"Dark" sitka top? Huh?

[SlopeD]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

That sounds purely logical, but ...

Indialogues with both sellers, before I bought them - both guitars were unused and lived in their (pristie) TKL cases under the bed, or in a cupboard.

It was fairly obvious that neither had actually been used.

(the previous DS1 owner said that he had mis-ordered it and really wanted a D1, and the DS2h (the lighter one) was bought by a guy who wanted to buy a guitar "to learn on!" from a shop that was selling up before closing down.

Both have received a lot more sunlight sine I've had them but the more used DS2h has not yet half the suntan of the DS1.

well, it could have hung on a wall in a shop by a window or he doesn't remember leaving it out or he bought it from a guy and on and on.

[Tnfiddler]

My 1995 810 has a pretty dark top on it too.

[lowrider]

Interesting thing with Martin guitars; a guitar with ''aged toner'' will be frozen in time and the color doesn't change, guitar with natural finish will eventually darken to a tone similar to the aged toner guitar but much nicer, an X series with minimal finish will turn dark brown if it's given enough time.

[AcousticDreams]

Originally Posted by ljguitar

Hi SM

Because they are made of wood?

Here is an older picture of my 3 main acoustics (12 years old) - Olson Dreadnought - Cedar top, Kronbauer Mini-jumbo - Sitka top, Bashkin OM - Italian Spuce top.



The Sitka is quite dark compared to most guitars I see, but alongside my Olson Cedar top it's definitely not that dark. I like it matched with the Koa for cosmetics, and it has a pretty bright tone. I NEVER put 80/20 strings on it (turns it into a buzz saw).

Love the picture of your guitars together. Warmth and uniformity. Very classy against that white wall and window created shadows.

[Wade Hampton]

There’s no mystery to it: the reason the spruce top on one guitar is darker than the other are natural color differences found in two different pieces of spruce. Both are well within the color range of what’s normal. The speculation that one previous owner left the darker guitar out on a stand but decided for some mysterious reason to lie about it when asked seems very unlikely to me.

One of the darkest natural finish tops on any of the instruments I own started off as the lightest: the Engelmann spruce top on my Larrivée OM-03W was pure white when I got the guitar, but darkened quickly.

It seems likely to me that your darker Collings probably did the same thing: some spruce tops simply darken faster than others.


Wade Hampton Miller

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by brandall10

The DS1 does exhibit a good deal of banding. I'm wondering if sitka that bands like that reacts to UV significantly more? Were they that much different when you first purchased them?

Yes they were although the DS2h (paler one has, understandably, darkened down somewhat more), but the DS1 has always been dark.

I'm not complaining and I know that wood varies enormously - perhaps I should have asked ...has anyone seen a "new" guitar with sitka that dark?

[tadol]

Ive seen sets where the piece thats stickered on top has gotten considerably darker than its mate underneath -

[gmel555]

Interesting question but I don’t think it’s possible to know for sure. So many factors, some mentioned, some not.
- different wood from different trees, (maybe even a hybrid snuck in there)
- maybe different storage conditions before the spruce was even a top
- maybe a difference in the lot of finishes used, even if both were “clear”.
- maybe the angle of the cut was a little different...the darker one seems to have more chatoyance.
- maybe one of the case’s interior “plush“ reacted with the finish. (I actually had a Martin case stain the Ivoroid binding on one of my guitars.)
Still interesting though.

[Steel and wood]

I've seen old Martin D18's where the top is almost the colour of mahogany.

Even my twenty year old Martin DM Mahogany Dreadnought's top has darkened considerable over time. (I've only had it for a couple of years but the previous owner must have had it exposed to light, smoke maybe and I could be wrong but I think the satin aided the process).

[Roccorobb]

I read through three pages and nobody has yet said this so...

BEAUTIFUL GUITARS!

There. Now, as to the color difference, I've never seen a NEW Sitka top that dark unless it has the aged toner treatment. But I've seen plenty of tops are to much darker than that over time. Could it be that the DS1 had toner applied? I'm not a Collings nerd. Do they do that? Could you send them a serial# to find the build sheet?

[Silly Moustache]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

There’s no mystery to it: the reason the spruce top on one guitar is darker than the other are natural color differences found in two different pieces of spruce. Both are well within the color range of what’s normal. The speculation that one previous owner left the darker guitar out on a stand but decided for some mysterious reason to lie about it when asked seems very unlikely to me.

One of the darkest natural finish tops on any of the instruments I own started off as the lightest: the Engelmann spruce top on my Larrivée OM-03W was pure white when I got the guitar, but darkened quickly.

It seems likely to me that your darker Collings probably did the same thing: some spruce tops simply darken faster than others.


Wade Hampton Miller

I guess so Wade - anyway, I woldn't swap either!

[Wade Hampton]

When we're dealing with organic materials like wood, they're going to vary in both appearance and performance, that's all there is to it.

Which makes it kind of fun, if you ask me.


whm

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by lowrider

Interesting thing with Martin guitars; a guitar with ''aged toner'' will be frozen in time and the color doesn't change, guitar with natural finish will eventually darken to a tone similar to the aged toner guitar but much nicer, an X series with minimal finish will turn dark brown if it's given enough time.

My 2017 OM-21 continues to darken even though it has the toner originally. It looks naturally so, no pumpkin orange tinge or anything.

[SpruceTop]

Andy, my 2014 Martin HD-28 (bought new) has a "darker, slightly orange-tinted" top compared to any other Martin I've owned or seen, and it looks similar in color tone to your darker Collings. There is also a different odor to the guitar and case that I haven't noticed on other Martins. I'm thinking that Martin must have mixed the nitrocellulose lacquer a bit differently than usual before spraying my guitar? Then again, maybe the spruce was darker and slightly orangey to start with but I think for my guitar there is a correlation between the finished color of the spruce and the odor of the lacquer.

[Silly Moustache]

Hi folks, sorry to be a bit late replying to your kind responses.
All your suggestions are credible of course.

I understand that woods, and possibly even toner 2tone" may vary. as the guitars were built up to two years apart (early 2007 - late 2008???)it would be unlikely that they came from the same tree/batch etc.

AFAIK Collings don't use an "aged" toner.
The difference in the two doesn't bother me - it just fascinates me.
The sitka rosewood model is deep and luxurious, and the (dark) sitka mahogany is LOUD and raucous and (when I played in a bluegrass band) certainly was a banjo killer.

It was an idle thought for a thread here.

Actually the very plain trim on the DS1 (like a Martin D18 etc., would look very sparse with a very pale top, so, the darker colour makes it look a while lot "cooler" - to me anyway.

So thanks all for your input, I'm happy with my two babies , one blond and one ginger!