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Gretsch Electromatic Questions
Looking at the Electromatic double cuts, they come in hollow body and center block. The hollows have a B60 Bigsby and the center blocks have a B70 Bigsby that has an extra bar that I have seen called a pressure bar. They also have different pickups, black top vs super hi/lo.
I have never owned a Bigsby equipped guitar. Anyone have experience with these. Anyone know why they use one on the center block and the other on the hollow? Any functional difference as far as staying in tune, intonation, etc? Also, any input on the difference in pickups would be welcome. Double cut differences: Center block = B70 pressure bar Bigsby and Super Hi/Lo Trons. Hollow body = B60 no pressure bar Bigsby and Black Top Filtertrons. Last edited by loco gringo; 12-18-2020 at 07:00 PM. |
#2
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Further study leads me to the fact that the center block models have an anchored bridge. I am assuming that leads to the Bigsby with the bar?
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#3
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The B60 is designed to be anchored firmly at the tail block only, and to float/rest lightly over the hollow body. It's designed to allow the full hollow body resonance of the guitar to be less muffled. The B70 is designed to be screwed down firmly to the top of the semi-solid guitar. Because it's firmly attached to the top, it can have the pressure bar that increases downward pressure on the bridge. I'm going to say that these two guitars might look similar at first glance but they are very different in construction, approach, and probably feel and sound. You're going to have to either make an educated guess, or preferably play both, to know which you prefer.
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Brian Evans Around 15 archtops, electrics, resonators, a lap steel, a uke, a mandolin, some I made, some I bought, some kinda showed up and wouldn't leave. Tatamagouche Nova Scotia. |
#4
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Lifelong Gretsch guy here:
Brian's 100% right about the function of the pressure bar on the B70, and while it does create additional downforce on the bridge, it unfortunately had the habit of tearing up the top of any hollowbody instrument to which it was mounted back in the day (in its original - and still available - B7 configuration); I had one that was mounted to a Carlo Robelli '53 ES-5 knockoff and, in spite of the fact that I never used it for its intended purpose (I bought the guitar as a jazzbox), it tore a hole in the top right at the mounting point (I eventually filled the hole and replaced it with a trapeze tailpiece). FYI I have one on my 3-PU 5622T-CB semi-hollow - where it's solidly anchored to the center block - and for the few occasions that I use it everything seems to be holding up; I also have the dedicated Gretsch version of the B6 (similar to the B60) on my '62 White Falcon RI, and when set up/used within their original design parameters (11- or 12-gauge strings/wound G, no dive-bombing) tuning isn't an issue IME... I'm quite familiar with the Korean-made 5400/5600-Series E-matics, and I'll state unequivocally that their tone/QC/playability exceeds many of the (several hundred) "Golden Era" Brooklyn originals I've played since I was a kid (if you grew up in that time place your first "good" electric waa a Gretsch, period); that said, the various combinations of pickups and body construction will each provide you with different tones, so I'd recommend auditioning the models you're considering before you make your decision. Speaking in the very broadest of terms - again as a lifetime owner who plays every new Gretsch product that I can get my hands on - I can give you an idea of what to expect (as always YMMV depending on your playing style, setup, associated amplification, etc.):
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"Mistaking silence for weakness and contempt for fear is the final, fatal error of a fool" - Sicilian proverb (paraphrased) |
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Thanks Brian. I appreciate the info.
Last edited by loco gringo; 10-28-2018 at 11:48 AM. |
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Thanks Steve. Great insight.
I am trading in some guitars, and I have enough trade in that I can get 2 Gretsch guitars if I add a couple hundred $. I will have a 45 day return policy, so I am pretty safe. I wasn't sure about the 5622, but your comments are leading me to probably try it first on the double cut. I think I am going to get a 5420 for a full hollow. |
#7
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Quote:
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...vintage-orange If you prefer the post-'62 double-cut version (AKA Nashville) here's another near dead-ringer, for one-third the price of the MIJ Professional Series reissue when it was discontinued a few years back: https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...vintage-orange For the CSNY fans, the E-matic rendition of the '60 White Falcon: https://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...lectric-guitar FYI not every classic Gretsch tone was produced by a hollowbody, and if you're going to spring for a 5622 (which will cover nearly all of those sounds anyway) one of these - which has an exceedingly interesting, if somewhat apocryphal, history (see below) - might be a good addition to your stable: https://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...lectric-guitar Some Gretsch lore and trivia: After her divorce from Les Paul in 1963 (I was fortunate enough to see their last TV appearance as a kid, in 1962) Mary Ford was attempting to jumpstart both a solo career and an endorsement deal of her own with Gretsch. It has been rumored that the short-lived (and now uber-rare) "Princess" pastel-colored solidbodies based on the '63 Corvette platform (vaguely resembling the contemporary - and strong-selling - single-pickup SG/Les Paul Junior, and sold with matching white case and amplifier) were in fact intended to be the first "Mary Ford" instruments, to be joined by similarly-colored Duo-Jet-based "Standards" and a double-cutaway White Penguin-based "Custom" model. Production of the Princess ceased by '64 when the deal fell through - no instruments of this type were ever produced under the Mary Ford designation - and while similarly-colored double-cut Duo-Jet "Standard" prototypes are said to exist - possibly as a single example, almost certainly no more than four or five - as well as her personal double-cut Penguin that was to be the platform for the "Custom," only the Corvette-based Princess "Junior" model saw the light of day. For those who are curious about what might have been the aforementioned FSR Electromatic, in Surf Green with white back/pickguard/trussrod cover and gold Filter'trons/hardware, is probably a 90% accurate representation of what the Mary Ford Standard might have looked like - under Les' tutelage Mary became a formidable guitarist in her own right, and it undoubtedly would have been equipped with some proprietary cutting-edge electronic gadgetry garnered from their time together (which Les himself was extremely reluctant to license for mass production until circa 1970, with the Les Paul Professional/Personal/Triumph Bass models) - and while this recent FSR Limited Edition white Corvette lacks the obligatory gold hardware/pickguard of the '63 Princess, the DNA is unmistakable to any hard-core Gretsch fan: https://www.musiciansfriend.com/guit...lectric-guitar To add some fuel to the fire - and credibility to the story - Ken Achard's History and Development of the American Guitar shows a documented prototype of a double-cutaway Les Paul Standard produced circa 1962 by Epiphone, when they were under Gibson management and using the same methods/materials. Les Paul - who had complained long and loud about the SG version that would bear his name until mid-'63 (when he suspended his endorsement deal amid his divorce proceedings) - performed many of his first experiments with solidbody design on Epiphone guitars, and this may have been an attempt to appease him with a more "modern" appearing instrument while still keeping him in the corporate camp; suffice it to say that the body shape is nearly indistinguishable from the contemporary double-cutaway Duo-Jet - the same one that would have been used for the Mary Ford Standard/Custom - and if push came to shove it could have been a very interesting state of affairs...
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"Mistaking silence for weakness and contempt for fear is the final, fatal error of a fool" - Sicilian proverb (paraphrased) Last edited by Steve DeRosa; 10-28-2018 at 09:04 PM. Reason: typo |
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Those are great looking guitars. That vintage orange 5420 with the gold hardware is amazing. The White Falcon looking one was on my radar.
The deed is done. I picked out these two. I have 45 days to return or exchange them. I might have gone with a black 5622 if they had had one in the store. I like the green though, and it plays and sounds great, so I will likely keep it. It was a great way to turn over some gear I wasn't using. |
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I own a sexy beast black solid center block 5620T-CB. They’re FANTASTIC stage guitars. It is equipped with a Bigsby B-70. Initially it had tuning issues and I ALMOST traded it off. Then I discovered the “Biggs fix”.
In short it moves the string break angle. In essence, it reduces string break and alleviates tuning issues. I absolutely LOVE my solid centerblock Gretsch and would recommend them to anyone...IF....you equip it with the “biggs fix”. He also makes a “super squishy” spring for a few dollars. It is FANTASTIC. This guitar would’ve been a “move on to the next” guitar barring the “Biggs fix”. It’s a perfect solution to the typical bigsby “tuning” issues. Take it fwiw. But I’ve played live for over 30 years and can attest that this product will change your mind about Bigsbys. I’ll post the link below. Well worth the $. Not to mention the pickups are simply fantastic. It truly is a fantastic guitar. https://bricksbiggsfix.com/product/btsv3/ |
#10
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Thanks for the tip PTony. I bookmarked that link. If I see issues, I will order it and the spring. I saw where Reverend had a squishy spring, too.
I'm really not a whammy user. I can see that changing once I start getting my Gretsch on, though. |
#11
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I've got an '08 Gretsch G5120, but didn't care much for the stock "Gretschbuckers" - too muddy for my tastes.. So I put in some GFS Surf 90's - much better!
The Surf 90's give it more of that "DynaSonic" sound. Last edited by Beachrunner; 11-13-2018 at 05:57 PM. |
#12
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This thread ought to be a "sticky." For reference purposes.
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#13
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I ended up returning the 5622 and keeping the 5420. Initially, if I would have guessed that I was going to end up returning one of them, I would have guessed the 5420. After playing them regularly over a period of time through my amps, it was clear that I wanted the 5420. The tuning on the 5622 was less stable, though I could have probably worked through that by putting a new bridge on it and possibly doing some nut work, and maybe I could have upgraded it in other ways to make it more to my liking, but the 5420 clearly called my name, so I wasn't inclined to do it.
I know Guitar Center gets knocked around a lot, but my local store was great to deal with on this. I was very careful with both guitars while I was testing them under the 45 day return policy. It truly was a no hassle deal. You really can't make that kind of evaluation in the show room. |