McPherson Sable or Emerald X30

[esimms86]

Originally Posted by mikealpine

There is a beautiful X30 available from the factory. I am asking if they can retrofit fretboard dots. It may be a silly question, but I don't know if their necks are easily removed and worked on, or if dots have to be done before the neck is totally finished. If they can do that, I'm in. Otherwise I will see what the lead time is for ordering one. I want the horsepower.

I ordered one of their in stock X30's just a week ago. They will be adding fretboard dots to the guitar for an upcharge fee of 200 USD. Chloe informs me that that modification is anticipated to add 2 weeks before being ready to ship. BTW, I had also looked into adding a Krivo humbucker and was quoted 200 USD for that as well; I eventually opted not to add the Krivo.

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by ed62

I once experienced strange tones coming from my Emerald harp guitar but it was just the cat rubbing its face on the sub bass strings....sounded more like a sasquatch than a wolf to me

If you are playing a gig and your cat does that to add to the frolic and fun, does s/he get sideman pay (assuming a union AF of M) gig?

Tony

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by esimms86

I ordered one of their in stock X30's just a week ago. They will be adding fretboard dots to the guitar for an upcharge fee of 200 USD. Chloe informs me that that modification is anticipated to add 2 weeks before being ready to ship. BTW, I had also looked into adding a Krivo humbucker and was quoted 200 USD for that as well; I eventually opted not to add the Krivo.

Can you report back here on the wolf tone issue? I have a sense that the X30 would be suitable for that sasquatch due to its size.

Tony

[mikealpine]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

Also read in a thread around here was the notion that the X30 has a wolf tone that is very bothersome when playing fingerstyle. Since I have never seen one of these, much played one, I can only go by what is said here. The poster(s) discussing the problem are among those whose information I do trust.

I can tell you that I have not experienced such wolf tones from my Sable and that I never play with a pick.

What I don't yet know is whether my Sable would be capable of a loud wolf whistle if I played outside and the usual subjects of such a wolf whistle were to pass by. That would be embarrassing.

Tony

I play very little, if any, fingerstyle. I'm more of a light-medium strummer. I play mostly chords and limited lead lines. It's one reason I want the guitar to natively be louder; I can always dial it back to play softly, but have more than enough headroom if I decide to dig in.

And here's the embarrassing confession...I don't know what a "wolf note" is. I'm not sure I can identify it if it happens.

I have been occasionally known to wolf whistle, but that was in my younger days!

Originally Posted by ed62

I once experienced strange tones coming from my Emerald harp guitar but it was just the cat rubbing its face on the sub bass strings....sounded more like a sasquatch than a wolf to me

Originally Posted by esimms86

I ordered one of their in stock X30's just a week ago. They will be adding fretboard dots to the guitar for an upcharge fee of 200 USD. Chloe informs me that that modification is anticipated to add 2 weeks before being ready to ship. BTW, I had also looked into adding a Krivo humbucker and was quoted 200 USD for that as well; I eventually opted not to add the Krivo.

Good to know they can do this to an in stock guitar. I'm fine with the wait time. There's a walnut veneered X30 that looks gorgeous. We'll see what they say. Never heard of the Krivo pickup, but it looks very interesting.

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by mikealpine

I play very little, if any, fingerstyle. I'm more of a light-medium strummer. I play mostly chords and limited lead lines. It's one reason I want the guitar to natively be louder; I can always dial it back to play softly, but have more than enough headroom if I decide to dig in.

And here's the embarrassing confession...I don't know what a "wolf note" is. I'm not sure I can identify it if it happens.

I have been occasionally known to wolf whistle, but that was in my younger days!

A wolf tone is a specific note that jumps out in volume above the other notes. You would definitely notice it and once you do, it will drive you nuts.

I think somebody else earlier in the thread provided more info about resonant frequency of the guitar body and that sort of thing, but what I mention is simply what you will hear, without the explanation for it.

Tony

[mikealpine]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

A wolf tone is a specific note that jumps out in volume above the other notes. You would definitely notice it and once you do, it will drive you nuts.

I think somebody else earlier in the thread provided more info about resonant frequency of the guitar body and that sort of thing, but what I mention is simply what you will hear, without the explanation for it.

Tony

Thanks Tony. Seems strange that, if this has been reported to Emerald, they haven't taken steps to address it in some manner. I haven't heard it mentioned in any of the online reviews, nor have I noticed anything odd when listening to demos. Certainly something to think about!

[GuitarLuva]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

Also read in a thread around here was the notion that the X30 has a wolf tone that is very bothersome when playing fingerstyle. Since I have never seen one of these, much played one, I can only go by what is said here. The poster(s) discussing the problem are among those whose information I do trust.

I can tell you that I have not experienced such wolf tones from my Sable and that I never play with a pick.

What I don't yet know is whether my Sable would be capable of a loud wolf whistle if I played outside and the usual subjects of such a wolf whistle were to pass by. That would be embarrassing.

Tony

Tony,

Thank you for the vote of confidence, it is much appreciated. I apologize, I had full intentions of replying to some of your earlier posts (and others as well) but my AGF time has been limited as of late. Your previous post to this one also made me laugh.

Once I first encountered wolf tones on acoustic guitars many moons ago I always go searching for them. So far I haven't found any on the Sable (fingers crossed). For some reason my fingers seem to find them (must be the way I fingerpick). My Gibson and Yamaha dreads have a subtle wolf on F, which is pretty common on dreads. My Godin Metropolis however does not. The wolf location on the X30 is certainly odd (in my opinion) as I personally never experienced a guitar with a wolf down that low in the frequency range. To revisit what I said earlier, I can move it lower and/or remove it by adding mass to the bridge but unfortunately too much else is lost in the process. For people who strictly strum cowboy chords (which the X30 strives on) it's totally possible that people wouldn't even know it existed. Unfortunately for me though as soon as I fingerpick or flatpick those individual notes they pop right in my face and it drives me crazy. The offset soundhole in this case only makes it worse. That being said though strumming the X30 and feeling the wave of sound go through your body is enough of a reason for me to keep this guitar around.

[Earl49]

Originally Posted by mikealpine

....And here's the embarrassing confession...I don't know what a "wolf note" is. I'm not sure I can identify it if it happens. )

Tony's explanation is good. Let me elaborate a bit. A similar thing happens when you sing in the shower. There is that one particular note that really booms or resonates. When the wavelength of that sound coincides with one of the dimensions in the room, it creates a standing wave between parallel surfaces that reinforces on itself. It is different in a guitar, of course. There are several natural resonances - air resonance of the body cavity, Helmholtz resonance (the blowing across a soda bottle effect) for the sound hole, and sometimes vibration modes in the top. It gets pretty complicated, and I won't claim to fully understand music instrument design myself. The net effect is that certain tones will spike in relative intensity above the other notes. The opposite effect is a dead spot, a place where there is less volume despite the same input energy. To an extent these are unavoidable. Builders will change things like bracing, top thickness, bridge location, and body dimensions to put these wolf tones in between scale notes -- like between F and F# -- or below the range of the low E, if they can.

I do play about 75% bare nails finger style, and now I am curious to go study my X30 in more detail. But I'm also half afraid of what I might find. Once perceived, you cannot un-hear a wolf tone. My X30 was pretty "boomy" on the low E note when I first got it, but shimming up the saddle to fix a buzzing string / low setup problem also tamed that excess boom. I worry about finding a wolf tone when tuning down.....

[mikealpine]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

Tony,

Thank you for the vote of confidence, it is much appreciated. I apologize, I had full intentions of replying to some of your earlier posts (and others as well) but my AGF time has been limited as of late. Your previous post to this one also made me laugh.

Once I first encountered wolf tones on acoustic guitars many moons ago I always go searching for them. So far I haven't found any on the Sable (fingers crossed). For some reason my fingers seem to find them (must be the way I fingerpick). My Gibson and Yamaha dreads have a subtle wolf on F, which is pretty common on dreads. My Godin Metropolis however does not. The wolf location on the X30 is certainly odd (in my opinion) as I personally never experienced a guitar with a wolf down that low in the frequency range. To revisit what I said earlier, I can move it lower and/or remove it by adding mass to the bridge but unfortunately too much else is lost in the process. For people who strictly strum cowboy chords (which the X30 strives on) it's totally possible that people wouldn't even know it existed. Unfortunately for me though as soon as I fingerpick or flatpick those individual notes they pop right in my face and it drives me crazy. The offset soundhole in this case only makes it worse. That being said though strumming the X30 and feeling the wave of sound go through your body is enough of a reason for me to keep this guitar around.

Originally Posted by Earl49

Tony's explanation is good. Let me elaborate a bit. A similar thing happens when you sing in the shower. There is that one particular note that really booms or resonates. When the wavelength of that sound coincides with one of the dimensions in the room, it creates a standing wave between parallel surfaces that reinforces on itself. It is different in a guitar, of course. There are several natural resonances - air resonance of the body cavity, Helmholtz resonance (the blowing across a soda bottle effect) for the sound hole, and sometimes vibration modes in the top. It gets pretty complicated, and I won't claim to fully understand music instrument design myself. The net effect is that certain tones will spike in relative intensity above the other notes. The opposite effect is a dead spot, a place where there is less volume despite the same input energy. To an extent these are unavoidable. Builders will change things like bracing, top thickness, bridge location, and body dimensions to put these wolf tones in between scale notes -- like between F and F# -- or below the range of the low E, if they can.

I do play about 75% bare nails finger style, and now I am curious to go study my X30 in more detail. But I'm also half afraid of what I might find. Once perceived, you cannot un-hear a wolf tone. My X30 was pretty "boomy" on the low E note when I first got it, but shimming up the saddle to fix a buzzing string / low setup problem also tamed that excess boom.

You all are a wealth of information, and I appreciate it very much! I'm more afraid of "boomy" than "wolf", but (as is often the case with a lot of information), I'm hitting the "paralysis by analysis" stage and second-guessing the earlier decision about the in-stock X30. That's the rough thing about not being able to test drive an instrument under your particular playing style.

I'd like to think you can tone down "boom" with brighter strings. I'm more Taylor than Martin in that I prefer a high end shimmer, but know I'd sacrifice some of that to get the volume that a jumbo can provide. Maybe there are other tricks my local guitar tech can suggest.

Earl, I'm curious as to what you find on your wolf hunt, although I hope your playing experience doesn't get ruined in the process!

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by mikealpine

You all are a wealth of information, and I appreciate it very much! I'm more afraid of "boomy" than "wolf", but (as is often the case with a lot of information), I'm hitting the "paralysis by analysis" stage and second-guessing the earlier decision about the in-stock X30. That's the rough thing about not being able to test drive an instrument under your particular playing style.

I'd like to think you can tone down "boom" with brighter strings. I'm more Taylor than Martin in that I prefer a high end shimmer, but know I'd sacrifice some of that to get the volume that a jumbo can provide. Maybe there are other tricks my local guitar tech can suggest.

Earl, I'm curious as to what you find on your wolf hunt, although I hope your playing experience doesn't get ruined in the process!

In some areas, certain species of wolves are endangered species and therefore, protected. You might find that you are simply stuck with having to put up with wolves and their tones.

Tony

[DavidE]

Originally Posted by esimms86

I ordered one of their in stock X30's just a week ago. They will be adding fretboard dots to the guitar for an upcharge fee of 200 USD. Chloe informs me that that modification is anticipated to add 2 weeks before being ready to ship. BTW, I had also looked into adding a Krivo humbucker and was quoted 200 USD for that as well; I eventually opted not to add the Krivo.

Wow. For $200, I’d just buy stickers for $10.

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by DavidE

Wow. For $200, I’d just buy stickers for $10.

Just drill holes and fill them with toothpaste. There could even be a Red Green show episode on how to "bling up your guitar" for pennies.

Tony

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by DavidE

Wow. For $200, I’d just buy stickers for $10.

And then you'd have $10 worth of stickers that would peel off and need replacing 20 times.

I'm confounded by how cheap people who will happily spend over $2k on a guitar can be.

[tbeltrans]

Originally Posted by eatswodo

And then you'd have $10 worth of stickers that would peel off and need replacing 20 times.

I'm confounded by how cheap people who will happily spend over $2k on a guitar can be.

Nothing to sneeze at here. I know who the acoustic guitar players are in my neighborhood and watch their trash to see when they have changed strings. I pick these out of their trash, boil them, and restring my guitars. Dumpster diving to keep my McPhersons playing nice.

Tony

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by tbeltrans

Nothing to sneeze at here. I know who the acoustic guitar players are in my neighborhood and watch their trash to see when they have changed strings. I pick these out of their trash, boil them, and restring my guitars. Dumpster diving to keep my McPhersons playing nice.

Tony

Well, you do have about 15 of them, Tony. I can understand the urge to economize