Improv Question: scales for bluegrass solos

[BlueStarfish]

The notes from the second bar are “mostly” from the C Major pentatonic scale (which again has same notes as A Minor pentatonic, but starting on C instead of A).

There are two D#’s, which is a sharped 2nd. This would be a pretty standard passing note to insert into a bluegrass lick. Again think G runs.

Another way to think of those two D#’s — is that they are the “blue” notes from a blues scale in A (that is, an A minor pentatonic scale with the extra blue notes). But it being bluegrass, that scale is played starting on C instead of A.

Try it. Take your notes from an A blues scale. Except start on C instead of A. It will sound like bluegrass.

OK, here’s another part of the puzzle for you. This is easier to see if you have a piano or keyboard instrument in front of you. Play a G Major pentatonic scale (G-A-B-D-E, which are mostly the notes of a G6 chord arpeggiated, though 6 chords are not usually played all at once in bluegrass). Next, play a C Major pentatonic scale (C-D-E-G-A). Next, play a D Major pentatonic scale (D-E-F#-A-B). These are the 1-4-5 chords in G. What you should see is that these three major pentatonic scales cover all of the scale tones in the key of G Major.

Here’s why I point that out. You keep asking “when the chord changes, do you change the scale too?” Well the root of the chord changes from 1 to 4 to 5... so the best fitting major pentatonic scale changes along with it. However (at least with a 1-4-5 progression) these major pentatonic scales are all just subsets of the major scale associated with the primary key of the song. So the answer to your question is “yes ... and no at the same time.” That’s why you aren’t getting a clean answer to your question.

That’s a lot of complication and theory which is nice but not the same as chops. But since you asked!

[Fatfinger McGee]

Great question, and one I'm trying to wrap my head around too. Both my theory and chops are pretty slow and 'think about it', but hopefully my experience will help.

Here's my answer: it's both, but it's also a little bit beside the point. For me, the goal is to play an improv that's firmly connected to the piece.

When good players improv, they signal the chord changes in the melody ('play the changes). If you knew the song, you could sing it over their solo (more or less, accounting for the repeats). That doesn't mean they necessarily PLAY the change by switching the root of the scale they're soloing over. They might or might not, depending on what they're going for.

If you want a recent example, sign up for David Hamburger's Fingerstyle Five course and check out January's song, Midnight Special in C. The improv exercises have variations of a C major pentatonic scale, played over the I-IV-V. Call and response: the IV call (which has a nice floaty Fmaj7 sound), the C response (back home), and the G7 (ok what's next).

My recommendation, beyond signing up for the course, is to get this stuff under your fingers, in context to a song. For me, reading theory + aimless fractured noodling got me nowhere. Thoughtful improv practice within the framework of a song is a lot more useful. Painfully slow, but useful.

[JonPR]

The simple answer is "major pentatonic of each chord".

In a major key, I-IV-V, those scales are all subsets of the major key scale, plus they follow the chords (contain the 1-3-5 of each chord plus consonant passing notes 2 and 6). IOW, you can't go wrong!

Chromatic passing notes - as mentioned - are typically the #2/b3 of each pentatonic, often approaching the 3rd of the chord from below. That's the "blues" effect.
Adding that note to the pentatonic makes it the so-called "major blues scale" - but in this case you're applying it to the root of each chord, not the key blues scale over all the chords.

Naturally - as NormanKliman points out - when you get b7s on either the I or the IV, that gives you additional choices - "colour" notes - but the major pent of the chord will still work. (Usually b7s work best resolving downwards, but will work as part of 1-3-5-b7 arpeggios too.)

Then again, any chromatic passing notes you like can work, when you want to stretch a little further.
The #4/b5 also makes a good chromatic approach to the 5th of any chord, meaning you could have a clear chromatic run: 2-#2-3-4-#5-5 - could be cool now and then (down as well as up), but (a) it's not the sort of thing you want to do too often ("wow" gets "old" quite quickly) and (b) you still need to understand how it targets chord tones. Landing on chord tones is always what makes "wrong notes" sound "right".

[Andyrondack]

Originally Posted by BlueStarfish

The notes from the second bar are “mostly” from the C Major pentatonic scale (which again has same notes as A Minor pentatonic, but starting on C instead of A).

There are two D#’s, which is a sharped 2nd. This would be a pretty standard passing note to insert into a bluegrass lick. Again think G runs.

Another way to think of those two D#’s — is that they are the “blue” notes from a blues scale in A (that is, an A minor pentatonic scale with the extra blue notes). But it being bluegrass, that scale is played starting on C instead of A.

Try it. Take your notes from an A blues scale. Except start on C instead of A. It will sound like bluegrass.

OK, here’s another part of the puzzle for you. This is easier to see if you have a piano or keyboard instrument in front of you. Play a G Major pentatonic scale (G-B-D-E, which are the notes of a G6 chord arpeggiated, though 6 chords are not usually played all at once in bluegrass). Next, play a C Major pentatonic scale (C-E-G-A). Next, play a D Major pentatonic scale (D-F#-A-B). These are the 1-4-5 chords in G. What you should see is that these three major pentatonic scales cover all of the scale tones in the key of G Major.

Here’s why I point that out. You keep asking “when the chord changes, do you change the scale too?” Well the root of the chord changes from 1 to 4 to 5... so the best fitting major pentatonic scale changes along with it. However (at least with a 1-4-5 progression) these major pentatonic scales are all just subsets of the major scale associated with the primary key of the song. So the answer to your question is “yes ... and no at the same time.” That’s why you aren’t getting a clean answer to your question.

That’s a lot of complication and theory which is nice but not the same as chops. But since you asked!

How come your pentatonic scales all have four notes?

[BlueStarfish]

Ack i missed the 2nds! Shows what happens before coffee. Sometimes it’s easier to play this stuff than describe it. Add in the A / D / E. Thanks!

[Andyrondack]

I interpret that C bar somewhat differently, the previous G bar and last G notes lean heavily toward C then a little chromatic run passing over the flattened 3rd takes you to the C note, that then goes into reverse and leads to a major scale run to the higher C, sure the flattened 3rd is a 'blue' note and maybe this style of music picked up the habit from blues but here it's used as a passing tone in a chromatic run, it passes far too quickly to perform the same function that it would do in blues where it's all about that ambiguity between major and minor but Billy Strings doesn't hang on to it long enough to even hear it as a distinctive note, the point of the last three notes before C is to target that C note and C chords in the simplest and most emphatic way possible, it's just a run up the major scale in C, listening to Billy Strings video sounds to me that there is an awfull lot of running up and down the major scale to hit a chordal tone.
So the answer to the question is yes it's an example of 'chasing the chords' using notes from the C major scale to resolve very un-subtly in a linear fashion straight to C note and chords.