Martingitdave listens to AeroUSA and gets a Baggs Anthem

[martingitdave]

The title says it all. I purchased a McPherson Sable recently and you can read about it in the Carbon subforum. I've never owned a carbon fiber guitar before, and I'm very impressed with it. It sounds like a wood guitar. But, it has the supernatural ability to resist turning into a pretzel in Chicago weather. So... it's got that going for it.

The McPherson standard pickup is an LR Baggs element with a custom voiced preamp. My ears tell me that the custom preamp includes a wide, but gentle, mid cut. It's musical. However, I play a lot of fingerpicking tunes. And, frankly, I miss the airiness of a mic. My D-28 has a K&K pickup because I want to preserve it's organic goodness. :-) I use ToneDexter with the K&K, or add a mic, or live with less than "ideal" amplified tone.

AeroUSA (aka Aaron) and I have traded lots of correspondence on the topic. When I told him I got a carbon fiber guitar (and after he'd stopped laughing) he suggested the Anthem. This guitar can support the Anthem SL, and I figured, "what the heck."

I played out this weekend and can say that the Anthem system is really a treat to use. It needs to be expertly installed. Once it is balanced, you just plug and play.

I'm still not sure I'm ready to put this kind of system in a lightly built Martin. But, if I were playing every night for a living, I might. What I can say for sure is that a stage guitar, or carbon fiber, seems like a perfect match for a system like this.

[JackB1]

The Anthem SL is great. I have it in my J45

What do you mean by "once it is balanced"? You mean the little screw adjustment?

Originally Posted by martingitdave

AeroUSA (aka Aaron) and I have traded lots of correspondence on the topic. When I told him I got a carbon fiber guitar (and after he'd stopped laughing) he suggested the Anthem. This guitar can support the Anthem SL, and I figured, "what the heck."

I played out this weekend and can say that the Anthem system is really a treat to use. It needs to be expertly installed. Once it is balanced, you just plug and play.

I'm still not sure I'm ready to put this kind of system in a lightly built Martin. But, if I were playing every night for a living, I might. What I can say for sure is that a stage guitar, or carbon fiber, seems like a perfect match for a system like this.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by JackB1

The Anthem SL is great. I have it in my J45

What do you mean by "once it is balanced"? You mean the little screw adjustment?

Yes, partly. With my Sable, the mic placement is very sensitive. I had to remove and reinstall the system to get it balanced right. The element pickup needs to be precisely set to avoid string to string balance issues. And, the mic needed to be moved to find the sweet spot. I suspect this is a function of the carbon fiber versus wooden bridgeplate. Then the mic gain adjustment needs to be made with a nice flat sounding speaker.

This is how someone with OCD would describe the "balancing process."

Normal people would just plug it in and play it. :-)

[Mbroady]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Yes, partly. With my Sable, the mic placement is very sensitive. I had to remove and reinstall the system to get it balanced right. The element pickup needs to be precisely set to avoid string to string balance issues. And, the mic needed to be moved to find the sweet spot. I suspect this is a function of the carbon fiber versus wooden bridgeplate. Then the mic gain adjustment needs to be made with a nice flat sounding speaker.

This is how someone with OCD would describe the "balancing process."

Normal people would just plug it in and play it. :-)

So what was your starting point with the true mic and where did it eventually wind up? How did the sound change once you moved it. I have a rain song with a Fishman UST that goes through a barn door pre. Thinking about experimenting by putting the anthem SL in the guitar.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by Mbroady

So what was your starting point with the true mic and where did it eventually wind up? How did the sound change once you moved it. I have a rain song with a Fishman UST that goes through a barn door pre. Thinking about experimenting by putting the anthem SL in the guitar.

It’s hard to say. I thought I had it lined up on the center line of the saddle the first time. However, I must have missed it and had it just too close to the B string. I installed it more carefully the second time on the centerline between the D and G. And it worked. The first time it sounded hollow. My understanding is that small changes in position are not supposed to make a difference. Perhaps my experience is a fluke. Or, as I presume, the McPherson is sensitive in that area.

[JackB1]

Since it's a "mic" and its picking up sound inside the soundhole, you wouldn't think small placement changes would have much effect?

Originally Posted by martingitdave

It’s hard to say. I thought I had it lined up on the center line of the saddle the first time. However, I must have missed it and had it just too close to the B string. I installed it more carefully the second time on the centerline between the D and G. And it worked. The first time it sounded hollow. My understanding is that small changes in position are not supposed to make a difference. Perhaps my experience is a fluke. Or, as I presume, the McPherson is sensitive in that area.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by JackB1

Since it's a "mic" and its picking up sound inside the soundhole, you wouldn't think small placement changes would have much effect?

Agreed. But, it's also a pressure sensitive device that is help 3mm from the bridge plate. So, I think the mic acts like a sound board transducer as well. And, we all know those are highly sensitive to placement.

[jseth]

I have the Anthem SL pickups in both my Mark Angus 6 and 12 string guitars, and those are the ones I use when I perform... I've said, many times, that I would NOT recommend the Anthem in an acoustic guitar unless it's going to be amplified a LOT, as I've found that the squishy Element covering seems to alter both the tone and volume of the guitar when playing acoustically...

However, like you, I find the system remarkably easy to use on stage (I'm basically a "plug-in and play" sort of guy!)... once you get the thing set to a balance you prefer, there's not a lot to it. For me, dialing in that balance between the UST and the Tru-Mic for MY SPECIFIC PA and amp was very important; I've found that my preferrence changes when I plug in to a different amp or system...

I really though I'd prefer mostly the mic in that balance, and was a bit startled to realize that i actually like a fair amount of the UST in the mix! Sounds smoother, less harsh, more full bass response... go figure.

Enjoy! Glad you found something that works well for you...

play on.............................>

[Petty1818]

Originally Posted by jseth

I have the Anthem SL pickups in both my Mark Angus 6 and 12 string guitars, and those are the ones I use when I perform... I've said, many times, that I would NOT recommend the Anthem in an acoustic guitar unless it's going to be amplified a LOT, as I've found that the squishy Element covering seems to alter both the tone and volume of the guitar when playing acoustically...

However, like you, I find the system remarkably easy to use on stage (I'm basically a "plug-in and play" sort of guy!)... once you get the thing set to a balance you prefer, there's not a lot to it. For me, dialing in that balance between the UST and the Tru-Mic for MY SPECIFIC PA and amp was very important; I've found that my preferrence changes when I plug in to a different amp or system...

I really though I'd prefer mostly the mic in that balance, and was a bit startled to realize that i actually like a fair amount of the UST in the mix! Sounds smoother, less harsh, more full bass response... go figure.

Enjoy! Glad you found something that works well for you...

play on.............................>

Yep, that's my conclusion as well. My Taylor borders on being a bit too hi fi for me so subtle changes to saddle material or various pickups can alter the tone slightly but in a way that makes the guitar less pleasing. I found that with the Anthem, the unplugged tone was changed slightly but just enough to wreck the tone for me. I also didn't really love the Anthem so it was an obvious move to take it out.

In terms of the tru-mic placement, Baggs actually offers three suggestions for their Lyric that I bet could be used for the tru-mic as well. The standard is in front of the bridge pins but you can also try behind the bridge pins as well as along the x brace on the treble side of the saddle. Someone did a recording experiment once and although subtle, the three positions offered different tones. I personally preferred the treble side bracing spot. If I ever get the Anthem again, I will try the tru-mic there. I am still tempted at times to install the Anthem but use the Matrix Infinity vs. the Element.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by Petty1818

In terms of the tru-mic placement, Baggs actually offers three suggestions for their Lyric that I bet could be used for the tru-mic as well. The standard is in front of the bridge pins but you can also try behind the bridge pins as well as along the x brace on the treble side of the saddle.

Placement made a huge difference for me. However the best sounding one overdrived the preamp.

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by Cuki79

Placement made a huge difference for me. However the best sounding one overdrived the preamp.

This is correct. The best sounding position in my case (centerline under the saddle) was over driving the preamp at the factory gain setting. I had to cut the mic gain.

I think the element under saddle behaves differently with difference bridges, saddles, materials and installation. I’d have to say the change is fairly small in the Sable. I tried the Anthem SL in an HD-28 several years ago and was highly frustrated with the acoustic degradation. Not so this time.

[jonfields45]

It has been my experience as a keen observer of the AGF,

that Martingitdave pickup epiphanies have a short half life... :~)

[martingitdave]

Originally Posted by jonfields45

It has been my experience as a keen observer of the AGF,



that Martingitdave pickup epiphanies have a short half life... :~)

Both cruel and technically correct. But cruel. :-)

I will also say, in my defense, I used no hyperbole in my posts. Lol

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by martingitdave

Both cruel and technically correct. But cruel. :-)

I will also say, in my defense, I used no hyperbole in my posts. Lol

Jon tells the truth this is not cruel at all.

I would add:

Martingitdave guitars epiphanies have a short half life...

Cuki

[JackB1]

I want to try repositioning my Anthem SL. Any idea what I can use for adhesive?