Koa soundboard opinions

[TedBPhx]

Taylor GT all Koa. A year and a half of daily play no change in tone. Hard gloss finish. The new all koa Taylor 7xxs use a very thin, 2mm, not pore filled satin finish for more top resonance. Excellent idea.

[gmel555]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Thomas, koa soundboards definitely take a lot longer to break in than spruce soundboards - you’re looking at some two years for it to come in with koa versus six months or so with spruce. Plus the spruce sounds more broken in to start with.

Based on my somewhat limited experience with Koa tops, I agree with Wade. I've never been drawn to the tone of any newer koa topped guitar as they just sounded "tight" or like they were "holding back". Conversely, I have been quite impressed with a number of older Koa topped guitars I've played.

[tadol]

Yes. But if people don’t build new koa topped guitars now, we won’t have wonderful ones to fight over years from now - I have 2 older SC koa topped guitars, an F and an H, and I wouldn’t mind being stuck with either as an only guitar - (but thankfully, I never will - )

[thomastedder]

I think I'm going to go with the Koa top for visual appeal. Although this is only my second build, I've got a good number of other guitars with spruce tops and I'll build more after this one.

Any other opinions on shape? OM vs Dreadnought for best sound using all Koa?

[rlgph]

Originally Posted by Pender

Well said, Wade. As always ;-)
My SCGC H koa is an amazing instrument but is turning 30 years now. To my ears koa is superior to mahogany in terms of sound but I never played a mahogany soundboard aged like my koa guitar.
As far as I can see, koa is a premium tonewood for the most builders. Maybe it's more for the esthetics. Anyway, I can assure based on my own experience that an all koa guitar, aged and builded by SCGC, is amazing!

My all-koa 1990 SCGC model H (which i heartily regret selling -- maybe you bought it?) was one of the two best sounding guitars (from the player's perspective) i've ever had. (The other, which i still have, is a Martin 000-18GE.) Curiously, they both sounded best tuned down a full step.

However, i suspect SCGC and the model H had much to do with it. Another all-koa that i had (Larrivee parlor) did not sound particularly good at all. My understanding is that a koa top is a crap shoot. Consequently, though i would consider buying another all-koa that i had played and liked, i would never risk several grand on having one built.

[tadol]

Originally Posted by rlgph

My all-koa 1990 SCGC model H (which i heartily regret selling -- maybe you bought it?) was one of the two best sounding guitars (from the player's perspective) i've ever had. (The other, which i still have, is a Martin 000-18GE.) Curiously, they both sounded best tuned down a full step.

However, i suspect SCGC and the model H had much to do with it. Another all-koa that i had (Larrivee parlor) did not sound particularly good at all. My understanding is that a koa top is a crap shoot. Consequently, though i would consider buying another all-koa that i had played and liked, i would never risk several grand on having one built.

Interesting - My ‘90 SCGC koa/koa H is also an incredible sounding guitar - mine is from August of ‘90 - I should stick a mirror in there and see who was doing the tops and voicing back then -

[jrdavies]

Have you thought about asking a luthier who has a lot of experience with Koa about what characteristics a piece of Koa needs to have to make a good top? Or any other tips for making a good Koa guitar. Maybe the folks at Goodall or Pegasus Guitars. I'm not a luthier but seem to remember reading that Koa varies quite a bit in density and stiffness and not Koa is suitable for tops.

As for size perhaps a 12 fret 000.

[thomastedder]

Originally Posted by jrdavies

Have you thought about asking a luthier who has a lot of experience with Koa about what characteristics a piece of Koa needs to have to make a good top? Or any other tips for making a good Koa guitar. Maybe the folks at Goodall or Pegasus Guitars. I'm not a luthier but seem to remember reading that Koa varies quite a bit in density and stiffness and not Koa is suitable for tops.

As for size perhaps a 12 fret 000.

I’d love to, but don’t know any.

Any reason for the 12 fret 000 suggestion? Will that mellow it down?

[jjbigfly]

Well, I have an all solid Koa dread. Very nice and I do not believe it was played much, though it sounds sweet already. I am impressed with the tone and the looks are typical Tak….as close as you are going to get to perfect. I would certainly not be afraid of a Koa top (now that I know)

[Malcolm Kindnes]

I have a Martin 00028k 1921 authentic which is all Koa. It is very beautiful, very light and has a warm, soft tone. I also have an all mahogany Recording King guitar which I use for travel and gigging, and it has a much more punchy tone, so I don't agree that Koa sounds like mahogany.

[RJVB]

So, what else would you do with the koa wood that you do not use for making a top?

Have you considered making both a spruce and a koa top? I'm pretty certain that even with flattops there must be a way to make a (more or less) floating fingerboard that makes it easier to remove the top if it turns out you don't like the sound.

Or ... make a double top with koa as the outer/top layer and spruce as the bottom layer?

[HFox]

I have a 6 year old Taylor 12 string. It is all Koa, It is NOT a big voiced guitar. It is a wonderful sounding instrument but if I was going to share a stage ( which is not likely) with a Spruce top guitar I would have to "plug in ".
I also have a 7 year old SCGC OM "The Tree" Hog/ Italian Spruce and that guitar has a much larger voice than the Koa Taylor.
I think those who suggest Spruce over Koa for a top wood are right on.
But......Like most things in our guitar world, much of the final voice depends on the builder.

[SpruceTop]

Taylor does Koa really well. I had a 2013 Taylor K24ce that sounded wonderful as being woody, warm, and full-toned. My goal is to one day get another all-Koa guitar, probably another Taylor K24ce. I got rid of the 2013 Taylor only because it had the Expression System ES1.3 magnetic-based pickup system, and the Expression System 2, a more acoustic-guitar sounding system, came out at the end of 2013 and that's the system I wanted.

I've also had a 2007 Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom that had a Sitka Spruce Top and koa back-and-sides. Also, a 2008 Taylor GS LTD Fall Limited with a Spruce Top and Koa Back-and-Sides. Both of these guitars were tone monsters in having a great dynamic range along with great clarity and warmth of tone.

Overall, I heard the all-Koa Taylor K24ce as sounding clear, and mellow, with a smooth playing attack whereas the Spruce-topped/Koa back-and-sides Taylor GS LTD Fall Limited and Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom, had a strong and quick playing attack.

2013 Taylor K24ce


2007 Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom


2008 Taylor GS LTD Fall Limited

[TedBPhx]

I have a small-ish solid koa Taylor GT. Great guitar. Between Koa’s even EQ response and the hard top’s natural compression giving even dynamics it is like playing a keyboard. Sometimes great sometimes not what I want but I do wonder what spruce or sinker redwood over Koa would be like. I also play an 814. About 50/50 which one I grab.

[thomastedder]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

Taylor does Koa really well. I had a 2013 Taylor K24ce that sounded wonderful as being woody, warm, and full-toned. My goal is to one day get another all-Koa guitar, probably another Taylor K24ce. I got rid of the 2013 Taylor only because it had the Expression System ES1.3 magnetic-based pickup system, and the Expression System 2, a more acoustic-guitar sounding system, came out at the end of 2013 and that's the system I wanted.

I've also had a 2007 Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom that had a Sitka Spruce Top and koa back-and-sides. Also, a 2008 Taylor GS LTD Fall Limited with a Spruce Top and Koa Back-and-Sides. Both of these guitars were tone monsters in having a great dynamic range along with great clarity and warmth of tone.

Overall, I heard the all-Koa Taylor K24ce as sounding clear, and mellow, with a smooth playing attack whereas the Spruce-topped/Koa back-and-sides Taylor GS LTD Fall Limited and Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom, had a strong and quick playing attack.

2013 Taylor K24ce


2007 Gibson J-45 Honeyburst Koa Custom


2008 Taylor GS LTD Fall Limited

Wow, nice guitar Sprucetop! Thanks for sharing.