#31
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One of the mix engineers who throws mastering work my way has a tendency to mix some genres very hot. By very hot I mean he gives me tracks to master that have practically no headroom at all. It makes it a bit more difficult to master and there's no reason for it but he insists that those tracks called for it. I give him crap for it all the time.
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |
#32
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----------------------------------- Creator of The Parlando Project Guitars: 20th Century Seagull S6-12, S6 Folk, Seagull M6; '00 Guild JF30-12, '01 Martin 00-15, '16 Martin 000-17, '07 Parkwood PW510, Epiphone Biscuit resonator, Merlin Dulcimer, and various electric guitars, basses.... |
#33
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It's one of those "I do not think that means what you think it means" things. What normalization is, or was originally, is "the loudest point in your file hits digital zero." But the term sounds like it should mean "your song's volume sounds just as normal as all the others."
Last edited by Brent Hahn; 05-04-2021 at 09:13 AM. |
#34
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A completely different way of looking at Compression with three possible theories:1. The Inverse Square law. A prime example is with flash photography. If you are taking a picture of someone indoors, and they are standing 10 feet from you, and a wall is another 10 feet behind the the person being photographed= You might naturally assume that there is half the light reaching the wall as compared to the person being photographed. But this is not so. The inverse Square law states there only being 1/4 the amount of light, as there is on the Person being photographed. I believe Sound goes through a similar path as the Inverse Square Law.2. Close Distance Hearing Are we able to hear the complete dynamic range in which we the artist are playing? Personally my ears are only about 10 inches away from the soundhole. I lean a bit into my guitar and sometimes even closer. We might not be able to hear the complete dynamic range at such close distances. There are several possibilities as to why this might be in regards to how our ears work."Here is how the ear works normally: The sound waves are gathered by the outer ear and sent down the ear canal to the eardrum. The sound waves cause the eardrum to vibrate, which sets the three tiny bones in the middle ear into motion. The motion of the bones causes the fluid in the inner ear or cochlea to move. " Now who is to say if there are not differences in each of us in just how much our eardrum vibrates and how the cochlea moves. And what about hearing loss? I certainly have some especially in the higher frequencies. So the big question is; if my levels are down at certain frequencies...can I differentiate volumes accurately at close distances? 3. Perception. And to go one step further, let us look at a beautiful photograph of a vase of flowers. The Photographer does everything possible to compliment the flowers with a nice background. In real life, Those Flowers are just sitting on a table top. Yet, those flowers in our normal household table, still evoke great emotion. Does not our minds, when we play...compress the sound to some degree? Do we not overlook-refabricate in our minds to suit how we wish to hear the piece? Think of that American Idol kid who is auditioning and thinks he has a great voice, but in reality...it is horrible. His mind is turning it into something it is not. I know I have sung out of key...but when I was singing..it sounded good to me.In the End, As the artist playing the instrument, compression just might be normalizing what we actually hear - (Think we hear) - ( or how are ears work at close distances) |
#35
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All these considerations plus more (for instance reproduction systems) must be factored in to producing a consumable, enjoyable recording. Bob
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
#36
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Then there are the attack and release settings regarding say how much initial transients you want to get through and how much you want to keep one note from affecting the next note.
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Derek Coombs Youtube -> Website -> Music -> Tabs Guitars by Mark Blanchard, Albert&Mueller, Paul Woolson, Collings, Composite Acoustics, and Derek Coombs "Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." Woods hands pick by eye and ear
Made to one with pride and love To be that we hold so dear A voice from heavens above |
#37
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A question for Bob, Because he is a professional engineer and who's replies I always enjoy; How does LUFS register when using Parallel compression? Does it register only the uncompressed signal...as the uncompressed signal has a greater range? As an example...if you split the signal right down the middle...and half of your content is Uncompressed and half is compressed...then how is it perceived-measured Technically? While the parallel compression offers compression to the piece, Theoretically the uncompressed signal is still offering a greater range?Hmmm? writing it out is always good as I may have somewhat realized an answer to my own question. The uncompressed signal volume is down as it is now split(not really split but the effect is near the same)? so the registering of that signal is also down? Well there has to be more to it than that. Cause it is still using both a compressed signal and an uncompressed signal. |
#38
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The LUFS standard is a measurement of signal density. Parallel compression splits the signal into two channels, one uncompressed and the other compressed. Typically what is done on the compressed channel is high-threshold limiting to remove the transients. Once the transients are squashed, the compressed signal is blended back in with the uncompressed signal at a level higher than it could be without compression. The whole point of parallel compression is to allow some of the lower level persistence portion of a signal to be brought up higher in relation to the transients. You are thus increasing the density of the signal. Visually, look at the first example in Doug's post and think of it as raising up the material between the whiskers of the transients.
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
#39
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Sort of - yes, but also no. If you don't limit your LRA your -14LUFS average will feel a lot less impactful than a mastered track. It's just the way the whole integrated loudness thing works. If you're LRA (new version of Crest Factor) is too big, you will be arriving at the integrated loudness sooner than tracks that have been mastered to control the LRA & hit the LUFS target the way they want to. It's so much better to handle the integrated loudness yourself (or with the help of a mastering engineer) than to let some algorithm figure it out for you. Averages are just that, averages...and there are many ways to arrive at an average. So, while 2 tracks will arrive at the -14LUFS regardless, a mastered track will feel louder and more impactful because it has controlled the LRA. Therefore having a larger portion of the track closer to the top of the range than an uncompressed, unmastered track. We all want to see the loudness wars go away - they won't just yet. Perceived loudness is complicated. We're certainly in a better place than before, but the system can still be manipulated.
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-Steve 1927 Martin 00-21 1986 Fender Strat 1987 Ibanez RG560 1988 Fender Fretless J Bass 1991 Washburn HB-35s 1995 Taylor 812ce 1996 Taylor 510c (custom) 1996 Taylor 422-R (Limited Edition) 1997 Taylor 810-WMB (Limited Edition) 1998 Taylor 912c (Custom) 2019 Fender Tele |
#40
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Another thought - While compression can be a "technical" thing, like a tool to help reach a specific integrated loudness target, it should first be a "feel" thing. It has to be musical. It has to help the track breathe.
I'm training a new assistant at the studio & we had a long discussion about compression the other day. What helped her understand the benefit of compression in mastering or on a master bus or stem submix was when I told her to think about compression, not so much in the technical sense of reducing peaks to allows the overall volume to be increased, but to think about it as taking all those sounds in the mix and squeezing them a little closer together. That's the idea behind the "glue" compression everyone talks about. You're forcing the sounds to cozy up to each other. The audio equivalent of a Gaussian blur in Photoshop. A very slight blur just reduces the "separateness" of all the elements. I don't know a single Grammy winning mixer who doesn't compress their 2-bus, and I know a few of them. This is the reason they do. Not for the technical, but for a musicality of it's feel, and that's how they describe it and talk about it. So, regardless of how you want to approach the loudness standards, there is a ton of benefit in adding some compression with a really nice sounding compressor.
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-Steve 1927 Martin 00-21 1986 Fender Strat 1987 Ibanez RG560 1988 Fender Fretless J Bass 1991 Washburn HB-35s 1995 Taylor 812ce 1996 Taylor 510c (custom) 1996 Taylor 422-R (Limited Edition) 1997 Taylor 810-WMB (Limited Edition) 1998 Taylor 912c (Custom) 2019 Fender Tele |
#41
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For solo guitar, I typically put an LA-2 compressor on the track, with the compression light enough that the meters don't even move. It might be adding a half db or so of compression, but the point has nothing to do with achieving a loudness target, I just like the very subtle effect it has on tone and/or feel.
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#42
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |
#43
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Bob
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
#44
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If you don't start mixing into it fairly early in the process, when you slap it on it's going change your balances. Maybe dramatically. If that happens and you've already started to write automation, you pretty much have to start over. Why put yourself through that extra work?
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#45
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |