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  #1  
Old 03-25-2019, 11:35 AM
Raf702 Raf702 is offline
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Default Cracked guitar top, worth repairing?

Hey everyone, so I have an issue that occurred the other day. I accidentally dropped my mic and stand on my Yamaha FG830 which unfortunately caused a 5-6" straight long, but deep crack. It still plays and sounds fine, I honestly can't really hear any difference from prior to the accident. I don't have the actual photo at the moment, but here is a reference photo I found on Google that looks very similar to how mine looks. Although I purchased my guitar new for $250 with discounts awhile back.

Would the repair cost more than the value of the guitar, or at least half? But most importantly, worth doing a repair? I'm not expecting it to look new again, just patched up enough to be sealed. I appreciate anyone's input or opinion. Thank you guys!

https://acousticvibesmusic.com/wp-co...7/img_0144.jpg
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Old 03-25-2019, 11:42 AM
rmp rmp is offline
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Would the repair cost more than the value of the guitar, or at least half?

given the work to repair something like that, I would expect it would come close to the entire value.
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Old 03-25-2019, 11:52 AM
Raf702 Raf702 is offline
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Originally Posted by rmp View Post
Would the repair cost more than the value of the guitar, or at least half?

given the work to repair something like that, I would expect it would come close to the entire value.
That's kind of what I'm expecting the worse to be.
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Old 03-25-2019, 12:15 PM
runamuck runamuck is offline
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If you simply have it cleated from the inside to prevent buzzing or the crack to enlarge, and without any work on the finish, I would guess the price to be $50 or so.
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Old 03-25-2019, 12:22 PM
Raf702 Raf702 is offline
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Originally Posted by runamuck View Post
If you simply have it cleated from the inside to prevent buzzing or the crack to enlarge, and without any work on the finish, I would guess the price to be $50 or so.
I'm not too concerned with the finish, just sealing it up and preventing the crack from enlarging. That method of cleat sounds good, I guess it also depends on the luthier I go to. I appreciate the info!
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Old 03-25-2019, 12:53 PM
charles Tauber charles Tauber is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by runamuck View Post
If you simply have it cleated from the inside to prevent buzzing or the crack to enlarge, and without any work on the finish, I would guess the price to be $50 or so.
That's about what I'd charge, as well.
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Old 03-25-2019, 12:55 PM
snow creek snow creek is offline
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Cant you just fix it yourself? I "fixed" an old classical guitar with two cracks like that by putting masking tape inside the guitar and simply putting gorilla glue or epoxy in there (cant remember) and wiping it clean. Its been a few years now and the cracks are still stable and glued. no cleat, no change in sound. If anything it sounds better than ever.
I guess the best thing to ask is this: what would someone with actual luthier knowledge do to fix this guitar? I am interested myself how one would properly do this fix.
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Old 03-25-2019, 01:09 PM
Raf702 Raf702 is offline
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Originally Posted by snow creek View Post
Cant you just fix it yourself? I "fixed" an old classical guitar with two cracks like that by putting masking tape inside the guitar and simply putting gorilla glue or epoxy in there (cant remember) and wiping it clean. Its been a few years now and the cracks are still stable and glued. no cleat, no change in sound. If anything it sounds better than ever.
I guess the best thing to ask is this: what would someone with actual luthier knowledge do to fix this guitar? I am interested myself how one would properly do this fix.

I thought about that myself, I have no issues attempting to do it. Just wouldn't no where to begin. And would I do more harm to it, and just take it to a luthier.

I was thinking of some kind of epoxy compound to seal the crack and then having some tool inside the guitar to hold the cracked area leveled.

Im just visualizing the repair at least, based on what I could do. Wether it's proper, i have no idea. Lol
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  #9  
Old 03-25-2019, 01:22 PM
John Arnold John Arnold is offline
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No epoxy or Gorilla Glue, please. You can work some Titebond Original glue in the crack with your fingers, and clean up with warm water.
The linked photo won't load on my computer. But if it is a simple hairline crack that is not stepped and you have no loose braces or buzzing, I would consider doing nothing.
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Old 03-25-2019, 01:28 PM
redir redir is offline
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If you don't care too much about the guitar then it can't hurt to try it yourself but don't use Gorilla Glue or epoxy

Use Titebond.

That would be about a 50-75 dollar job in my shop and I think that's worth it for such a guitar, especially if you really like the way it plays and sounds.

The first thing to do would be inspect the inside of the guiar for damage. What I do is make clamping cauls that fit the curves of the lower bout by tracing the design of the bouts on a 2x4 and cutting them out with a band saw. Then I line the cauls wit cork. I actually have quite a few laying around that fit most standard shapes. Make sure the guitar is well humidified so that the crack is nice and tight. Then reaching from the inside of the guitar push on one side of the crack to open it up and message the Titebond in. Where the crack starts to peter out you need to use diluted Titebond, up to ten percent diluted with water. That way it gets in real good.

Then I take two plexiglass cauls one on the inside and one on the outside and clamp them up so that the two halves of the crack are in the same plane, ie they are flush, when you apply side pressure. With the lower bout cauls in place I then use long bar or cam clamps to apply pressure on the lower bout. You don't want to crush it here. Just enough to clamp in place. Typically you will see a litte squeeze out but you can deal with that later.

Let it dry over night and then make spruce cross grain cleats and place them ever inch and a half or so along the crack on the inside. Titebond and strong magnets work great for that. Let dry overnight again then do any necessary cleanup, buffing etc...

You may not even need to go to that length. If the crack is nice and tight then you might get away with simply using masking tape as a 'clamp.' Going perpendicular to the crack take like 8in strips of tape, 4in on each side, and stick the very end down and hold it as you stretch the tape tight across the crack (but in the air if you get my drift) then tack down the other side. So the ends of the tape are the only thing really sticking, like the first and last inch of tape. The rest of it acts like a spring of sorts. The whole tape will stick but I'm just trying to illustrate the technique. Basically using the tape like a bungee.
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Old 03-25-2019, 01:38 PM
Raf702 Raf702 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Arnold View Post
No epoxy or Gorilla Glue, please. You can work some Titebond Original glue in the crack with your fingers, and clean up with warm water.
The linked photo won't load on my computer. But if it is a simple hairline crack that is not stepped and you have no loose braces or buzzing, I would consider doing nothing.
Definitely not a hairline crack, it is slightly stepped. So it looks like it would need to be pushed from the inside to level it out. If that makes any sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redir View Post
If you don't care too much about the guitar then it can't hurt to try it yourself but don't use Gorilla Glue or epoxy

Use Titebond.

That would be about a 50-75 dollar job in my shop and I think that's worth it for such a guitar, especially if you really like the way it plays and sounds.

The first thing to do would be inspect the inside of the guiar for damage. What I do is make clamping cauls that fit the curves of the lower bout by tracing the design of the bouts on a 2x4 and cutting them out with a band saw. Then I line the cauls wit cork. I actually have quite a few laying around that fit most standard shapes. Make sure the guitar is well humidified so that the crack is nice and tight. Then reaching from the inside of the guitar push on one side of the crack to open it up and message the Titebond in. Where the crack starts to peter out you need to use diluted Titebond, up to ten percent diluted with water. That way it gets in real good.

Then I take two plexiglass cauls one on the inside and one on the outside and clamp them up so that the two halves of the crack are in the same plane, ie they are flush, when you apply side pressure. With the lower bout cauls in place I then use long bar or cam clamps to apply pressure on the lower bout. You don't want to crush it here. Just enough to clamp in place. Typically you will see a litte squeeze out but you can deal with that later.

Let it dry over night and then make spruce cross grain cleats and place them ever inch and a half or so along the crack on the inside. Titebond and strong magnets work great for that. Let dry overnight again then do any necessary cleanup, buffing etc...

You may not even need to go to that length. If the crack is nice and tight then you might get away with simply using masking tape as a 'clamp.' Going perpendicular to the crack take like 8in strips of tape, 4in on each side, and stick the very end down and hold it as you stretch the tape tight across the crack (but in the air if you get my drift) then tack down the other side. So the ends of the tape are the only thing really sticking, like the first and last inch of tape. The rest of it acts like a spring of sorts. The whole tape will stick but I'm just trying to illustrate the technique. Basically using the tape like a bungee.
Interesting, I appreciate the process of doing this type of repair and the detailed explanation! Might be too much for my skills to do, mainly the lack of tools.
__________________
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Taylor BT1(sold)
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Taylor 214ce(sold)
Guild D4-NT-HR(sold)
Martin HD28(sold)
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Martin LXM(sold)
Martin DRS2(Main)
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  #12  
Old 03-25-2019, 01:53 PM
redir redir is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raf702 View Post
Definitely not a hairline crack, it is slightly stepped. So it looks like it would need to be pushed from the inside to level it out. If that makes any sense.



Interesting, I appreciate the process of doing this type of repair and the detailed explanation! Might be too much for my skills to do, mainly the lack of tools.
If the crack closes up well enough then all you need is masking tape. You could use CA for the cleats if you must. that way you can just hold them in place as the glue cures but lining them up is the tricky part, magnets make that easy. They are not terribly expensive either.

But again to DIY this is a last ditch effort. If you really enjoy the guitar then maybe try and find someone local and get some quotes. I was not able to see that photo either so I don't know exactly what it looks like. But if it's simple, has no internal damage, then it's not a very expensive repair.

EDIT: Ah I see you said the crack is stepped up. That does require proper clamping then. Unless it's stepped up at the moment but when you push on it, it 'clicks' back in place? If so that is optimal.
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Old 03-25-2019, 02:26 PM
ceciltguitar ceciltguitar is offline
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I've had 3-6" soundboard cracks on two different guitars, both over 15 years ago, both guitars still going strong. However, both guitars cost well over $1000, so the cost of repair to cost of the guitar ratio was significantly less. Also, from your description of the crack, it sounds like your crack is worse than mine. Who doesn't want to buy a new GUITAR ?
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Old 03-25-2019, 02:42 PM
runamuck runamuck is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raf702 View Post
I'm not too concerned with the finish, just sealing it up and preventing the crack from enlarging. That method of cleat sounds good, I guess it also depends on the luthier I go to. I appreciate the info!
I read elsewhere here that the crack is stepped. Take it to a luthier unless you have the appropriate clamps and are willing to research exactly how to do this. You can Google Frank Ford's website where he addresses nearly everything guitar repair related you might imagine.

Don't use epoxy for this repair, no matter what you do. use Titebond 1.
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Old 03-25-2019, 08:06 PM
phavriluk phavriluk is offline
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My SWAG is that the stepped crack suggests to me that the raised portion of the soundboard has been separated from at least one leg of an x-brace/tonebar, and maybe both. Time for a real luthier to look inside and use the tools whose cost can't be justified for a one-off repair. I would not be surprised if the repair became a several-step process, although each step would take very little time, glue's gotta dry in between steps. At an rate I'd be wanting to be assured that the soundboard is firmly attached to the bracing.
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