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  #46  
Old 01-23-2022, 10:38 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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I'd appreciate anyone out there who has an Ultra Tonic 3.2, or even the older five-element model, installed in a dreadnought model guitar, preferably a Martin, but any brand of dreadnought would be good, to share their DIP-Switch setting. Also, any demos that you'd care to share would be much appreciated. Thanks!
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-23-2022 at 10:50 AM.
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  #47  
Old 01-23-2022, 12:49 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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Anyone elses dip-switch setting is pointless - those switches are meant to respond to the frequency response of YOUR guitar, and will vary from guitar to guitar. And honestly, I have no idea how any of mine are set - once I had each one where it sounded great, I put the board inside my guitar and haven’t had to think about it since -
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  #48  
Old 01-23-2022, 01:16 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Anyone elses dip-switch setting is pointless - those switches are meant to respond to the frequency response of YOUR guitar, and will vary from guitar to guitar. And honestly, I have no idea how any of mine are set - once I had each one where it sounded great, I put the board inside my guitar and haven’t had to think about it since -
Thanks, I realize every guitar is different but thought I'd ask anyway. Do you have any demos of your rig?
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  #49  
Old 01-23-2022, 01:53 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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This is all I have to offer at the moment - I have about a 6 minute video that shows a bunch of the process of the install and initial setting, but this is something I recorded after I was done - gives you a little idea -

https://youtu.be/VjvWSW19tM8
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  #50  
Old 01-23-2022, 02:24 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
This is all I have to offer at the moment - I have about a 6 minute video that shows a bunch of the process of the install and initial setting, but this is something I recorded after I was done - gives you a little idea -

https://youtu.be/VjvWSW19tM8
Thank You Very Much! That was informative and your installation sounds better than mine as it has a good deal of bass content in the signal even when taking into account it's a baritone guitar. I'm going to play around with the DIP switches some more and hopefully I'll get a tone I like, More to come ...
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  #51  
Old 01-23-2022, 02:59 PM
fwphoto fwphoto is offline
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Originally Posted by SpruceTop View Post
I'm going to play around with the DIP switches some more and hopefully I'll get a tone I like, More to come ...
Hey Spruce,

Just did a very quick listen to the new clips &, in general, I think both sound better than before. You're definitely moving in the right direction!

Frank
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  #52  
Old 01-27-2022, 05:07 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Okay, so I adjusted the multi-DIP-switch array to 12, which supposedly has the most drect string signal generated bass, and is the first step in the process of adjusting the 1 to 12 circuit board switches of Ultra Tonic 3.2 for tone and clarity. It seems to have made the overall tone sound better with more bass than the previous switch settings. My next step would be to turn off the Multi-DIP-switch array by turning off switch 12 which removes the Multi-DIP-switch from the tonal outcomes. This doesn't, however, completely remove the effect of the large anti-feedback, reverse-phase disk on the tone of the system. To do that, its leads would have to be unsoldered from the endpin/Multi-DIP-switch circuit board assembly which would kinda sorta make the amplified tone of the Main Single Transducer of the Ultra Tonic 3.2 sound similar to a K&K Pure Mini. More to come ...

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Last edited by SpruceTop; 02-26-2022 at 01:21 PM.
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  #53  
Old 01-28-2022, 01:18 PM
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James May James May is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpruceTop View Post
Okay, so I adjusted the multi-DIP-switch array to 12, which has the most bass, and which is the first step in the process of adjusting the 1 to 12 circuit board switches of Ultra Tonic 3.2 for tone and clarity. It seems to have made the overall tone sound better with more bass than the previous switch settings. My next step would be to turn off the Multi-DIP-switch array by turning off switch 12 which removes the Multi-DIP-switch from the tonal outcomes. This doesn't, however, completely remove the effect of the large anti-feedback, reverse-phase disk on the tone of the system. To do that, its leads would have to be unsoldered from the endpin/Multi-DIP-switch circuit board assembly which would kinda sorta make the amplified tone of the Main Single Transducer of the Ultra Tonic 3.2 sound similar to a K&K Pure Mini. More to come ...
A point of clarification. Having all dip switches off DOES NOT totally remove the feedback sensor. In fact, it is exactly the same as position 7!

Why, you say? It is complicated to explain, but suffices to say the switching circuitry is complex and this arrangement was the simplest way I could do it without having to force people to use an overly complicated switch sequence.
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  #54  
Old 01-28-2022, 02:37 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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A point of clarification. Having all dip switches off DOES NOT totally remove the feedback sensor. In fact, it is exactly the same as position 7!

Why, you say? It is complicated to explain, but suffices to say the switching circuitry is complex and this arrangement was the simplest way I could do it without having to force people to use an overly complicated switch sequence.
Thanks, James, for this information and for responding to my thread. It was my intention to contact you after trying a few things, and I'm appreciative of you reaching out to me!

I'm feeding the Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic 3.2 combo into a Grace Design FELiX 2 set at 1 Mohm input impedance and with all EQ Flat. So, basically, I'm at maximum bass response with the DIP switches 12, correct? The only other settings that may give more bass are at 5 and less on the DIP-switch array, as when originally adjusting the tone of the system, at switch "5" I started hearing feedback begin to creep into the mix, so I went to switch "6" and set the system there before wrapping everything up. Based on my initial switch exploration for tone, I gather that at switch 5 and below is where I'd get more chamber resonance, muddiness, and more feedback in my tone?

Also, although my sensors were applied as close to locationally perfect as recommended, I've found that both E strings are about -4 dB to -6 dB lower than the other strings when trying to maintain an even pick attack when recording open strings and various chords. There's something I like very much about the tone at switch 12 and it can be enhanced with the FELiX 2 preamp. Is it normal to have some attenuation of the two E-strings compared to the other strings when played through the Ultra Tonic 3.2 System? Thanks!
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-29-2022 at 10:38 AM.
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  #55  
Old 01-28-2022, 07:35 PM
tadol tadol is offline
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Have you tried it without the preamp or anything else? Do you have access to a good, clean full range acoustic amp? And to compare, have you measured the output of the guitar strings with just a reference mic? I’m just kinda surprised you’re having to go to this much effort to get your guitar dialed in - i just ran through the settings til I liked it, and haven’t looked back - maybe I was just lucky, or maybe I’m not picky enough, but its worked really well that way a couple times now -
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  #56  
Old 01-29-2022, 10:24 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Have you tried it without the preamp or anything else? Do you have access to a good, clean full range acoustic amp? And to compare, have you measured the output of the guitar strings with just a reference mic? I’m just kinda surprised you’re having to go to this much effort to get your guitar dialed in - i just ran through the settings til I liked it, and haven’t looked back - maybe I was just lucky, or maybe I’m not picky enough, but its worked really well that way a couple times now -
Thanks, for looking in again!

I have the LR Baggs Synapse Personal PA/Amp which has a nice, smooth acoustic tone. If I hear something that sounds unbalanced with the string-to-string signal output of a new pickup/preamp installation, I'll check a pickup installation by running through the open strings one by one with equal picking pressure while looking at a graphic representation of their amplitude on my computer using TrueRTA software. Quite often I'll see the 1st-E-string as having a couple-a-three dB down from the other strings and likely has something to do with its wire thickness compared to the other strings with their wire thickness(es) and construction. This tends to be normal. Also, I often see the graphic representation of some installations as having the 6th-E-string as being a few dB down in relation to the signal output of the other four centrally-located strings. I didn't expect having both E-strings to have this reduced signal output with my installation of the Ultra Tonic 3.2 system.

The only time I really get into examining individual string-to-string output is when my ear tells me there are indistinct separations between notes, chords, and alternating bass and bass runs within a musical passage because I can hear some strings not being as loud as others.

My thoughts on my Ultra Tonic installation: Although the long Main Sensor is perfectly centered along the saddle line, the reduced signal output of the E-strings may be a result of three possibilities:

1) Both ends of the Main Sensor may not have been pressed down firmly enough during its installation. I do, however, remember pressing along the entire Main Sensor to ensure it was down along its entire length. I always press down on the SBT transducers on all my installations regardless of the brand of pickup.

2) Possibly there is a slightly thicker accumulation of adhesive under each end of the Main Sensor compared to the central area due to positioning it by a slight sliding motion to get it centered properly?

3) The Martin D-18 string spacing at the bridge is 2 5/32'' inches. Although my installation looks almost exactly like that in the Ultra Tonic Installation PDF as far as being centrally located in relation to the bridge pins, perhaps, although probably unlikely, the Main Sensor isn't long enough to completely capture the direct vibrations of the two E-strings coming down through the saddle/bridge/bridgeplate sandwich?
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-29-2022 at 10:40 AM.
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  #57  
Old 01-29-2022, 02:15 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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So, I finally succumbed to the urge to try my LR Baggs Session DI on the output of the Ultra Tonic 3.2 System. Using just the Comp EQ control, I can dial in more equitable string-to-string output levels. This can be achieved with the rotary Comp EQ control knob on only marking 3 or 4 of its 12-line-marked dial. This sounds good and doesn't have any regular compressor artifacts in the tone as LR Baggs has set the Comp EQ frequencies of the Session DI to those that affect acoustic-guitar tone in a negative way, and can be controlled by the device while leaving other frequencies alone. Perhaps I'll leave the Ultra Tonic 3.2 in my Martin D-18 and just use the LR Baggs Session DI with it?
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-29-2022 at 03:31 PM.
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  #58  
Old 01-29-2022, 03:19 PM
Cuki79 Cuki79 is offline
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Perhaps I'll leave the Ultra Tonic 3.2 in my Martin D-18 and just use the LR Baggs Session DI with it?
Personally… I would not be able to live with that… But I can barely live knowing I have to tune my Amulet MVT tone pot halfway to make it sound right… so I am not a good example. 🤪

Good luck Ken.
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  #59  
Old 01-29-2022, 03:36 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Originally Posted by Cuki79 View Post
Personally… I would not be able to live with that… But I can barely live knowing I have to tune my Amulet MVT tone pot halfway to make it sound right… so I am not a good example. ��

Good luck Ken.
I've always felt that having the Amulet Tone Control pot a bit of rotation off its Bass end sounded best. I would just strum a chord and turn the Tone Wheel until I heard everything fall into a nice tonal balance.
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Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic
Guild F-212XL STD
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Huss & Dalton TD-R
Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee D-03R Sunburst/Ultra Tonic
Larrivee D-40M Legacy/Dazzo
Larrivee C-03R Tommy Emmanuel/Trance M-VT Phantom
Emerald X20
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Republic Duolian/Schatten NR-2

Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-30-2022 at 02:47 PM.
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  #60  
Old 01-29-2022, 05:06 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Here is another sound file and this time it's recorded with the Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic 3.2 combination as recorded through an LR Baggs Session DI with a bit of Comp EQ, and into a FELiX 2 preamp with all EQ Flat, and then into a PreSonus 192 Studio interface, and into the computer and recorded/processed with Audacity. Is it much better than a recording of the Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic 3.2 rig without the LR Baggs Session DI in the signal stream? You likely already know my thoughts but what about yours--Are there any bass players out there? The song segment is in standard tuning and is my guitar backing for my vocals to Dan Fogelberg's "Part Of The Plan." Your comments are necessary and welcome!

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RainSong BI-DR1000N2
Martin HD-28 Sunburst/Trance M-VT Phantom
Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic
Guild F-212XL STD
Adamas I 2087GT-8
Huss & Dalton TD-R
Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee D-03R Sunburst/Ultra Tonic
Larrivee D-40M Legacy/Dazzo
Larrivee C-03R Tommy Emmanuel/Trance M-VT Phantom
Emerald X20
Ovation Elite Plus
Republic Duolian/Schatten NR-2

Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-29-2022 at 05:17 PM.
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