Just Received my new Bashkin Placencia OM - Page 2

warfrat73 · #16 06-01-2010, 08:16 AM

It's lovely.

I've not had a chance to play a guitar with a compound scale (fan frets), it's good to hear that you're making the transition easily. Frankly, they intimidate me.

K III · #17 06-01-2010, 08:27 AM

Michael's work is really one of a kind. Congratulations on a wonderful guitar, and glad it worked out for you.

Enjoy playing

Dave R · #18 06-01-2010, 10:36 AM

From another recent Bashkin OM owner--congratulations! (I got mine in March.) They are wonderful guitars; I'm glad you're happy with yours.

Dave

ljguitar · #19 06-01-2010, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warfrat73

It's lovely.

I've not had a chance to play a guitar with a compound scale (fan frets), it's good to hear that you're making the transition easily. Frankly, they intimidate me.

Hi warf…
I’ve had people play mine for 10-15 minutes before noticing anything ''goofy'' ''crooked'' or ''wrong'' with the fret layout! (I own a Bashkin with fanned frets as well)

It's transparent the way Michael builds it so there is little or no fingering adjustment needed (though it does take a brain realignment)

jay7347 · #20 06-01-2010, 02:49 PM

That's one beautiful guitar! Make "purty" music with it!
-jay

Marley · #21 06-01-2010, 07:40 PM

I'm very intrigued by the fan fret. I first saw a Novax in 1998 on a Jeff Traugott acoustic and the custom bass/guitar that Charlie Hunter's plays. Are these same fan frets the same as a Novax or are there now others making them? Or are luthiers this day and age simply cutting their fingerboards for the slanted frets? Are the fan frets on this Bashkin not as sloped or fanned as the original Novax or is it just my eyes? Are the fanned frets that Greenfield uses that same as this Bashkin? Or I guess the same measurement, if that is how it is? I'm confused as usual.

What are they like to play? What are the benefits of the fan fret? Do they make it easier to play certain things? Is playing chords the same? I love the look of them and would like to get them on a guitar if they serve a good purpose.

Beautiful guitar!

-kk- · #22 06-01-2010, 10:35 PM

I cant tell you how the compared to other fanned frets system, but on the Bashkin its very easy to play - I had to do a double take when I first played it to check that the frets are fanned. you dont notice it at all. THat is until you swap between guitars, then I do notice it - I noticed that it is actually easier to play the fanned frets, presumably because of the angles which seems to be more friendly for your hand.

Jeastman, Markart - i LOVE the rosette. its made from mango wood I think. Michael torches/burns the edges to get that flamed look.

Thanks all for the kind words. Im completely over the moon with it!

jeastman · #23 06-01-2010, 10:42 PM

Yeah, I love his torched look. He seems to use a lot of Mango wood for his torched rosettes. Is that because of aesthetic or is there something about Mango that lends itself to holding up to the torching process?

I've actually looked at his a lot and the Burners are experimenting on a torched rosette for me inspired by Michael's work.

ljguitar · #24 06-01-2010, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marley

I'm very intrigued by the fan fret. I first saw a Novax in 1998 on a Jeff Traugott acoustic and the custom bass/guitar that Charlie Hunter's plays. Are these same fan frets the same as a Novax or are there now others making them? Or are luthiers this day and age simply cutting their fingerboards for the slanted frets? Are the fan frets on this Bashkin not as sloped or fanned as the original Novax or is it just my eyes? Are the fanned frets that Greenfield uses that same as this Bashkin? Or I guess the same measurement, if that is how it is? I'm confused as usual.

Hi Marley…
I forget what the total amount of offset is on -kk's- Bashkin. On mine the 6th string is 3/4'' longer than the 1st string, and the frets are angled to accommodate the difference in the length of strings...my low string is 25.75 inches long and my 1st 25 inches. Michael placed the perpendicular fret wire on mine at the 8th wire. Everything slants away from it in opposite directions.

The fret wires are not bent, but radiate away from the single perpendicular fret wire.

There is no set formula one must build to - even with Novax system - and the offset amount can be any amount the luthier and client choose. I’ve seen offsets as radical as 2.5'' (definitely noticeable and impacts fingerings) and as gentle as .5 inch.

I believe Novax has let his patent or copyright lapse, so luthiers are no longer asked to pay a fee to him to build a fanned fret neck. I paid a $75 fee to have it installed on my guitar 5 years back. It seemed interesting to me that he patented it when fanned fret instruments have been with us since the 1500s.

There are differing philosophies as to why to use fanned frets, but the basic reason Michael builds with fanned frets is to provide more tension on the bass strings, so when in dropped or alternate tunings, they don't go floppy nor are they as prone to play out of tune.

Other builders do it to shape the volume balance of the strings, and to affect tone. My bass is quite distinct, and my trebles are sweeter than normal.

I’ve played Bashkin models where the 'short' string was a full 25.4'' and the long 26'' and I’ve played versions where the 5th fret wire was the perpendicular wire. I’ve played other builders with an offset as high as 1.5'' and it was doable, but not as natural as Michael's design.

Lest we derail the thread, I’ll stop with that much information to satisfy curiosity and hopefully answer questions - and I include a picture of my Bashkin's neck & bridge so you can note the offsets...

Hope this helps and adds to the enjoyment of the discussion...

ricll · #25 06-02-2010, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljguitar

There are differing philosophies as to why to use fanned frets, but the basic reason Michael builds with fanned frets is to provide more tension on the bass strings, so when in dropped or alternate tunings, they don't go floppy nor are they as prone to play out of tune.

I've never tried using a lighter/heavier gauge on the bass/treble side of my guitar (normal frets) but I guess that would be similar to what actually happen with fan fretted guitars? Also, is there any structural differences between the neck of a normal and a fan fretted guitar? I mean, because of the different tensions.
ps. Great guitars!

Thin Crust · #26 06-02-2010, 06:20 AM

Absolutely breathtaking!

ljguitar · #27 06-02-2010, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ricll

I've never tried using a lighter/heavier gauge on the bass/treble side of my guitar (normal frets) but I guess that would be similar to what actually happen with fan fretted guitars? Also, is there any structural differences between the neck of a normal and a fan fretted guitar? I mean, because of the different tensions.
ps. Great guitars!

Hi ricll…
No - the extra tension occurs naturally as a result of the string being longer (just like a bass guitar has more tension on the strings than an acoustic because the strings are longer). It produces a really nice clear bass note on mine, not a louder bass which is out of balance. I describe it as a more 'distinct' bass note.

String weight...
I use normal strings, not customized sets, on my fanned fret and that is the way they are designed. All of my guitars get a boost of one size on the 1st string because I like a better tone match between the 1st and 2nd strings when I’m playing running melodies or harmonies which cross between the two.

Neck design...
If the luthier splits the difference between both ends of the instrument (nut and saddle) then both the bridge and nut are built at an angle, so yes, the neck has some design considerations. I don't believe Michael reinforces the neck differently, but he indicated it does cause some slight shifting of the bracing under the top.

BBWW · #28 06-02-2010, 11:42 AM

Stunning! Good choices all around. What's not to love.

aaron1433 · #29 06-03-2010, 01:45 PM

looks like Michael hit another home run with this one. His guitars are incredible.

Tone Gopher · #30 06-03-2010, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljguitar

I’ve had people play mine for 10-15 minutes before noticing anything ''goofy'' ''crooked'' or ''wrong'' with the fret layout! (I own a Bashkin with fanned frets as well)

It's transparent the way Michael builds it so there is little or no fingering adjustment needed (though it does take a brain realignment)

I'm guessing that you don't do much string bending on a guitar with fan frets. Are there positions where you can actually lower the fretted pitch while bending? At the other end of the fingerboard, it would seem that a lil' string bend would result in a large pitch change.

Yes, some brain realignment required. I'm getting a warm head just thinking about it.