AER to PA - What to tell sound guy?

[lschwart]

Originally Posted by greynz

Yeah I thought so at first but I reckon we'd just get even more puzzled looks!

If these guys don't understand something as basic and common as this, there's no way around the awkward moments. Just have the equipment you need and be prepared to explain what you need from them: an XLR line to a mic input. And tell them that the signal you're sending will have reverb.

If you encounter someone who knows what they're doing and they want you to send the signal without reverb, just use the AER's DI out.

Louis

[Jack Orion]

Can't you just say:

"we use this amp for the sound and effects but we just need a DI to plug it in to"

and then plug the line out into the DI? Is the line out an unbalanced signal? It looks as if it's just a normal 'guitar lead' output (mono) so it should just plug into the DI as if it were coming straight from the guitar (albeit probably a bit hotter).

This way it's no different to turning up with an EQ pedal and a reverb pedal, it's just that they are built into the amp...

I gig with my own effects pedals and DI/EQ and I just say I need phantom power for my DI and I've got my own reverb (more often than not I prefer no reverb on the guitar anyway) - I adjust the EQ so that I'm sending the guys a sound I know I'll like if they don't touch it much, but often they'll tweak it for their own room and system which is fine.

[greynz]

Originally Posted by Jack Orion

Can't you just say:

"we use this amp for the sound and effects but we just need a DI to plug it in to"

and then plug the line out into the DI? Is the line out an unbalanced signal? It looks as if it's just a normal 'guitar lead' output (mono) so it should just plug into the DI as if it were coming straight from the guitar (albeit probably a bit hotter).

This way it's no different to turning up with an EQ pedal and a reverb pedal, it's just that they are built into the amp...

Thanks, yeah that's pretty much exactly what I say, but, & I dunno why, it's just always seems like I'm talking nonsense lol! For example not so long ago I asked the exact same thing, & the guy almost insisted he had to use the DI out on amp (XLR). So I just said "pretend I haven't got this and just give me a guitar lead from your DI box" - then he starts saying well why don't we just mic the amp?!
He gave in & kinda said ok we'll give it a go...& of course everything was great etc & sounded amazing.
Actually that seems to usually be the outcome, they'll say "ok we'll try it" so I was just thinking we were asking something strange..

Ok, guess we've just been unlucky with who we deal with but it just seems to happen too often!

[Bobby1note]

Mic the amp, and be done with it.
(hint; Sennheiser e609)

[Kalani]

Just tell them you need 1 DI. The less said the better.

[ericmeyer4]

Can you bring your own DI box and then hand them a XLR cable to plug into the board? Avoid having to ask for one of theirs and trying to explain everything.

[rokdog49]

Originally Posted by Bobby1note

Mic the amp, and be done with it.
(hint; Sennheiser e609)

That's what I would do.

[shawntp]

I am way late to this thread but I am looking at the AER's again (owned a couple in the past) and was fascinated by the Tommy Emmanuel Signature model. It seems the issues that the OP was suffering from years ago might be the same thing Tommy Emmanuel suffers from on the road with professional sound guys (my own conjecture of course).

Anyways - I found it interesting that the AER Compact 60 Tommy Emmanuel has a tweak specifically to the DI out so that it sends what is heard on stage with the effects (also the TE model has a specific effect added in for TE so it makes sense he would want that sent).

Anyways - AER should just have a switch for that DI out to make it wet or dry. I sort of want the slope model but I also would prefer a DI out that sent reverb as thats how I would more likely play sending to PA (and want to monitor).

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by Bobby1note

Mic the amp, and be done with it.
(hint; Sennheiser e609)

This....
It seems to me the sound you want is what's coming out of the Aer speaker...
line out and xlr out don't give you the speaker. of the aer . Which is what
you want.
So much easier to tell the sound tech that you need a mic.
or use a known mic and tell hm you need an xlr cable.
If your son has to turn it up or adjust on the fly the sound tech will
make the FOH adjustments to compensate.

[jr.capo]

I’ve used the di, line out and mic’d the speaker. The mic gets my vote. However you could also purchase a Dual Pocket Tools, Which is basically the front end of a C60- use it as a preamp into the C60 via line out, and send the DI to the board, as it will have reberb.

[lkingston]

As a former soundman, I would much rather get an unprocessed guitar signal with no reverb, but I can understand you wanting to have at least some control of what you hear as you play. Why not just use a directbox and send the XLR to the soundman and the 1/4” jack to your AER for monitoring?

[Brent Hahn]

Originally Posted by lkingston

As a former soundman, I would much rather get an unprocessed guitar signal with no reverb, but I can understand you wanting to have at least some control of what you hear as you play. Why not just use a directbox and send the XLR to the soundman and the 1/4” jack to your AER for monitoring?

As a current soundman (maybe again someday) I tend to take folks like this at face value and at least try to work with what they give me. If it's not working in the house, in my opinion, I'll say so. Sometimes there's some give and take, sometimes not.

[shufflebeat]

Let's be charitable for now and assume the soundguys know what they're talking about.

In a situation where I'm not familiar with the band there are certain precautions I want to observe:

1) I would rather the band use my DI boxes because I know they work and are unlikely to send a large signal spike into my system due to a dodgy phantom power connection (same with XLR leads)

2) I want a "pre master volume" signal. I really don't want the band to soundcheck with a low signal with the intention of "keeping something in the tank for later". This happens lot and means I have to totally recalibrate the gain staging mid-gig when I should be doing something else.

3) Reverb levels that sound appropriate when you're sat 5' from the speaker might be total overkill once you add the ambience of the room. This is also true of reverb type.

4) Depending on venue size and character, an onstage amp set wrong can mean little can be done to salvage the sound for the audience because all they can hear is the amp.

As a musician I want everyone to be comfortable onstage but as a sound-tech I have to prioritise the audience experience over the ego of inexperienced artists.

Sometimes it's quite the balancing act.

To the OP, it sounds like you're quite reasonable, a 2 min conversation early in the process expressing what you're trying to do and discussing the options available would probably avoid most issues, at least with me.

Ideally in a note on the tech rider with a choice of options from "ideally..." to "if we have to...".

[lkingston]

Originally Posted by shufflebeat

Let's be charitable for now and assume the soundguys know what they're talking about.

....


2) I want a "pre master volume" signal. I really don't want the band to soundcheck with a low signal with the intention of "keeping something in the tank for later". This happens lot and means I have to totally recalibrate the gain staging mid-gig when I should be doing something else.

3) Reverb levels that sound appropriate when you're sat 5' from the speaker might be total overkill once you add the ambience of the room. This is also true of reverb type.

On point 2: If the musician has split his signal and is just monitoring with his amp, him changing his level is no big deal, but if he’s also messing with mine...that can really screw me up!

On point 3: I don’t know what it is about musicians who aren’t confident in their ability wanting too much reverb...but it is really common. As you say, the amount of reverb the musician wants on stage is completely and utterly inappropriate for a large room. Plus, the quality of the reverb built into an amp or a stomp box is orders of magnitude poorer in quality than what I would give him! Plus, my reverb is in stereo, and on a separate bus so that I can really boost it on the moments where that is appropriate. All the fine points of space go completely out the window when some guitarist gives me their own baked in reverb. They just aren’t going to sound that good and there is nothing I can do about it!

[j3ffr0]

Originally Posted by ericmeyer4

Can you bring your own DI box and then hand them a XLR cable to plug into the board? Avoid having to ask for one of theirs and trying to explain everything.

^^^ This. The sound guy may not have brought a DI box, and many would probably just rather you go along with the way they usually do things. I'm pretty sure if you just shove an XLR at them, then they will readily work with that.