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  #1  
Old 01-13-2018, 07:56 AM
martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Default I got the long saddle pickup blues.

I have a nice dreadnought with an unglued long saddle. This is the straight cut through saddle slot with the unglued bone saddle. I would like to know what options there are for installing a Fishman Matrix. It appears that I would need to fill and recut the slot, route a “sub slot”, make a 3 piece bone saddle, or just cry on my workbench.
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  #2  
Old 01-13-2018, 08:10 AM
MaurysMusic MaurysMusic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martingitdave View Post
I have a nice dreadnought with an unglued long saddle. This is the straight cut through saddle slot with the unglued bone saddle. I would like to know what options there are for installing a Fishman Matrix. It appears that I would need to fill and recut the slot, route a “sub slot”, make a 3 piece bone saddle, or just cry on my workbench.
#nomoretears

You can sand the bottom of the saddle and install a UST just like you do on a short saddle. You just need to make sure that the core of the saddle is squeezing down on the UST and the wings are not impeding the downward pressure. Sand the center core of the saddle almost the thickness of the UST, if that makes sense. In this scenario, the wings of the saddle will be floating slightly.

UNMODIFIED saddle:


Sand the area "painted" green below, where the UST will sit:


Saddle pics courtesy of http://www.chrisalsopguitar.co.uk (from a quick Google search).
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  #3  
Old 01-13-2018, 08:22 AM
martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Originally Posted by MaurysMusic View Post
#nomoretears

You can sand the bottom of the saddle and install a UST just like you do on a short saddle. You just need to make sure that the core of the saddle is squeezing down on the UST and the wings are not impeding the downward pressure. Sand the center core of the saddle almost the thickness of the UST, if that makes sense. In this scenario, the wings of the saddle will be floating slightly.

UNMODIFIED saddle:


Sand the area "painted" green below, where the UST will sit:


Saddle pics courtesy of http://www.chrisalsopguitar.co.uk (from a quick Google search).
Thanks! That's precisely what I had envisioned. I saw some examples online of people splitting the saddle into three pieces and gluing the ends in the make a slot. I didn't like that idea.
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Old 01-13-2018, 08:25 AM
JakeStone JakeStone is offline
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That's cool Maury ...

I had the similar dilemma with my J35 ..
Had not considered that "route" or route.

Ended up with Baggs M80.

Last edited by JakeStone; 01-13-2018 at 08:50 AM.
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  #5  
Old 01-13-2018, 08:29 AM
Silly Moustache Silly Moustache is offline
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I used to avoid straight through saddles because of this, but now, if a bug is required I prefer K&K thingies. Sound better too.
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  #6  
Old 01-13-2018, 08:43 AM
martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Originally Posted by Silly Moustache View Post
I used to avoid straight through saddles because of this, but now, if a bug is required I prefer K&K thingies. Sound better too.
Agreed. However, I am looking at a Fishman Aura system for this guitar. I just needed to be able to install the UST without modifying the guitar. I'm not positive it's the right long term solution. I have K&Ks in my traditional bluegrass guitar. All of that said, I don't think the passive K&K sounds as good as the Aura system.
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  #7  
Old 01-13-2018, 09:27 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaurysMusic View Post
#nomoretears

You can sand the bottom of the saddle and install a UST just like you do on a short saddle. You just need to make sure that the core of the saddle is squeezing down on the UST and the wings are not impeding the downward pressure. Sand the center core of the saddle almost the thickness of the UST, if that makes sense. In this scenario, the wings of the saddle will be floating slightly.

UNMODIFIED saddle:


Sand the area "painted" green below, where the UST will sit:


Saddle pics courtesy of http://www.chrisalsopguitar.co.uk (from a quick Google search).
Good advice and even better if access to a Bridgeport mill and dial test indicator can be obtained to maintain squareness of the cutout, and after cutting it to an initial depth, cutting the depth of the cutout to remove another .001" to .002" at a time until the best overall tone and equal string output is obtained. I've used a Bridgeport/Bridgeport-style mill several times over the years to flatten the bottom of drop-in saddles for usage with a UST pickup. I know! I know! Sorry for complicating things .... But Wait! I have a simpler process that is just as accurate but doesn't use a knee-mill machine tool to accomplish the same end result but does use a dial-test indicator to help accomplish the task.
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-13-2018 at 04:00 PM.
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  #8  
Old 01-14-2018, 08:38 AM
BT55 BT55 is offline
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You have a number choices without modifying your guitars bridge or saddle. The K&K system you mentioned offers models from passive to pre-amp control based versions. JBB Artist Series offers two versions of a K&K passive clone system at about a 50% discount. You could also use an LR Baggs Aura microphone system. With these systems the only modification to your guitar is to add a jack and the "pickups".
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  #9  
Old 01-14-2018, 11:13 AM
martingitdave martingitdave is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BT55 View Post
You have a number choices without modifying your guitars bridge or saddle. The K&K system you mentioned offers models from passive to pre-amp control based versions. JBB Artist Series offers two versions of a K&K passive clone system at about a 50% discount. You could also use an LR Baggs Aura microphone system. With these systems the only modification to your guitar is to add a jack and the "pickups".

Thanks for the contribution. I am working with a “custom” Duncan Wavelength Duo Nylon dual source system. I have the K&K going into the preamp and the mic and control module are adhered to the bass side of the sound hole. This produced a nice natural sound. However, it is feedback prone. So, my goal was to install an Aura system in the guitar to improve feedback control while maintaining the natural microphone quality.

In addition to the above, I am going to consider some other options.

Also, for Ken, I WISH I had access to a milling machine. It would make the project a snap!
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