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  #1  
Old 08-28-2018, 04:34 PM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Default Best way to record video with these bits?

I have the following stuff:
  • ZOOM Q3HD Audio / Video Recorder
  • Shure SM58 Mic
  • Alesis Mixer (think it's a USB Multi-Mix 8)
  • Focusrite iTrack Solo USB Audio Interface
  • Mixcraft DAW
  • Cheap Andriod Cell Phone (for camera)
  • Acoustic guitar with no electronics (no pickup)
I have discovered--as have many before me, judging from googling--that in order to get good audio with the Zoom Q3HD, I have to have it so close to my guitar that all you get to see is a video of the sound hole (which some people might argue is no loss, LOL), so I am trying to work out which is the best way to get a good audio recording with my whole guitar in view, and possibly my face, if I am singing, so that might be a double whammy insult for the eyes AND ears.

What is the best way to record a video with the above equipment?:

1) Audio and Video together:
Audio: Me & Guitar -> Shure SM58 Mic -> Mixer -> Zoom (Line In)
Video: Me & Guitar -> Zoom
2) Audio and Video separate (Need to later synchronize audio and video)
Audio: Guitar -> Zoom (audio only)
Video: Me & Guitar -> Cell phone camera
3) Audio and Video separate (Need to later synchronize audio and video):
Audio: Guitar -> Shure SM58 -> Focusrite -> DAW
Video: Me & Guitar -> Zoom (video only)
I want to get the best audio, of course, so video is not as important--this is just for my own personal use (self assessment), and possibly putting up on Show and Tell or Youtube.
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  #2  
Old 08-28-2018, 09:09 PM
Fran Guidry Fran Guidry is offline
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I think the audio subsystem of the Q3HD is pretty decent. I would run the SM58 through the mixer and feed the output of the mixer into the Q3HD.

I think I have a blog post related to that somewhere - here's a little something in the ballpark: http://www.homebrewedmusic.com/2010/...t-the-zoom-h2/

There's a bit more Q3HD stuff on the site as well. Yeah, here's one using an M-Audio preamp to feed a condenser mic into the Zoom: http://www.homebrewedmusic.com/2010/...the-zoom-q3hd/

Fran
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  #3  
Old 08-28-2018, 10:41 PM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran Guidry View Post
I think the audio subsystem of the Q3HD is pretty decent. I would run the SM58 through the mixer and feed the output of the mixer into the Q3HD.

I think I have a blog post related to that somewhere - here's a little something in the ballpark: http://www.homebrewedmusic.com/2010/...t-the-zoom-h2/

There's a bit more Q3HD stuff on the site as well. Yeah, here's one using an M-Audio preamp to feed a condenser mic into the Zoom: http://www.homebrewedmusic.com/2010/...the-zoom-q3hd/

Fran
Thanks very much, Fran. I had actually been viewing the wealth of information on your site already, which is how I discovered that I was not alone in chopping off my head and arms with the Q3HD.

I tried the SM58 into the mixer, and out through the headphone out into the Q3HD, and after adjusting mic level, mic gain, main mix level, and control room level on the mixer (why so many levels!?), it seems to be sounding pretty good. I actually forgot to turn off the sound machine (white noise--Duh!) and the fan (more white noise!), so there is lots of room for further improvement.

One thing that is very frustrating is the guesswork that goes into framing myself with the Q3HD--I haven't gotten it spot on once yet in several attempts. I wonder if it is worth experimenting with a tilting shaving mirror, placed behind the unit? I guess there would still be a lot of guess work, because I'd have to get out of position in order to move the Q3HD, at which point I would have to guess how much of an adjustment to make, and I would probably have to adjust the mirror also, so two things to worry about instead of one.

Thanks again.
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  #4  
Old 08-29-2018, 06:44 AM
MikeBmusic MikeBmusic is offline
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Your last post shows the advantage of editing with video software - after recording.
Put the camera out where it gets ALL of you and your guitar. Use mic(s) to record the audio into your DAW.
After recording:
Do any editing/EQ/FX on the audio as needed.
In the video software mute the audio that the camera picked up, add the audio from the DAW. Crop/zoom the video, output the whole thing to MP4 (or other format).
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  #5  
Old 08-29-2018, 07:23 AM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBmusic View Post
Your last post shows the advantage of editing with video software - after recording.
Put the camera out where it gets ALL of you and your guitar. Use mic(s) to record the audio into your DAW.
After recording:
Do any editing/EQ/FX on the audio as needed.
In the video software mute the audio that the camera picked up, add the audio from the DAW. Crop/zoom the video, output the whole thing to MP4 (or other format).
Thanks for your help, Mike.

I don't think I can crop or zoom video in Mixcraft. I would rather try to avoid too much video editing, any way. It would be useful to have the knowledge, but I can barely handle the audio side as it is
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  #6  
Old 08-29-2018, 01:50 PM
Fran Guidry Fran Guidry is offline
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My solution for framing with the Q3HD was to find reference points in the background or use a stand-in when framing.

Ref points is pretty obvious - do a wide shot and find stuff in the background that gives you a clue to where your body, guitar, and head will be in the closer shot.

Stand-in - I've used mic boom stands, yardsticks, even rigged a beater guitar to match the position I would be holding.

Since the Q3HD shoots a max of 720p (as I recall) there's not much or any leeway for "zooming" in post without losing quality.

And the "music cameras" I've tried that followed the Q3HD all had extra wide angle lenses that gave a distorted image when I tried framing just guitar to head. So even if they gave me an articulated view screen and good audio quality I was never happy with the video.

So as annoying as it seems, I've wound up nearly always using parallel audio recording and sync in post. This lets me choose my camera without considering its audio subsystem.

Fran
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  #7  
Old 08-29-2018, 02:16 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agfsteve View Post
Thanks very much, Fran. I had actually been viewing the wealth of information on your site already, which is how I discovered that I was not alone in chopping off my head and arms with the Q3HD.

I tried the SM58 into the mixer, and out through the headphone out into the Q3HD, and after adjusting mic level, mic gain, main mix level, and control room level on the mixer (why so many levels!?), it seems to be sounding pretty good. I actually forgot to turn off the sound machine (white noise--Duh!) and the fan (more white noise!), so there is lots of room for further improvement.

One thing that is very frustrating is the guesswork that goes into framing myself with the Q3HD--I haven't gotten it spot on once yet in several attempts. I wonder if it is worth experimenting with a tilting shaving mirror, placed behind the unit? I guess there would still be a lot of guess work, because I'd have to get out of position in order to move the Q3HD, at which point I would have to guess how much of an adjustment to make, and I would probably have to adjust the mirror also, so two things to worry about instead of one.

Thanks again.
It does work for me, but then I'm really cheap!!!



What's being shot:

https://youtu.be/bjlCpOVNH7U

Last edited by Rudy4; 08-29-2018 at 02:28 PM.
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  #8  
Old 08-29-2018, 03:33 PM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran Guidry View Post
My solution for framing with the Q3HD was to find reference points in the background or use a stand-in when framing.

Ref points is pretty obvious - do a wide shot and find stuff in the background that gives you a clue to where your body, guitar, and head will be in the closer shot.

Stand-in - I've used mic boom stands, yardsticks, even rigged a beater guitar to match the position I would be holding.


Since the Q3HD shoots a max of 720p (as I recall) there's not much or any leeway for "zooming" in post without losing quality.

And the "music cameras" I've tried that followed the Q3HD all had extra wide angle lenses that gave a distorted image when I tried framing just guitar to head. So even if they gave me an articulated view screen and good audio quality I was never happy with the video.

So as annoying as it seems, I've wound up nearly always using parallel audio recording and sync in post. This lets me choose my camera without considering its audio subsystem.

Fran
Clever ideas. I think I'll make a life-size cut-out of myself and use that.
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  #9  
Old 08-29-2018, 03:56 PM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
It does work for me, but then I'm really cheap!!!



What's being shot:

https://youtu.be/bjlCpOVNH7U
Exactly! I was testing out a mirror just like that this morning, and also my phone camera, in "fisheye" selfie mode (to see the back of the camera--not to film myself that way). I don't have any stands, tripods, brackets or holders of any kind yet, so I was just holding the mirror / phone, trying to imagine what the view would be like a couple of feet beyond arm's length.

One idea that I am considering is buying an inspection mirror (which is what I discovered they are called). It's a small, swivelling mirror on the end of a telescoping handle. I could use that to peak around the back of the video camera without moving from my playing position.

Similarly, instead of a mirror on a stick, I could get a selfie stick and put my phone on it, in the fisheye selfie mode.

I also have a spare computer monitor around, so I could hook up a cable from the Zoom Q3HD's HDMI out to the monitor, but then the monitor would become part of the whole recording thing--yet another thing to plug into the wall. I started out with the idea of just the Q3HD and me, so nothing plugged in at all, then I added the mixer for the microphone, and portability and spontaneity go out the door.

Nice guitar, video, and playing, by the way!
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  #10  
Old 08-29-2018, 05:09 PM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
It does work for me, but then I'm really cheap!!!



What's being shot:

https://youtu.be/bjlCpOVNH7U
I forgot to ask, is your mirror a magnifying mirror? If so, what is the magnification power?

Thanks!
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  #11  
Old 08-30-2018, 07:01 AM
MikeBmusic MikeBmusic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agfsteve View Post
Thanks for your help, Mike.

I don't think I can crop or zoom video in Mixcraft. I would rather try to avoid too much video editing, any way. It would be useful to have the knowledge, but I can barely handle the audio side as it is
Get some inexpensive video software. In the end it will be a lot less work!
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My music: https://mikebirchmusic.bandcamp.com

2020 Taylor 324ceBE
2017 Taylor 114ce-N
2012 Taylor 310ce
2011 Fender CD140SCE
Ibanez 12 string a/e
73(?) Epiphone 6830E 6 string

72 Fender Telecaster
Epiphone Dot Studio
Epiphone LP Jr
Chinese Strat clone

Kala baritone ukulele
Seagull 'Merlin'
Washburn Mandolin
Luna 'tatoo' a/e ukulele
antique banjolin
Squire J bass
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  #12  
Old 08-30-2018, 08:02 AM
agfsteve agfsteve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeBmusic View Post
Get some inexpensive video software. In the end it will be a lot less work!
It's probably a good idea to have some video editing tools around for cases when that it necessary, but as Fran pointed out, in this case the video quality is not really good enough to begin with to crop it and still have good quality.
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  #13  
Old 08-31-2018, 07:22 AM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agfsteve View Post
I forgot to ask, is your mirror a magnifying mirror? If so, what is the magnification power?

Thanks!
The mirror is double-sided and comes mounted on a metal yoke so you can flip it around and use the magnifying side or the non-magnifying side. The metal yoke is attached to a swiveling base so all the angles of the mirror can be quickly adjusted. It's a Walmart special and I've been using it a few years and don't remember what the magnification power is.

It works nicely to frame what I'm shooting and I usually use it for banjo tune demos to show what both hands are doing.

Other than not being able to shoot larger or in HD the small point-n-shoot digital camera shoots acceptable video. I can't stand the fisheye effect that I see with most "music cameras".
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