Santa Cruz 1929 00 all-mahogany

[Shortfinger]

I spent an hour at Chicago Music Exchange this afternoon, getting excellent help from Karl. I said I was looking for a small blues box with good volume, and he set up four guitars for me to play.

1. The SC in the title block above
2. A Martin Custom Shop 00-14 Subway Token
3. The Collings C10-35 baked sitka burst over mahogany
4. Another Collings, the 001 with rope purfling

The one I came back to after playing each for about ten minutes, was the SC. It had a terrific mid range and the soft vee neck seemed perfect for me.

CME's ticket on this says $6,450 but I see one used in mint condition for half that. Actually less than half.

Would a SC when used drop that much in price?

[Methos1979]

Street prices new for these are between $4,600 - $5,200 depending on finish (burst is more). CME's 'sticker' price is very high. It might have some other custom feature. If not, it's way overpriced.

Used they typically sell for low-mid $2k. I've owned two and they were great guitars, for sure.

[BrunoBlack]

SCGC has a significant up-charge for hot hide glue/Adirondack bracing, figured wood, special bindings, fretboard inlays, etc. You might want to ask CME why there’s such a difference in price between their guitar and the one listed at Sylvan Music (for example) that’s listed @ $4,612 - https://www.sylvanmusic.com/store/p1...rd_%23967.html
My guess is you are paying for “extra features.”

[Shortfinger]

Apparently there are a few things about this guitar that drive the price up. The hide-glue Adirondack bracing (whatever it is beyond the glue), the figured mahogany purfling, and the selection of mahogany for the top bottom and sides.

Karl said that he was out to Santa Cruz when they prepared to make this one, and that he was accompanying the CME guy that manages the custom builds. They did a careful pick-through of all the soundboard stock and thought they got the best of the lot there, doing the knock-and-listen test.

The guitar's body all has rich dark dense mahogany, no hints of the broad variegation in color you sometimes see. It's deep chocolate-red with tight grain.

There is a beauty for sale on Reverb for (asking) $3K and I am wondering if I could hear and feel the difference between it and the one today at CME. The $3,500 difference in cost would certainly justify a side-by-side comparison.

[Methos1979]

Unless there is some sort of figuring in the top, back and side mahogany, the CME pitch sounds like car-salesman talk, honestly. The hot hide glue is a legit up charge although to the tune of a couple grand.

Even $3k is high for a standard SC 1929 00. It's a good 'starting' point but trust me, those guitars typically sell here for down around $2.5k. I bought and sold both mine for right around that not all that long ago.

[J Patrick]

..it is my experience that Santa Cruz guitars that have custom upgrades and premium wood selection are often a cut above their standard offerings...visually and tonally...buying a standard model either new or used may not get you a guitar that is as nice as the one you played..

[sdelsolray]

Beginning this year, SCGC raised prices quite a bit on all of its base models. Here's the text of a post I wrote about this a few weeks ago:

The following information is a summary of conversations I had with two long time SCGC dealers and with SCGC itself.

1. SCGC increased base prices for all models this year a healthy amount but not as high as 30%.

2. About 90% of SCGC orders are custom orders with requested upgrades, changes, etc. to a base model configuration. This increased the price of the guitar over the base model.

3. SCGC has changed this by including a variety of choices, some quite significant, in the base price. For example, you can now choose the top wood (from 100 year old Sitka, Adirondack, European Spruce, Cedar, Redwood or Genuine Mahogany) at no additional charge. Other examples include (i) addy bracing with hot hide glue, (ii) several body, neck and peghead binding choices, (iii) various nut and and saddle string spacing widths and other neck specs, (iv) short scale, (v) different rosettes, (vi) different fingerboard inlays and choice of abalone SCGC logo style and location, (vii) various setups, (viii) various tuners among Schaller, Gotoh and Waverly and (ix) various finishes (including sunburst top), all at no additional charge.

4. Other options will continue to have an upcharge above base price, such as exotic b&s woods, bling, pickup installation, etc.

4. SCGC has also decided to spend more time with each instrument in the building process to increase instrument quality and will be making fewer guitars this year than last year to do this.

I hope that clarifies things a bit.

I suspect the SCGC 1929 00 at CME is either (i) under the new pricing/option regimen or (ii) it was made before the change and has many upcharges for added options.

I suggest you call CME and ask which it is and what options were added to the base model.

On another point, I've owed four different SCGC 1929 all mahogany models (two 00, one 000 and an F) and have played perhaps a dozen others over the years. They are quite consistent over the 10+ years or so they've been made. One thing that did change (back in 2010 or so) is that the V neck was softened a bit from those made in the first few years of production.

IMO, used 1929 models are a good value.

[Mr. Jelly]

Originally Posted by Methos1979

Used they typically sell for low-mid $2k. I've owned two and they were great guitars, for sure.

The used prices appear to be moving up on these and many other guitars. I don't know if it's because of eBay and shipping or other reasons. But the used price seems to be in the low $3,000 range or high $2,000 range if you're lucky or condition.

[Methos1979]

Originally Posted by J Patrick

..it is my experience that Santa Cruz guitars that have custom upgrades and premium wood selection are often a cut above their standard offerings...visually and tonally...buying a standard model either new or used may not get you a guitar that is as nice as the one you played..

Despite my posts about the guitar in the OP being overpriced, I will say that every SC guitar I've owned (all 'standard' models) have been a cut above their contemporary counterparts. The 1929 00's that were selling in the low-to-mid $2k's were incredibly good deals. The all-hogs just seemed to not hold their value as much as their Sitka-topped counterparts. But there were always fantastic guitars. Like I said, I owned two.

I've been out of the all-wood guitar market for about a year now so I was not aware of the significant price boost in the SC base prices. Factory that into the claims about hand-picking woods and then MAYBE that price might be more inline but it still seems like it's a 'sticker' price that begs to be dickered with.

[Shortfinger]

There are just not a lot of them out there right now in the used market. I'm sorely tempted.

I'd better go to the nearby GC tomorrow and play that Gibson L-00 again, to make sure it's the same loudbox I remember from a month ago.

Or I can just enjoy the only one of my three instruments I have with me, the LS-TA Yamaha. The others are down in the winter home and I won't see them until November. The LS-TA is teaching me to thumb-pick right now, doing a fingerpicked blues piece by the great Daddy Stovepipe.

This GAS is beating me up. It all started in mid-May when we visited Denver, which is the garden of eden for guitar shopping. Our winter home location is a guitar wasteland. When in Denver, I got really really liking an L-00, then went fifteen minutes away and went crazy over a Collings baby all-hog at almost 4x the price of the L-00. And here in Chicagoland, I can't help myself when we go see our son in the city, him being fifteen minutes from CME. Thus the new focus on the SC.

[J Patrick]

Originally Posted by Shortfinger

There are just not a lot of them out there right now in the used market. I'm sorely tempted.

I'd better go to the nearby GC tomorrow and play that Gibson L-00 again, to make sure it's the same loudbox I remember from a month ago.

Or I can just enjoy the only one of my three instruments I have with me, the LS-TA Yamaha. The others are down in the winter home and I won't see them until November. The LS-TA is teaching me to thumb-pick right now, doing a fingerpicked blues piece by the great Daddy Stovepipe.

This GAS is beating me up. It all started in mid-May when we visited Denver, which is the garden of eden for guitar shopping. Our winter home location is a guitar wasteland. When in Denver, I got really really liking an L-00, then went fifteen minutes away and went crazy over a Collings baby all-hog at almost 4x the price of the L-00. And here in Chicagoland, I can't help myself when we go see our son in the city, him being fifteen minutes from CME. Thus the new focus on the SC.

..I”m gonna be a bit of an enabler and fuel your gas with my recent experience...first off...I am a Santa Cruz fan and think everyone should give em a try....not just in a shop but spend some time with one...sure lots of folks have done just that and found guitars by other makers that they liked better...but...lots of us have not...

...I digress...for several years I have been gassing for a Santa Cruz Firefly....it started when my wife, (my favorite person on earth), gave me a 1962 Gibson LG-2 3/4 for my birthday..cool little guitar...but limited in the sweet spot and sporting a teensy neck...very short scale...I love it and learned to deal with the neck....in reality it was Gibson’s entry level folk guitar aimed at kids and was done with a blow it and go approach to production...but built light enough with solid wood to have a pleasing tone...still I was thinking about a high end version of this cool little guitar and how a Firefly was nearly identical in size and shape but with a bigger neck and high finish level...

...anyhow...even though I had the means I resisted buying a Firefly because of the expense...like many...I have some really nice guitars to enjoy...so I finally caved and waited for one to show up used that had the wood and finish combo I was wanting...I posted a WTB ad in the classifieds here one with no luck....and then one turned up on Reverb and I bought it...

....best purchase I have made maybe ever...I have had it for a few months and it is the last guitar I will ever part with....I ain’t gonna brag on it here but my point in this response is that sometimes it’s time to pull the trigger and get that one you always thought about...

[woodbox]

Hey Shortfinger,
"This GAS is beating me up."

Yep.
The first time I played a Santa Cruz, it was a 000 1929, and I couldn't forget it.

It was offered among half dozen Collings, Bourgeois, Huss and Dalton, and a couple Martins, which is what I went in for.
I'm a Martin Guy, have been since I was 11 and Grandma gave me the 1928 0-18 she had bought new.
I grew up listening to and playing a vintage Martin.

But then one day I played that Santa Cruz.
It was more than an ear thing.. it was a feeling, actually feeling the guitar.
I could hardly believe the way that SC vibrated!

It's the one I miss most.
I've owned a hundred guitars, have sold 80 of them, miss the Santa Cruz 1929 000 most of all.

"This GAS is beating me up."
Yep, I get that.

[Maryc-k]

The list price (Santa Cruz has had a significant price increase over the last year) of the 1929 is right around $7k. So, the CME price is correct. It’s a bit of a challenge to sell those, but the rest of the line sells pretty well.

I have noticed that Sylvan’s stock (on just about everything) is a bit older. They probably have not raised the prices on their older inventory.

Pricing across all the small shop builders has risen quite a bit. I think we are going to see less guitars being built at increased prices. Wait until you see the price of a Lowden after Brexit is finished.