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Old 10-16-2021, 02:24 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Default Another Dazzo Ordered

Being that my first Dazzo #70 Set with soldered-on Italian Endpin Jack sounded so good in my Larrivee D-40M, I just ordered another Dazzo #70 Set with soldered-on Italian Endpin Jack for my Larrivee D-40R. My reasons for ordering another Dazzo is that it's so easy to install with the 6-Minute Epoxy, whether you want to move the transducers around before epoxy set-up or just install them in a determined location as in Teddy's video, and given each transducer's built-in pry notch for removal for relocation if desired, it's a no-brainer! Also, with its decent signal output, the Dazzo won't lose any frequency-response over the length of a quality 10-foot instrument cord (Mogami Gold) and into a quality outboard preamp (FELiX 2). More to come ...
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  #2  
Old 10-17-2021, 10:49 PM
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Kenny, you were always a Trance Audio guy, like me. I've heard these rigs are very similar. Any thoughts?

I'm thinking of dropping a Dazzo into a very nice Blueridge dread (D-28 clone) I have.

BTW, ease of install is not a factor for me. No matter how easy, I'm just too dang busy to do it myself, so I would be farming it out to someone locally.

Take Care & Thanks
Scott
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Old 10-18-2021, 02:19 PM
jseth jseth is online now
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Scott;

All my info is from my interactions and conversations with Teddy while he was installing the Dazzos in my guitars or when we were yakking on the phone prior to that...

Yep, there is a similarity between the Trance product and the Dazzo. For one thing, both Teddy and the head of Trance both were part of the ownership of the original FRAP company, back in the 70's...

According to Teddy, the Trance units are basically the FRAP units, without significant design changes or advances. Teddy told me that he used a FRAP as the benchmark when he was designing his pickup, figuring that "if I can't do it better than this, I won't do it"...

I think he did quite a bit better than the FRAP. I owned one int he 70's and it was good; better than anything else around, even the lower cost, single transducer one I had (NOT the Model T, which was a joke - again, according to Teddy!).

The Dazzo is high impedance, and I believe the TRance is low impedance. I can plug my Dazzo into a regular acoustic guitar amp without any sort of pre-amp in the line... when I use my Bose L1 Model II, I run the Dazzo through the Bose T-1 mixer, again without any additional preamplification.

The Dazzos can be removed without damaging the transducers - don't know about the Amulets? I seem to recall that they're pretty easily tweaked when removing them for a re-install? Teddy actually designed the Dazzo to be removed easily enough.

To my ear, the Dazzo is about as close to a good "mic" sound as I've heard through a pickup... I wouldn't go by the sound quality of any video reviews, as even Teddy told me that his pickup won't sound good when recorded straight into a deck or interface... makes it hard to tell how good the Dazzo really is, I know.

That's about all I have for you... I can't recommend the Dazzo highly enough! I would recommend that you be present for the install, as adjusting "how it sounds" is a big part of that process, and you may hear something differently than the person installing it. I went to the trouble of setting up my Bose rig, just for the install... a bit of PITA, but, I'm glad I did it, because the little darlings sound wonderful! I would suggest you use whatever your current "go-to" PA/amp is for that install if possible.

Good luck!
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Old 10-18-2021, 04:13 PM
Vancebo Vancebo is offline
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Hello JSeth,

I hope you're doing well and are able to play live again.

Teddy is in Oregon and I expect him at my place in the next couple of days. I don't have any pickup installs for him to do, instead, he just may end up working on my pickup truck.
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Old 10-18-2021, 04:19 PM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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I haven't installed a Dazzo yet, but the Amulet is definitely the easier of the two to remove. It's adhered with tape so it's just a matter of wiggling it a bit. I am sure the Dazzo was created with ease of removal, but it still seems like quite a pain if you want it out.
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Old 10-19-2021, 03:29 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petty1818 View Post
I haven't installed a Dazzo yet, but the Amulet is definitely the easier of the two to remove. It's adhered with tape so it's just a matter of wiggling it a bit. I am sure the Dazzo was created with ease of removal, but it still seems like quite a pain if you want it out.
The hardest part of Dazzo removal I think would be removing the residual epoxy from the bridge plate. The Trance Amulets are a cinch to remove but I still feel that the permanent adhesive is slightly detrimental to excellent vibrational transfer from the bridge plate to the Amulets.
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Old 10-19-2021, 09:13 AM
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Without wanting to be “that guy” - but why is ease of removing the pickup so important? How often do you remove and re-install pickups? I kinda feel that once the pickup goes in, it’s gonna stay there - unless I found something much, much, much better to replace it with. And thats pretty much only when I buy a used guitar that has something non-op or really cr@ppy sounding. I should also admit that I have yet to hear/use anything that sounds/works as well as the UltraTonic -
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Old 10-19-2021, 10:06 AM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Without wanting to be “that guy” - but why is ease of removing the pickup so important? How often do you remove and re-install pickups? I kinda feel that once the pickup goes in, it’s gonna stay there - unless I found something much, much, much better to replace it with. And thats pretty much only when I buy a used guitar that has something non-op or really cr@ppy sounding. I should also admit that I have yet to hear/use anything that sounds/works as well as the UltraTonic -
You must be new here lol.. I kid. However, in all seriousness, a lot of members on here test/experiment with pickups. I have probably installed at least ten in my Taylor. I have definitely been hesitant to try the Dazzo or K&K in my Taylor as I have yet to find a SBT that I love. That track record leads me to believe that a glued in SBT won't sound that much better.
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Old 10-19-2021, 10:23 AM
tadol tadol is offline
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Yeah - I’m not a Taylor guy, so my experience with their systems is limited. But - I was selling my Schertler Jam 400 just a couple days ago, and the guy buying it wanted to make sure it was substantially louder than his Unico, so luckily, I have a warehouse, and he set up his Taylor with its internal pickup system and we cranked it up - or we tried. The Taylor started feeding-back so badly, even standing behind it, that we couldn’t get to half volume without serious squealing. He was sold on the amp, but I pulled out my old SCGC F w/UT, and plugged in. I stood right in front of and facing the amp, and we cranked it up to just shy of ear-bleed level without any feedback, and the tone was great (I think - I’d never tried that volume before, and at some level you lose any “nuance” in the tone, even with that good an amp). He’s emailed me twice, trying to figure out how to remove his Taylor system and put in a UT - ;-)
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Old 10-19-2021, 10:43 AM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Yeah - I’m not a Taylor guy, so my experience with their systems is limited. But - I was selling my Schertler Jam 400 just a couple days ago, and the guy buying it wanted to make sure it was substantially louder than his Unico, so luckily, I have a warehouse, and he set up his Taylor with its internal pickup system and we cranked it up - or we tried. The Taylor started feeding-back so badly, even standing behind it, that we couldn’t get to half volume without serious squealing. He was sold on the amp, but I pulled out my old SCGC F w/UT, and plugged in. I stood right in front of and facing the amp, and we cranked it up to just shy of ear-bleed level without any feedback, and the tone was great (I think - I’d never tried that volume before, and at some level you lose any “nuance” in the tone, even with that good an amp). He’s emailed me twice, trying to figure out how to remove his Taylor system and put in a UT - ;-)
Just to clarify, only one of the ten pickups I have tried have been made by Taylor. I just mean that a lot of us experiment so ease of removal is important.
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Old 10-19-2021, 04:27 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charmed Life Picks View Post
Kenny, you were always a Trance Audio guy, like me. I've heard these rigs are very similar. Any thoughts?

I'm thinking of dropping a Dazzo into a very nice Blueridge dread (D-28 clone) I have.

BTW, ease of install is not a factor for me. No matter how easy, I'm just too dang busy to do it myself, so I would be farming it out to someone locally.

Take Care & Thanks
Scott
Hi Scott,

The Dazzo is as good as the best examples of anything else I've heard (I haven't tried an Ultra Tonic) and is fairly easy to install as you have a few minutes to get the two Dazzos positioned where you want them located. It's a passive system, so to sound its best a good, well-featured outboard preamp with a 1 MegaOhm input impedance or more can offer the most versatility in dialing in the amplified tone you want under a variety of venue conditions. I recently bought a FELiX2 that offers extensive control over my amplified tone. Small battery-powered, onboard preamps are available from Sunn and I think were designed with the Dazzo in mind.

My favorite systems are the Dazzo and the Trance Amulet M-VT.
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Adamas I 2087GT-8
Ovation Custom Legend LX
Guild F-212XL STD
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Taylor 618e
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Larrivee D-40R Blue Grass Special/HiFi
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee C-03R TE/Trance M-VT Phantom
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 10-20-2021 at 03:21 AM.
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Old 10-19-2021, 04:46 PM
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Doug Young Doug Young is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Without wanting to be “that guy” - but why is ease of removing the pickup so important? How often do you remove and re-install pickups? I kinda feel that once the pickup goes in, it’s gonna stay there - unless I found something much, much, much better to replace it with. And thats pretty much only when I buy a used guitar that has something non-op or really cr@ppy sounding. I should also admit that I have yet to hear/use anything that sounds/works as well as the UltraTonic -

With the Trance, the removal is sort of a "because you can" thing. In my installs what's happened is that I install, and it sounds good. Then a few days go by, and I think, "maybe I could get a tad more bass" or "maybe I could soften that treble string a little", then I go in and move it. If it was, say a K&K, I'd just go "oh well, can't change it". But with the Trance you can, easily, so you do it :-). Of course, I've also had all kinds of pickups, including K&Ks, in and out and back in and back out, ad naseum, in many guitars, you just keep hunting for the one that works best.

I wouldn't do that with a Dazzo, but Teddy would and does. I've had different Dazzos in and out of a number of guitars. Moved, changed the numbers, changed to improved models over the years and so on - mostly because Teddy would hear it and say "I can do better than that, let me try again".


BTW, for SpruceTop, for what it's worth, I've had Trances in the same guitar with both the original glue approach and the tape. I heard no difference that I could discern - tho of course I couldn't AB them. Overall, I think the tape is an improvement for Trance, if only because now it's easy to tweak the install until it's dialed in.

Last edited by Doug Young; 10-19-2021 at 04:52 PM.
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Old 10-22-2021, 03:26 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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My new Dazzo arrived on Thursday after being mailed by Teddy on Monday. This is remarkable given our sabotaged USPS! More to come ...
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Martin D-18/UltraTonic
Adamas I 2087GT-8
Ovation Custom Legend LX
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Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-50M/HiFi
Larrivee D-40R Blue Grass Special/HiFi
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee C-03R TE/Trance M-VT Phantom
RainSong BI-DR1000N2
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Old 10-22-2021, 03:32 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug Young View Post
With the Trance, the removal is sort of a "because you can" thing. In my installs what's happened is that I install, and it sounds good. Then a few days go by, and I think, "maybe I could get a tad more bass" or "maybe I could soften that treble string a little", then I go in and move it. If it was, say a K&K, I'd just go "oh well, can't change it". But with the Trance you can, easily, so you do it :-). Of course, I've also had all kinds of pickups, including K&Ks, in and out and back in and back out, ad naseum, in many guitars, you just keep hunting for the one that works best.

I wouldn't do that with a Dazzo, but Teddy would and does. I've had different Dazzos in and out of a number of guitars. Moved, changed the numbers, changed to improved models over the years and so on - mostly because Teddy would hear it and say "I can do better than that, let me try again".


BTW, for SpruceTop, for what it's worth, I've had Trances in the same guitar with both the original glue approach and the tape. I heard no difference that I could discern - tho of course I couldn't AB them. Overall, I think the tape is an improvement for Trance, if only because now it's easy to tweak the install until it's dialed in.
Thanks, Doug. Yes, given the ease of clean removal of the Amulets it's always tempting to think, let me try moving them just a tad this way or that!

I'm tempted to give the 6-Minute Epoxy (used in the Dazzo installation method) a try with my Trance Amulet M-VT Phantom to see what happens. The only problem may be that it'll be harder to remove the Amulets if I decide it doesn't seem to sound as good as it would with a Trance permanent tape installation.
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Martin HD-28 Sunburst/Trance M-VT Phantom
Martin D-18/UltraTonic
Adamas I 2087GT-8
Ovation Custom Legend LX
Guild F-212XL STD
Huss & Dalton TD-R
Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-50M/HiFi
Larrivee D-40R Blue Grass Special/HiFi
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee C-03R TE/Trance M-VT Phantom
RainSong BI-DR1000N2
Emerald X20
Yamaha FGX5
Republic Duolian/Schatten NR-2
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Old 10-22-2021, 12:51 PM
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JSeth & Kenny:

I've been swamped, but wanted to get in here and thank you, and all the other contributors here, for your valuable info. I'm definitely interested in dropping a Dazzo into at least one of our flat tops.

Would it be okay if I PM'd you here to ask some more specific questions?

Thanks, Gents,

Back to the Bench,
Scott
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