Tube amp for gibs 335

localguitarist · #1 01-04-2011, 10:21 PM

Ok so I've been playing a lot more electric than I used to in a 4 piece band setting. I have a 2008 335 that I play through a fender deville. I get some pretty nice tones out of, but I'm wanting to expand my horizons with another combo amp. I want to use both amps together and switch back and forth. My amplifying experience is in the acoustic guitar world where I'm very happy with my pendulum/Daedalus system. but there are so many choices of electric amps. Which ones fall in what's schools of tone and theory? I'm trying to narrow down my options with some advice.

Thanks

stevecuss · #2 01-04-2011, 10:58 PM

Hi Chris,

well, its a broad question, so I imagine you'll get a lot of broad answers, but here are a couple of basics and a recommendation:

I'm definitely using generalizations here, but hopefully this will help you.

Your Fender amp is a 6L6 based tube amp - classic American clean sound and overall a nice amp. The smaller American amps typically use 6V6 tubes. So a pair of 6L6 tubes will generate about 40 watts and a pair of 6V6 tubes will produce around 20 watts. Both plenty loud, but the more watts, the more clean headroom, generally.

So the 6L6 and 6V6 tube amps capture the classic american tube amp sound. Its a great tone and suits your 335 very nicely.

Your Deville is a big 6L6 amp with great clean and reverb. Heavy, I imagine!

The smaller classic Fender amps (such as the vintage deluxe and princeton) use 6V6 tubes and are very sweet sounding amps and at less wattage (15 - 22 watts), they'll provide tube distortion sooner on the volume dial which is generally where the magic is for electric guitar.

British sounding amps usually have a pushed midrange and/or a jangly high end and use EL34 tubes or the smaller EL84. They are the equivalent wattage as the American tube amps.

Marshall is British, usually EL34 tubes and generally high gain, but actually offers quite nice clean sound.

Vox is British, less wattage and jumpers its two channels to provide a fun 3d sound with EL84 tubes.

If it were my money, I'd be looking at an EL84 based British sounding tube amp. Its a nice alternative to the American sound and will really make your 335 sing.

So I'd recomment the Vox AC15TB if you're on a budget, (about $400 used)

or AC30 for the full vox experience. Very nice trem, decent reverb and the all important 3d sound with the two channels blended together.

Its worth either paying for the blue celestion speaker or install a weber blue dog (which is a nice replica for much less $$)

If you'd like to put more money in, then you have tons of great custom EL84 amps to choose from.

The old Matchless amps are amazing, as are the new Bad Cat amps and any number of Dr Z. But really, if you have a couple of thousand dollars, you have dozens of great choices here.

Now, having said all that (yeah, as if that wan't enough....sheesh), Larry Carlton defined the 335 tone by playing through a Dumble.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfchN7G-oQk

Dumbles are insanely expensive. Howard Dumble modified Fender amps for his clients and produced amazing amps as a result. SRV played Dumbles, as does John Mayer now.

Ceriatone and Two Rock are two companies that claim to make a nice Dumble clone if you want to explore that route. Pricey, but unique tone and some would say it is the definitive amp tone for a 335.

anyway, lots to chew on, but hopefully that helps.

again, if it were me, I'd be buying a Vox or EL84 based British style amp, turning the master volume to about 6 or 7 and sitting on the amp to get some nice feedback out of that wonderful semi hollow!

best wishes on your quest

Steve

localguitarist · #3 01-05-2011, 07:39 PM

Thanx steve! That is what I was looking for. A good broad answer for a good broad question. I think I understand what your saying about the American verses British sound. Ive heard a lot of back and forth in my pa board search a while back. Different beast but aparently British and American make good sound adjectives. I really like the thickness of my fender. I might head the vox/Marshall route for right now. Although I'd love to get my hands on a custom amp. I really like a good clean sound and a natural breakup. Any thoughts on messa?

Taylorplayer · #4 01-05-2011, 07:49 PM

some simple advice, from a simple minded man:

1). tube amps are the only way to go (I say that with no reservation)

2). you don't need high wattage to get good and / or loud sound.

3). buy the amp you want - the way you want it (ie with whatever tubes / speaker(s) you like). yes you can upgrade later - but who wants to wait?

4). respect the fact that tube amps can develop very lethal voltage through the caps

5). I like clean sounding amps - and prefer to "color" things (if desired) using pedals

best wishes on your search - please keep us informed.

stevecuss · #5 01-05-2011, 11:12 PM

Hi Chris,

well, first of all, I agree with TP on all accounts.

As for Mesa - very fine amps, but pretty pricey for what you get and also a very complex amp. They are known for their amp overdrive, which sounds like the opposite direction you're heading. (classic mesa sound is Creed, for example.)

We all have our favorites and there are so many incredible amps out there. Do you have a price range in mind? Hard to beat a Vox AC30 for British clean and slight breakup sound.

muscmp · #6 01-06-2011, 12:31 AM

an old gibson amp. i have a few and they are hot with a gibson guitar! that's what they tested them with!

you may have to replace some filter caps or resistor but you'll have a great amp. look for a GA20T. i have one and it works great with my 335. it puts out about 18-22 watts so it is great for recording purposes.

good luck with your search!

devnulljp · #7 01-06-2011, 12:49 AM

335 into an old AC30 is tone heaven.
My other amps are old Traynors and they sound real good too.
Depends what kind of sound you want though.

Taylorplayer · #8 01-06-2011, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muscmp

an old gibson amp. i have a few and they are hot with a gibson guitar! that's what they tested them with!

you may have to replace some filter caps or resistor but you'll have a great amp. look for a GA20T. i have one and it works great with my 335. it puts out about 18-22 watts so it is great for recording purposes.

good luck with your search!

mike has quite the amp collection... seems like good advice!

Trumpeter · #9 01-06-2011, 12:01 PM

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mr. beaumont · #10 01-06-2011, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taylorplayer

some simple advice, from a simple minded man:

1). tube amps are the only way to go (I say that with no reservation)

2). you don't need high wattage to get good and / or loud sound.

3). buy the amp you want - the way you want it (ie with whatever tubes / speaker(s) you like). yes you can upgrade later - but who wants to wait?

4). respect the fact that tube amps can develop very lethal voltage through the caps

5). I like clean sounding amps - and prefer to "color" things (if desired) using pedals

best wishes on your search - please keep us informed.

1. False, IMHO. You just can't expect a solid state amp to do the job of a tube amp, or vice versa, really. For live jazz tones, for example, I like my solid state amps...clean, loud, and small. Not all solid state amps are 10watt transistor practice amps made in china.

2. Very True. Very True. But you might need a certain amount of watts if you want to play clean in certain, louder settings (drummers)

3. Yes and no. The trouble of turning a 6L6 amp into an EL-34 amp is not worth it, unless you're an amp tech/electrical engineer. Better to have a general idea of what you like before you roll in. Like you say, you can upgrade, but why buy with that in mind--get something you like now.

4. ABSOLUTELY YES.

5. ABSOLUTELY YES.

Allman_Fan · #11 01-06-2011, 12:16 PM

So you have a 410 and (I asssume) you want another one of comparable size/volume and you are going to be carting both of these around?

Just use your clean channel and buy some stomp boxes. For example . . .

Bob Womack · #12 01-06-2011, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by localguitarist

Any thoughts on messa?

Mesa is an amp that takes some tweaking to get the way you want because the controls have a really broad range, so they can have a strong effect. The design philosophy exchanges flexibility for simplicity.

Bob

zombywoof · #13 01-06-2011, 02:08 PM

For what it is worth, you might try an amp with a tube rectifier to see what you think .

zombywoof · #14 01-06-2011, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taylorplayer

some simple advice, from a simple minded man:

1). tube amps are the only way to go (I say that with no reservation)

I also disagree - kinda. I have loved me some tube amps but solid state done right beats tube done wrong. Some of the top of the line solid state amps from the 1960s like the Standels were amazing sounding and had a real edge to them. They could sound as warm as a good tube amp while you could easily go from as clean as it gets to a nice bit of growl.

Mountain Fever · #15 01-06-2011, 02:36 PM

I'll take a stab at a part of this, as I have three Mesa amps.

First, IMHO, most people buy a Mesa mostly for two reasons; They get a really versatile amp that they can dial in a tone on and they are built really well.

You did not mention your playing style or sound that you are looking for and that very much plays into the build characteristics of the amp. They have some really good choices in their Lonestar line. I have the Lonestar Special which offers two channels and three wattage choices on each; 5-15-30. Using the gain control and tone parameters of each channel there are lots of combinations available. Overall, the amp works best when you want something along the lines of a bluesy, slightly overdriven sound at a moderate volume. It is EL-84 based tubewise. They make a Lonestar Classic which is similar but the wattage is upped to 10-50-100 and is 6L6 based which means louder and cleaner.

My remaining amp is the Stiletto Ace, which is EL-34 based and to some degree more of a Marshall sound. It can deliver some really great clean and loud tones at 50 watts fixed.

Mesa has scads of models so there are lots of sounds to be had.

As for the downsides of Mesa...they are pricier than many other choices, but I think worth the money. They are a load weightwise. High quality components make most of the amps land in the 60-80# range. And, lastly, it takes a fair bit of tinkering with the tone controls to dial in a sound that hits you just right. If you simply run everything at 12:00 you may not hear what the amp is capable of producing.

Of similar competing products, I have found that Dr. Z has some really interesting models and one choice you might look at in their line is the Jaz 20-40 which is 6V6 based.

Good luck in your quest.