Why do few major artists play Carbon?

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by mot

I think I saw a CF guitar in the DIck Clark Rockin New Year show last night. I meant to look it up on the internet to see. I know FGL was there too, but I thought it was in a different band. Don't remember which now, but I thought I saw a Rainsong in the background of one of the musical groups (other than FGL).

I saw that as well, it was a Composite Acoustics, with the dark burst finish, really hard to catch if you're not a guitar guy looking for it.

[tdq]

My take on the current crop of CF guitars - (I have a CA GX) - is that they are great guitars, perhaps even among the best, at their price point (around $1.5-2K). But a professional performer would be more likely to have a top of the line acoustic, more in the $3-4k range (or even more) and the current crop of CF guitars aren't up there yet. My current favorite non-CF guitar that I covet is over $5K. If I was a professional performer or session artist I would go for the absolute top quality instrument I could afford, although I'd probably still have a CF in the mix somewhere.

I have no data at all to back this up, just a thought.

[mot]

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

I saw that as well, it was a Composite Acoustics, with the dark burst finish, really hard to catch if you're not a guitar guy looking for it.

Hi Ted,

Did you catch which group it was? I remembered it until my next sip and then forgot. It was background noise and I just happened to look when the guitar was flashed on the screen for a moment.

By the way, hope you have a happy, healthy and musical new year.

Cheers,
Tom

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by tdq

My take on the current crop of CF guitars - (I have a CA GX) - is that they are great guitars, perhaps even among the best, at their price point (around $1.5-2K). But a professional performer would be more likely to have a top of the line acoustic, more in the $3-4k range (or even more) and the current crop of CF guitars aren't up there yet...

I don't agree. While a professional performer like Larry Pattis, or Eric Skye might be concerned about how every note sounds when performing, the average musician can get away with playing just about any acoustic on stage, no one will know the difference. When these people choose a higher end instrument, it usually has little to do with tone. Do you really think all those country musicians on TV play McPherson because they think we can hear the tone?

I know a good number of professional musicians and their best guitars rarely leave the house, it's the beaters that do al the work. I have a friend who performs regularly who did in fact decide to plop down some serious cash for a higher end guitar, not only because she loved the tone, but because it would handle rigors of the road better than her Martin. The artist is Anita Mansfield and the guitar is a Rainsong CO-WS1000N2.



BTW, last I checked the price of a Composite Acoustics GX is around $2800.

Originally Posted by mot

Hi Ted,

Did you catch which group it was? I remembered it until my next sip and then forgot. It was background noise and I just happened to look when the guitar was flashed on the screen for a moment.

By the way, hope you have a happy, healthy and musical new year.

Cheers,
Tom

I don't recall the band Tom, but the CA did catch my eye. I also noticed how subdued it looked on stage, certainly not what most guitarists look for if they are going to be on National TV.

[tdq]

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

I don't agree. While a professional performer like Larry Pattis, or Eric Skye might be concerned about how every note sounds when performing, the average musician can get away with playing just about any acoustic on stage, no one will know the difference. When these people choose a higher end instrument, it usually has little to do with tone. Do you really think all those country musicians on TV play McPherson because they think we can hear the tone?

I know a good number of professional musicians and their best guitars rarely leave the house, it's the beaters that do al the work. I have a friend who performs regularly who did in fact decide to plop down some serious cash for a higher end guitar, not only because she loved the tone, but because it would handle rigors of the road better than her Martin. The artist is Anita Mansfield and the guitar is a Rainsong CO-WS1000N2.

I thought that might be the counter-argument, and it's a good one. So I guess the question remains. Maybe it's just that CF guitars are one tiny corner of a huge pool.

BTW, last I checked the price of a Composite Acoustics GX is around $2800.

On a side note, I think they are way overpriced at the moment - mine was just under 2K when I got it in the pre-Peavey days. But that's another discussion....

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by tdq

...On a side note, I think they are way overpriced at the moment - mine was just under 2K when I got it in the pre-Peavey days. But that's another discussion....

Actually the GX gloss, the only one currently available was $2700 back in 2009. IMO the current price of CF guitars is a bargain, so much so that the big boys see no profit in building them.

BTW, I think if the original CA stuck to selling $2700 gloss guitars, instead of all those cheaper models that were basically loss leaders leading nowhere, they might have survived.

[mot]

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

I don't recall the band Tom, but the CA did catch my eye. I also noticed how subdued it looked on stage, certainly not what most guitarists look for if they are going to be on National TV.

Thanks Ted.

[EoE]

I love wood but those emerald harp guitars are tempting.

[Doubleneck]

I think two thoughts above may answer the question. One is carbons mostly don't really look that great on stage. Compare a carbon burst to my Gibson J45? All professional guitarists have high end wood guitars, they may not use them all on the road but woods associated with the best. Carbon is the practical alternative for a working musician but few go there. The Lady above reconizes this and others like David Wilcox. Maybe at this point carbon is the best alternative for the typical guitar player such as us. Extremely hardy in all environments few things that can go wrong and still a great value?

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by Doubleneck

I think two thoughts above may answer the question. One is carbons mostly don't really look that great on stage. Compare a carbon burst to my Gibson J45? All professional guitarists have high end wood guitars, they may not use them all on the road but woods associated with the best. Carbon is the practical alternative for a working musician but few go there. The Lady above reconizes this and others like David Wilcox. Maybe at this point carbon is the best alternative for the typical guitar player such as us. Extremely hardy in all environments few things that can go wrong and still a great value?

My friend Anita Mansfield, the cute redhead above, clearly doesn't need to worry about what her guitar looks like on stage, but many stage performers will consider the look of their guitars before it's tone.

Given the average sound system out there few in the audience could tell the difference between an Olson and a Blueridge, but Anita has been recording with her Rainsong instead of her Martin lately which is quite telling.

[slewis]

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

I know a good number of professional musicians and their best guitars rarely leave the house, it's the beaters that do al the work....

A good friend of mine travels the world playing hundreds of gigs per year and this is exactly his approach. The guitar he typically has with him on the road is a tank, not a delicate flower, and his prized guitars are safe at home.

[Pick guard]

Stumbled across this today. If ever there was a place for an excuse to use a carbon fiber guitar, one would think the International Space Station might be a good candidate. But for whatever the reason, the astronauts chose a wood Larrivée parlor to be the first guitar in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaOC9danxNo

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by Pick guard

Stumbled across this today. If ever there was a place for an excuse to use a carbon fiber guitar, one would think the International Space Station might be a good candidate. But for whatever the reason, the astronauts chose a wood Larrivée parlor to be the first guitar in space.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaOC9danxNo

I don't see how a CF guitar would be the best choice in a fully climate controlled environment. I'm told the Larrivee Parlor guitar was a personal guitar of Commander Chris Hadfield, and it was chosen because it was the smallest guitar he owned.

BTW, this was not the first guitar in space, that distinction goes to a custom Martin backpacker that currently resides in the Martin Museum.





This was back in 1991 at which time size was a major concern. Apparently not so much today.

BTW, at my last visit to the Martin factory I was given the opportunity to play some of the guitars they kept under lock and key, although I did play the pre war D-45 recently purchased from Richard Gere, to my hosts surprise the first guitar I asked to handle was this tiny custom made Backpacker. I read about this guitar years ago so it was an honor to be able to handle it.

[Pick guard]

Originally Posted by Ted @ LA Guitar Sales

I'm told the Larrivee Parlor guitar was a personal guitar of Commander Chris Hadfield, and it was chosen because it was the smallest guitar he owned.

Here is how Chris Hadfield explains NASA's choice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWTn...VdTj2mpgb86dZY

Interesting to hear some of his comments about overshooting frets while playing in space.

Truthfully, I would have thought they might prefer a carbon fiber for the knock-around benefits it has versus wood.

[Ted @ LA Guitar Sales]

Originally Posted by Pick guard

Here is how Chris Hadfield explains NASA's choice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWTn...VdTj2mpgb86dZY

Interesting to hear some of his comments about overshooting frets while playing in space.

Truthfully, I would have thought they might prefer a carbon fiber for the knock-around benefits it has versus wood.

So according to that video they were looking for something small, and what Guitar Center had was a Larrivee Parlor. Had those guys come in to LA Guitar Sales I could have showed them many great options in addition to the Larrivee Parlor which is certainly not a bad choice. Clearly they weren't looking for anything too small, nor were they worried about additional durability.

Back in 1991 it was a different story, the guitar had to fit in to a very small container, but even back than they weren't worried about durability. Temperature and humidity are well under control in a space craft and it's not likely the guitar will be dropped.