recording king top issues

[dshine]

I'm new to the forum. Thought I would throw this out to see if any other rk owners are having the same problem. I've owned a rd10 for a year and a half. When the thing is "working", it's a beast. Lately I've been hearing a percussive "thud" after picking on the high end. I've taken it to two very reputable shops to check it out. Both can't find anything wrong with it inside and out.
Here's the deal. The guitar can't stand any changes in weather. The top will change drastically with the humidity. All the braces are secure on the top and back. I hear the thud most when the top has developed a belly, action raises, and humidity is high. I just took it to my repair guy yesterday after hearing the "thud" for a week. Within the week, the humidity changed and the thud gradually went away.
Could the "thud" be caused by the sound being redirected by the deformed top? Has anyone else out there had a similar issue? How to fix the problem without buying a better guitar?

[Ned Milburn]

"Redirection" of the sound due to a deformed top won't cause a thud.

If the hands-on people can't diagnose it, it is going to prove difficult to diagnose via internet forum.

What do you mean by "thud"? Is it something that will be audible on a recording? When does the thud occur? Did the other guitar guys hear the same thud?

[dshine]

After plucking the strings, there is a percussive thud coming from inside the guitar. Kind of sounds like a drummer hitting a drum. It's subtle, not like a marching band walking through my living room, but it's there.
By the time I took it to my guy, the guitar had spent a week in lower humidity, packed up in it's case, inside the air conditioning. The top dropped back, and the sound went away along with the belly and high action. I know this is a long shot. It's kinda like that sound that your car makes all week until you take it to the mechanic and as soon as you pull into the parking lot it goes away. Mechanic says "I believe that your hearin' somethin' or else you wouldn't be here, but it ain't doin' it now."
I have also read several post and reviews about these guitars having bracing issues. The guitar was bought to be a decent sounding guitar to take to bluegrass festivals and the like. If I can't take it out of the house, it's kind of a downer.
Any info or suggestions are welcome.

[arie]

Originally Posted by dshine

I'm new to the forum. Thought I would throw this out to see if any other rk owners are having the same problem. I've owned a rd10 for a year and a half. When the thing is "working", it's a beast. Lately I've been hearing a percussive "thud" after picking on the high end. I've taken it to two very reputable shops to check it out. Both can't find anything wrong with it inside and out.
Here's the deal. The guitar can't stand any changes in weather. The top will change drastically with the humidity. All the braces are secure on the top and back. I hear the thud most when the top has developed a belly, action raises, and humidity is high. I just took it to my repair guy yesterday after hearing the "thud" for a week. Within the week, the humidity changed and the thud gradually went away.
Could the "thud" be caused by the sound being redirected by the deformed top? Has anyone else out there had a similar issue? How to fix the problem without buying a better guitar?

imo, barring mechanical issues? it sounds humidity related. while "thud" might not be the best description. for me when i encounter a damp guitar the sound could be described as soggy.

guitars when over humidified sound damp, weak, and lack energy. the wood swells with moisture dampening energy transfer through the wood of the instrument. frets ends appear to "pull in" from the edges of the fretboard and the top bulges more then usual.

when dry on the other hand, the sound is bright, strident, louder. fret ends poke out from the fingerboard. string energy moves quickly through the wood, and dissipates through it quickly as well

regardless of whatever words are used, i'd check the humidity range where your are storing the guitar. do you own a hygrometer? and what values are you seeing? did your reputable repairmen ask you about how you are maintaining the humidity? -they should have.

use a hygrometer, stabilize the humidity in the home with a dryer, and aim for 40% to 50% rh. give it a few weeks and let us know.

[arie]

Originally Posted by dshine

After plucking the strings, there is a percussive thud coming from inside the guitar. Kind of sounds like a drummer hitting a drum. It's subtle, not like a marching band walking through my living room, but it's there.
By the time I took it to my guy, the guitar had spent a week in lower humidity, packed up in it's case, inside the air conditioning. The top dropped back, and the sound went away along with the belly and high action. I know this is a long shot. It's kinda like that sound that your car makes all week until you take it to the mechanic and as soon as you pull into the parking lot it goes away. Mechanic says "I believe that your hearin' somethin' or else you wouldn't be here, but it ain't doin' it now."
I have also read several post and reviews about these guitars having bracing issues. The guitar was bought to be a decent sounding guitar to take to bluegrass festivals and the like. If I can't take it out of the house, it's kind of a downer.
Any info or suggestions are welcome.

ok cross post. there might possibly be something swelling inside the guitar and connecting with something producing this sound. could be many things.

i own a rk and have no bracing issues. with yours obviously something is moving when the humidity is up. it would seem to me that controlling this might be helpful. otherwise take it back to the shop when it's sounding it's worst and see if the repairmen can find out what is moving around.

[dshine]

That's my thought at this point too. I don't think that it's the guitar sounding "wet", this is different. I've pinpointed the sound to around the bridge area, but again I can't find anything moving on the inside. I've pushed, pulled, and wiggled everything that I can get my hands on. The bridge is tight to the top and I've changed out the saddle to see if that had an effect. Nothing. I think that I'm just going to have to live with it. The sound doesn't seem to project. I can't hear it when someone else is playing the guitar.
Thanks

[John Arnold]

I would check for loose X-braces in the bridge area. It may be very hard to detect....particularly with the strings loosened.
A 0.003" feeler gauge can be helpful. Try to slide it under the brace, ideally with some string tension on the guitar.

[dshine]

So, after a few weeks of hearing the sound come and go, I seem to have found a solution to the problem. Changed the strings out last week and put a piece of leather shoestring behind the saddle. The thought was that if the bridge plate was loose, the extra pressure would keep the thing from thudding. The other thought was that maybe the saddle wasn't dense enough for the thinly cut top. Whatever the problem was, this for the time being, has fixed it.

[CoolerKing]

Originally Posted by dshine

I'm new to the forum. Thought I would throw this out to see if any other rk owners are having the same problem. I've owned a rd10 for a year and a half. When the thing is "working", it's a beast. Lately I've been hearing a percussive "thud" after picking on the high end. I've taken it to two very reputable shops to check it out. Both can't find anything wrong with it inside and out.
Here's the deal. The guitar can't stand any changes in weather. The top will change drastically with the humidity. All the braces are secure on the top and back. I hear the thud most when the top has developed a belly, action raises, and humidity is high. I just took it to my repair guy yesterday after hearing the "thud" for a week. Within the week, the humidity changed and the thud gradually went away.
Could the "thud" be caused by the sound being redirected by the deformed top? Has anyone else out there had a similar issue? How to fix the problem without buying a better guitar?

I hear a stuffed with socks sound on my hog OM when it's over humidified, which is frequently in Key West.