LaBella. I put my own strap buttons on a guitar a few years back for about $4, I never really liked the way those sound hole straps mount to the guitar - and cut into my neck (I had an old-school string one that surely has been superseded by something more comfy!).

Edit: forgot to mention that juststrings.com has a pretty solid range of strings for all sorts of nylon-playing people.

[steve617]

After my original post i read were labella 830 folk singer maybe good. Read that was what willie uses. Also would going to a higher tension be the direction to go if i stay with savarez.

[Garthman]

Originally Posted by steve617

After my original post i read were labella 830 folk singer maybe good. Read that was what willie uses. Also would going to a higher tension be the direction to go if i stay with savarez.

I use La Bella nylon strings just about exclusively (their 850 and 900 series) - they are just as good (slightly better?) than Savarez and substantially cheaper.

The 830 Folk Singer set you mention are ball-end and are very good strings. You don't need to use ball-end strings on a traditional classical guitar - the bridge is designed to tie on loop-end strings - but there is no reason you can't use ball-end if you prefer to do so (despite what a certain person here may say).

I prefer high tension strings to low tension ones but really that is down to personal choice - it's worth experimenting with different strings to discover which suits your playing style and sound preference.

[Dave T]

You haven't explained why you think the ball-end strings would be more suitable for you. I am unaware of any advantage they would have (sound wise), only that they let one skip learning how to tie on nylons.

It's your guitar and your choice but I wouldn't use ball-end strings on a classical.

Dave

[steve617]

I never mentioned i had to have a ball end i just asked what a good string to try. Would like to try labella just would like so guidance what strings to get for what im going to play. Tying the strings is fine with me.

[scottishrogue]

Originally Posted by Garthman

The 830 Folk Singer set you mention are ball-end and are very good strings. You don't need to use ball-end strings on a traditional classical guitar - the bridge is designed to tie on loop-end strings - but there is no reason you can't use ball-end if you prefer to do so (despite what a certain person here may say).

Garth is correct. La Bella strings are an excellent choice, and I use the 830 Folk Singer ball-end strings on several of my guitars, if they have a pin style bridge. I use the La Bella 900 Golden Elite Lights (plain-ends) on several of my classical guitars, with the tie-block bridge.

Beginner students sometimes prefer to use ball-end strings on a tie-block bridge because they don't know any better, and they don't have to learn how to properly anchor plain-end strings. They don't realize the damage caused by using the wrong strings. Knowledgeable professionals that play high-end classical guitars use the plain-end strings...except Willie Nelson. The bridge on his Martin N-20 guitar has been specially reinforced, to allow him to use ball-end strings. If using ball-end strings were good to use on a classical guitar, all professional guitar players would be using them...it's just not done, as it looks tacky and unprofessional, and I've heard they often break.

Glen

[Garthman]

Originally Posted by scottishrogue

. . . . . Beginner students sometimes prefer to use ball-end strings on a tie-block bridge because they don't know any better, and they don't have to learn how to properly anchor plain-end strings. They don't realize the damage caused by using the wrong strings. . . .
Glen

See ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ {facepalm thingy}

[scottishrogue]

Originally Posted by Garthman

See ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ {facepalm thingy}

Hahahahahaha! Garth, you knew I'd chime in. I just feel a new classical guitar student should not be using short cuts with no benefit. While there are numerous ways to string your guitar, in this case doing it the "traditional" way is the best way. If you want your guitar to look like Willie Nelson's "Trigger" then using ball-end nylon strings would be a good start. But, for anyone playing a high-quality handmade classical guitar, you should learn how to string your guitar correctly. That's my story and I'm sticking to it!

Glen

[Garthman]

Glen, I have no problem with the notion that everyone should learn to tie strings on a traditional classical guitar - why not do it that way? And most of the time that's precisely what I do. But when a guitar's top has lifted as it ages using ball-end strings is the only way to get a reasonable break angle of the strings over the bridge - it may not look as good but it's better than ditching the guitar.

What I object to is the erroneous claim that using ball-end strings causes damage - it doesn't! - there is no evidence that it does. It's just something you've read, written by a so-called "expert". It's nonsense.

[steve617]

Just a FYI. I use to have a classical acoustic electric and tied my strings all the time. As my original post i was asking for a string recommendation. The ones i asked about was ball ends. Only one reply about a string to try. So tying was never an issue. Not really a classical player just a player playing a classical guitar.

[scottishrogue]

When belly bulge or bridge lift begins to occur, that is a sign something is wrong. Rather than do something to make the problem worse, it makes better sense (to me) to fix the problem. This is when you install a "Bridge Doctor" then humidify the guitar (after removing the strings from the tie-block) for about a week with a "damp it" and then re-glue the bridge with a bridge clamp. Good as new! Remove "Bridge Doctor" for the future use or leave in place until needed.

Glen

[dosland]

Originally Posted by steve617

Just a FYI. I use to have a classical acoustic electric and tied my strings all the time. As my original post i was asking for a string recommendation. The ones i asked about was ball ends. Only one reply about a string to try. So tying was never an issue. Not really a classical player just a player playing a classical guitar.

I'm always in favor of the higher tension options, when they exist. But the guitar manufacturers are the ones who really know what their instruments are designed to deal with, so you might want to poke around on their site first. Somewhere, on this forum or another one, is a table that someone made showing the actual string tensions for the various manufacturers - every company has a different idea of what "high," "medium," and "normal" tension means (or hard and all its iterations), so you can get a sense of how the Savarez mediums stack up against the other companies. I've been served just fine by the d'addario exps, in extra hard, that came with my guitar, and because I don't play terribly frequently, they last for a very very long time, even in quite humid conditions. If you have easy access to lots of brands (and unlimited funds...), you might try different types two weeks at a time and see how you think they compare on your guitar. Of course, some strings take longer than others to really break in, but I think two weeks should be enough time to give you a solid feel for what the strings will do.

Good luck in your search!

[drjond56]

I use my classical at church some and then is usually in a mix with steel strings. I generally like hard tension. I actually like LaBella and Savarez but I like the sets with the wound 3rd (G) string. Both companies make hard tension, wound 3rd sets.

Jon

[steve617]

Thanks for the suggestions and advice.