Recording "Live"

[MrErikJ]

Hey All,

Does anyone here record their EPs or LPs in "live" takes? Not at the pub but in "live' takes with vocals and guitar recorded simultaneously. Anyone do that and have any tips for doing so?

I don't yet have a DAW but I do have a multi-track recorder and wasn't sure if anyone gets decent recordings doing things this way.

[Brent Hahn]

Not as a rule. But my wife heard me out in the living room plunking on some old standards and yelled, "Put those on a CD so I can play them in the car." So I did -- click on "Couch Standards" in my sig. Most of the songs are live in one take, but there are edits in a couple.

[MrErikJ]

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn

Not as a rule. But my wife heard me out in the living room plunking on some old standards and yelled, "Put those on a CD so I can play them in the car." So I did -- click on "Couch Standards" in my sig. Most of the songs are live in one take, but there are edits in a couple.

This sounds really good! You are a far better singer than I.

[fitness1]

I don't have any Lp's or Ep's, but all of my Soundcloud tracks are done "live" with main guitar and vocals done simultaneously and any harmonies or additional guitar parts done later.

As far as tips for how to do it - I'm old school and "keep it simple" - Blue Encore 200 for vocals and sE Electronics SE5 for guitars into a 20 year old Tascam DP01FX.

[keith.rogers]

Most (if not all) of the videos in my profile YT link are single take recordings, but I'd say very few are first takes, though the bunch I did at home with my friend in 2019 ("Keith & Kim" stuff) were just off the cuff when were were working up songs to play at open mics and such. All covers.

If that's what you are talking about, the same rules as recording in general, which is make sure you are in tune, practice until you can play most of it on "auto-pilot" because if you are singing, really poor mic technique can be hard to fix. Also, you need to be able to get your good copy, or enough recorded to make a good recording, in just a few, full takes. Your fingers and voice will not last forever, so trying 10 times to get one song down will be very wearing, and will be audible after a few songs (IMO).

Test several mic positions and how you will sit or stand to get one that sounds best. This can take a while, and you might think it sounds good and do a full take and realize it doesn't really work. There's not many shortcuts for this, but keep trying things until you're satisfied with the recorded sound. Make notes or take a picture so you can recreate the setup if necessary.

Set up the DAW so it loops its recording to create multiple takes so you can just keep re-doing it. Playing to click is highly recommended, because then the takes will be lined up and in the same tempo. So, a take that's perfect except for one clam can easily be salvaged by just comping a good splice from another take, i.e., that maybe had too many other problems.

[FrankHudson]

Early in my Parlando Project around half of my recordings that I'd put out were "live" or "live in the studio" -- the music and vocals all recorded at once, and frankly, they were often under-rehearsed to unrehearsed takes. Not always the best for precision or the fine-points of execution, on the other hand there's often a bit of spark in the "without a net" elements of that. You can present the listener sometimes with the experience that they are discovering the song at the same time as the performers.

For the last year I've had to do everything, one man band style. There's some precision and intention gained, but something lost too. Then starting this winter I've had to rush production even more than usual, and tracked some stuff where it was just (or almost just) acoustic guitar and vocal. Vocals are my biggest hurdle, and they suffered a bit at times I think.

Partly that's because there's another factor: some players and vocalists can produce their best performance in each realm when concentrating on just just one task. Since vocals are the biggest connection with users, tracking a final vocal with the vocalist at the mic alone and the track in headphones is more or less SOP for professional recordings.*

Technically, another significant issue is that you will get leakage between tracks. Even if you are just doing an acoustic guitar and vocal performance. That means you can't fix some small issues in an otherwise good performance as easily, and you can't do a final vocal as the original tracking vocal will be ghosting in the background on the guitar track.

Everyone doing home recording needs to make their own choices in these matters. You are usually your own recording engineer, your own record producer. You only have one person to please or to blame!

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*There are exceptions. Many classic jazz recordings up until our current pandemic were recorded live in the studio with everyone playing in the room, and some folk and acoustic records too. Bob Dylan made all his classic LP records live in the studio often with very unrehearsed bands, and even if you can listen with a cold and cynical ear and hear that unrehearsed nature at times on those albums, the records had a certain kind of energy from that.

[Chipotle]

Yes, see my YouTube channel. You can certainly get decent recordings that way (some of mine are better than others, mostly due to room acoustics), but it is difficult--but not impossible--to fix small mistakes. It's best to nail the takes.

If you're careful will mic selection and placement, you can keep things separate enough to at least balance the guitar/vocal levels. Search and you'll find other threads with advice on how to do this.

I do this for videos, but for pure audio, I always do separate guitar and vocal takes. that allows you to comp together the best bits from multiple takes and do post-processing you can't do with a "live" recording that has a lot of bleed between the mics.

[Brent Hahn]

Originally Posted by Chipotle

... for pure audio, I always do separate guitar and vocal takes. that allows you to comp together the best bits from multiple takes and do post-processing you can't do with a "live" recording that has a lot of bleed between the mics.

Tracking live doesn't prevent you from comping; you just have to end up with a complete set of bits and pieces where the playing and singing are both acceptable at the same time. Not as manly as one take top to bottom, but still builds character. :-)

[islandguitar]

Yes, although I'm instrumental only. About 98% of my tunes are "live" take beginning to end with no comps, or "punch in's". It's kind of a "thing" for me.......liking the immediacy of that moment when it all comes together in one take! LOL!
Usually I do lots of takes in order to get some good contenders, and then I'll listen back to select the one I want to go with. My timeline is about 60-90 minutes of recording before I reach deminishing returns. Heading into recording time, I've practiced a LOT, so there's confidence that I'll get a keeper for my efforts. If not? Try again soon-keep the momentum going! LOL!

[lkingston]

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn

Tracking live doesn't prevent you from comping; you just have to end up with a complete set of bits and pieces where the playing and singing are both acceptable at the same time. Not as manly as one take top to bottom, but still builds character. :-)

Yes, I’ve found that as well. You just have to comp the vocal and guitar together. I’m doing it with video, and you really can’t see or hear the edits. What I do now is to set up the camera and recorder and go through the song about four times, not stopping or slowing down if I make a mistake, or worrying to much about perfection. Then I pick the best take, and edit any bits were my voice was flat or the guitar buzzed a bit. It works surprisingly well.

[Chipotle]

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn

Tracking live doesn't prevent you from comping; you just have to end up with a complete set of bits and pieces where the playing and singing are both acceptable at the same time. Not as manly as one take top to bottom, but still builds character. :-)

True, no question I have fixed flubs even in "live" takes. I guess I should have said separate tracks makes it a lot easier to do comps, being able to fix each part separately.

[MrErikJ]

Originally Posted by islandguitar

Yes, although I'm instrumental only. About 98% of my tunes are "live" take beginning to end with no comps, or "punch in's". It's kind of a "thing" for me.......liking the immediacy of that moment when it all comes together in one take! LOL!
Usually I do lots of takes in order to get some good contenders, and then I'll listen back to select the one I want to go with. My timeline is about 60-90 minutes of recording before I reach deminishing returns. Heading into recording time, I've practiced a LOT, so there's confidence that I'll get a keeper for my efforts. If not? Try again soon-keep the momentum going! LOL!

A lot of what I'll be doing will be instrumental fingerstyle! How do you prefer to keep time? Do you play to a click or a count in or something different? When I was doing more singer-songwritery stuff, recording to a click wasn't much of a challenge but the more complex instrumental work becomes more stressful to get perfect. I've considered just using a count-in so I can set an initial tempo and have some freedom to ritard and crescendo but I do hear that clicks are a must have.

Also, how many mics do you track with?

[islandguitar]

Originally Posted by MrErikJ

A lot of what I'll be doing will be instrumental fingerstyle! How do you prefer to keep time? Do you play to a click or a count in or something different? When I was doing more singer-songwritery stuff, recording to a click wasn't much of a challenge but the more complex instrumental work becomes more stressful to get perfect. I've considered just using a count-in so I can set an initial tempo and have some freedom to ritard and crescendo but I do hear that clicks are a must have.

Also, how many mics do you track with?

Thanks Erik! I use two condenser mics in a spaced pair with my recordings. I have to admit that I don't use a click track or other factor with single guitar other than practice and my ear for creating tempos, but I'm guessing if you use more than one instrument you'll need a click track to make sure you're in sync. I'm sure others might have thoughts on this from their experience. My tunes are also originals and therefore I feel I have some license with those and don't have to reproduce what another artist and so there's freedom there too.
As I went back to review a few of my pieces before responding.....many have an introductory few notes which sets the intro and tempo. The one in my signature "Ramblin'" does that as an example. Soundcloud slightly clips the intro, but you can catch what I'm referring to.
Many thanks and good luck with your instrumental efforts!

[RRuskin]

I record the audio for my video that way but prefer to do guitar and vocal separately for audio only work.

[Captain Jim]

Originally Posted by Brent Hahn

Not as a rule. But my wife heard me out in the living room plunking on some old standards and yelled, "Put those on a CD so I can play them in the car." So I did -- click on "Couch Standards" in my sig. Most of the songs are live in one take, but there are edits in a couple.

Very nice feel to those!