Guitar preamps- why no pedal that allows graphical PEQ control?

[Martin S]

Maybe there is such thing, but if not, I think someone's missing a trick.

I've had eq pedals for my guitar, and like most people I've fiddled with the knobs trying to get a decent sound. Now you can definitely get improvements doing this, but it feels like there is something missing that should be there to help you when you're doing it.

I run the PA for our band, and I've recently gone digital and bought a Behringer XR-18 mixer. This is basically a multi-input/output stagebox with all the usual analogue mixer controls, but also a whole heap of other functions. It is designed to be used with either a computer or tablet interface.

Here's the thing, it is absolutely awesome (YVMV) for tailoring the sound of an instrument. It has a great eq section, which you can even double up by routing to a bus and having an additional eq section on that. And that's as well as another eq section on the main L/R output.

What you do as you are eq-ing, is look at the real-time RTA display, while you monitor the output with headphones (in my case). With the parametric eq controls, you have very fine control of parametric filters, and you can see what's happening to the sound as well as hear it. You can add a gate, and a compressor on the channel strip, again it's all easily done because you see what's happening visually as you do it. And then you can add effects - lots of effects. (Not that I do..)

So my question is, why has no manufacturer stripped this down to have a small eq pedal, which could be set up by the user up using a tablet to his taste. The graphical eq'ing with RTA is such a definite advantage when you're doing this.

m.

[varmonter]

My thoughts would be the technology isn't
to the point yet where this can be done easily
on the fly. If your a sound engineer for a band
and if this is your sole role (not playing) then
you have time to open up all the sub menus
and the like required to run a digital interface.
If your trying to do this and play guitar and sing
and interact with the audience then it's a bit daunting.

[lschwart]

Originally Posted by varmonter

My thoughts would be the technology isn't
to the point yet where this can be done easily
on the fly. If your a sound engineer for a band
and if this is your sole role (not playing) then
you have time to open up all the sub menus
and the like required to run a digital interface.
If your trying to do this and play guitar and sing
and interact with the audience then it's a bit daunting.

This is one reason I've been reluctant to move to digital for my band's PA or for my smaller, solo/duo/trio setups--even though I've been using a digital mixer (Mackie DL1608) to run sound for a variety of other people's acoustic ensembles for several years now. I love using digital when I'm just sound guy. It allows you the kind of control that lets you do very subtle and precise things. But the idea of having to interact with a tablet screen while trying to perform gives me the cold sweats. I like having my analog board next to me with all its easily accessible physical controls laid-out and ready for adjustment when necessary. I'd probably get used to it if I tried it, but for now I have enough to worry about getting a show set up! It's a bridge I'll cross eventually--when my Soundcraft MFXi12 finally someday fails.....

Louis

[ljguitar]

Hi Martin

My concerns with 'digital' controls on a pedal (specifically) which doesn't have the dials and buttons to manually set it up is based on what the long-term support for that device and it's software interface will be if:

1. The company goes out of business (and the software side is no longer developed/supported)
2. There is wifi/bluetooth/other interference in a room and I cannot connect with said device to adjust it.

My gigging partner's band had a Behringer mixer/surface with no controls. It had 16 inputs and they carried a separate WiFi router to connect everything, and that worked splendidly.

That way they did not rely on the built-in connectivity, and or building interference. They ran it all from the stage anyway (no sound tech). And as a company, Behringer has been around for a few decades and shows signs that they will be around long-term.

But too many of the innovative digital devices are being made by small companies which have no track record. And too many big companies try experimental equipment and then abandon it after a few years.

If the apps in my phone are any indication, I lose 8-12 apps a year because developers quit the business and move on.

The difference is I can almost always find another app to work on my phone, but I'm not sure I'd be able to find another piece of software to pair with a unique digital effects pedal after the upgrades to the OS render it obsolete.

[Br1ck]

No one has been able to build a quality parametric EQ with a 9v supply. Note that all the stand alone quality Para EQ boxes run on AC mains current.

Many high end pres have parametric eq. Grace is one.

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by lschwart

This is one reason I've been reluctant to move to digital for my band's PA or for my smaller, solo/duo/trio setups--even though I've been using a digital mixer (Mackie DL1608) to run sound for a variety of other people's acoustic ensembles for several years now. I love using digital when I'm just sound guy. It allows you the kind of control that lets you do very subtle and precise things. But the idea of having to interact with a tablet screen while trying to perform gives me the cold sweats. I like having my analog board next to me with all its easily accessible physical controls laid-out and ready for adjustment when necessary. I'd probably get used to it if I tried it, but for now I have enough to worry about getting a show set up! It's a bridge I'll cross eventually--when my Soundcraft MFXi12 finally someday fails.....

Louis

I run sound in our band and also play guitar mandolin and bass.
My partner recently boughta QSC touchmess 16. Now i am used to it after
a year But the same issues i mentioned above have not gone away.
The menus are hidden and sonically i don't think it's as good as the mackie
we used prior. I don't like it ..but it's not my pa .. just my job to run it.. go figure
If i want a touch more treble on my vocal while i am singing i like to be able
to reach right over and tweak a knob. with one hand and be done.. With a digital board have to wait til the song is over to be able to make this adjustment.,Because one has to
navigate through menus to find the eq section and save it so no one else in the
band overwrites my changes.. The digital boards have a lot going for them
but speed of navigation on the fly is not one of them.

[Marty C]

Mackie has a small four channel called pro Dx4. It is about the size of two Boss pedals and is controlled by an iPhone or android device. Might work for you needs.

https://www.amazon.com/Mackie-ProDX4.../dp/B01B1JHTGG

Per Amazon Listing:
Packed with powerful processing like EQ and compression per channel, graphic EQ on all outputs and great-sounding ReadyFX effects. ProDX mixers are equipped with all the essential tools you need to dial in your best mix ever.

Looks like it has a main out to feed the PA and an AUX out that you could feed a monitor or stage amp.

[buzzardwhiskey]

Originally Posted by varmonter

If i want a touch more treble on my vocal while i am singing i like to be able
to reach right over and tweak a knob. with one hand and be done.. With a digital board have to wait til the song is over to be able to make this adjustment.,Because one has to
navigate through menus to find the eq section and save it so no one else in the
band overwrites my changes.. The digital boards have a lot going for them
but speed of navigation on the fly is not one of them.

I hear you. The form factor of a mixer with no sliders, basically just a box with an antenna, is super appealing. And the tablet controllers can look cool. But in my band situation, with five different levels of technical prowess and somebody's getting feedback and the bass is way too loud and the backup singers can't hear themselves and and and... I just don't see that kind of digital in our future.

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by buzzardwhiskey

I hear you. The form factor of a mixer with no sliders, basically just a box with an antenna, is super appealing. And the tablet controllers can look cool. But in my band situation, with five different levels of technical prowess and somebody's getting feedback and the bass is way too loud and the backup singers can't hear themselves and and and... I just don't see that kind of digital in our future.

yea we all use our ipads . Everybody has the
full monty access to the board via ipad.
I actually hate it because we have some members
that are not well versed in proaudio (clueless).
it just makes for surprises. for instance we had
a bad hiss in the foh just a bit too much gain
and high end . a quick adjustment and it was gone.
i didn't save it. bandmate adjusts his guitar and saves it
but switches the " exclude levels and assignment " so guess
what.. the hiss is back in the middle of the set. it's a bit
frustrating. I want to play not adjust pa all night..

[varmonter]

Originally Posted by Marty C

Mackie has a small four channel called pro Dx4. It is about the size of two Boss pedals and is controlled by an iPhone or android device. Might work for you needs.

https://www.amazon.com/Mackie-ProDX4.../dp/B01B1JHTGG

Per Amazon Listing:
Packed with powerful processing like EQ and compression per channel, graphic EQ on all outputs and great-sounding ReadyFX effects. ProDX mixers are equipped with all the essential tools you need to dial in your best mix ever.

Looks like it has a main out to feed the PA and an AUX out that you could feed a monitor or stage amp.

That's pretty cool . And only 120 bucks..

[mandowilli]

I occasionally do live sound on a digital system and the control that you have is just amazing but I also play in a 5 piece band and run sound for them. With everything else that I have to do which includes playing two instruments and singing, the thought of having to avert my focus to an ipad to make a small adjustment or two is sheer madness.

Perhaps Siri could help?

Siri, please reduce 250hz on monitor mix two by 3db?

[martingitdave]

The TC Helicon Play Acoustic has the digital mixer and parametric eq you’re describing. They call it something else. But, that’s what it is in “advanced” mode.