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  #1  
Old 07-16-2022, 07:22 PM
gwandsh gwandsh is offline
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Default Emerald neck oprions?

Forgive me if this is searchable, but I am from the land of crap internet, and such things require a day's investment. Tried to chat with Emerald on their site, but on an Android tablet and bad wifi, the site is unusable.
Anyways, recently acquired a lovely x20. I like many things about it, but after 15 years playing short scale Taylor necks, I am having a tough time bonding with the Emerald neck. I have a Martin dread and manage that neck Ok. Something about the flatness of the Emerald neck that makes it tough for me to play, aside from the longer scale I am not used to.
Anyways, have been trying to determine if they have other neck options, something closer to a Taylor feel. Doesn't need to be an x20, perhaps an x10 would work, as I like smaller bodied guitars.
Are my only options a custom order? I don't feel competent to document my technical needs. How do I articulate a thinnish, ~24.5ish neck, with a smaller radius, like a Taylor GC model? Have seen dribbs of another short-scale thread where the bridge placement was a show-stopper. Certainly no budget here for experiments - or else I'd have better wifi!
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Old 07-16-2022, 08:08 PM
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I'm not sure if you can get to the online 3D builder if you have a poor internet connection. But this is the list of possible fretboard radii they list for the X-20, with 16" being the default.

neck.jpg

Looks like you could go to 14" or 12". I believe my Taylor 522 has a radius of 15" for comparison.

The options are the same for the X-7. The default scale length is 24" on the X-7. To get to 24.5" scale, they push the bridge back toward the tail another 1/2", which is perhaps not ideal since the bridge is already pretty far back.

Is it the radius you're mainly concerned with, or the chunkiness of the neck? I'm not sure how much flexibility there is in the neck profile.
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Old 07-17-2022, 10:14 AM
gwandsh gwandsh is offline
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Thanks, Kevin. Just the kind of info I hoped to find. The 16" default radius on the x20 is a surprise, as I feel a significant difference in barring chords, especially down low. The radius on my Taylor GC seems to be 15" - pretty close.
Perhaps the profile is really my challenge. This calls for a few more direct play/compare sessions.
Per the Emerald custom builder app, sadly it is very tough to work with from here. Great idea, but bandwidth intensive I suspect.
Best
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Old 07-17-2022, 12:02 PM
seannx seannx is offline
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I first got a standard X20 to see if I would like the sound, body shape, and 25 1/2” neck. The first two were fine. The neck profile was okay, but I didn’t like stretching to accommodate the 25 1/2” scale length.

So I ordered a custom one with a 24.875” neck, and sold the stock one quickly here in the classifieds. Compared to my RainSong, the profile is similar, and just slightly more deep and full than my Taylor. In order of playing comfort (for me) the RainSong and Taylor are similar, with maybe a slight edge for the Taylor, and the X20 is third. I switch back and forth between them with no problem. Both the RainSong and Taylor are 12 frets, and I like to play them more.

The cutaway and extra frets on the Emerald make it very versatile, plus it has the Anthem pickup, so it’s an ideal instrument for performing. But as I rarely play that far up the neck, I may pass the Emerald on to my youngest son who’s a lot better guitarist then me, or even sell it.

Ideal would be if the OP could find someone close enough with an X20 to try one. Besides the neck profile, CF guitars have a different quality to their sound (which I like) compared to wood ones, and the up charges for custom scale lengths and neck profiles on Emeralds add significantly to the cost.

Also useful would be measurements of the neck depth and width, and not just the radius, compared to Taylor’s.
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Last edited by seannx; 07-17-2022 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 07-17-2022, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seannx View Post
...Ideal would be if the OP could find someone close enough with an X20 to try one...
Yes. There is a thread in this forum that lists the location of people with CF guitars that are willing to let others try them out:
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=646425


Quote:
Originally Posted by seannx View Post
...Also useful would be measurements of the neck depth and width, and not just the radius, compared to Taylor’s.
I've made neck profile measurements on my guitars. Here is a comparison of the X-20, a Taylor 522, and a Breedlove at the first fret:

f1.jpg

and at the 5th fret (though I don't have that for the Taylor):

f5.jpg

You can see that the Emerald neck is a little wider than the others, even though they all have 1-3/4" nuts. For some reason Emerald leaves a little extra width between the E strings and the edge of the neck. That was also discussed in this thread (see post #17):

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...=639330&page=2

It's hard to judge a neck from a profile, so it would be best, as noted by seannx, to see if you can find one locally. If you're in the Seattle area you're welcome to try mine.
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Old 07-26-2022, 05:25 PM
AZKATY AZKATY is offline
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Ok .. so I don't know if I just had the right timing or what . I just ordered an x 20 with a 12 fret neck . It is 1 11/16 nut width s
And 16" radius . I have not seen this done before . Since I have a 12 string with a 12 fret neck .. I can say the tone is amazing in its depth .. Very playable .. very low action.. it's just perfect This x 20 will be just right . Emerald also allowed me to get my favorite strings put on Thomastik- Infeld Spectrum . I will be trying the light 10-50 strings . I'm looking forward to a very fast neck -. Very comfortable .. for my playing style .
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Old 07-26-2022, 05:28 PM
AZKATY AZKATY is offline
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Ok .. so I don't know if I just had the right timing or what . I just ordered an x 20 with a 12 fret neck .This was a special request .. and not an option you could pick . It is 1 11/16 nut width
And 16" radius . I have not seen this done before . Since I have a 12 string with a 12 fret neck .. I can say the tone is amazing in its depth .. Very playable .. very low action.. it's just perfect This x 20 will be just right . Emerald also allowed me to get my favorite strings put on Thomastik- Infeld Spectrum . I will be trying the light 10-50 strings . I'm looking forward to a very fast neck -. Very comfortable .. for my playing style .
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Old 07-26-2022, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZKATY View Post
Ok .. so I don't know if I just had the right timing or what . I just ordered an x 20 with a 12 fret neck .This was a special request .. and not an option you could pick . It is 1 11/16 nut width
And 16" radius . I have not seen this done before . Since I have a 12 string with a 12 fret neck .. I can say the tone is amazing in its depth .. Very playable .. very low action.. it's just perfect This x 20 will be just right . Emerald also allowed me to get my favorite strings put on Thomastik- Infeld Spectrum . I will be trying the light 10-50 strings . I'm looking forward to a very fast neck -. Very comfortable .. for my playing style .
Interesting. I’m curious as to how you swung that - the 12-fret neck, I mean. When I was poking around in the builder just now, I noticed that the 12th fret indicator for an X20 with the stock 25.5” scale length is *way* off - it indicates that it’s at the bass side body join, but it’s not - it’s at the 14th.

What scale length did you specify?

EDIT: re-reading this, it sounds antagonistic. That’s not my intent at all. I’ve noticed one or two guitars in recent shipping videos which have options that aren’t available through the Builder (like, for example, K&K only as a pickup choice), and I was really more wondering about how ‘outside the box’ they can actually be. I do know, through personal inquiry for example, that they can do a vibrant weave top, with a regular weave on the back and sides
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Last edited by David Eastwood; 07-26-2022 at 05:47 PM.
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Old 07-28-2022, 12:53 PM
AZKATY AZKATY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Eastwood View Post
Interesting. I’m curious as to how you swung that - the 12-fret neck, I mean. When I was poking around in the builder just now, I noticed that the 12th fret indicator for an X20 with the stock 25.5” scale length is *way* off - it indicates that it’s at the bass side body join, but it’s not - it’s at the 14th.

What scale length did you specify?

EDIT: re-reading this, it sounds antagonistic. That’s not my intent at all. I’ve noticed one or two guitars in recent shipping videos which have options that aren’t available through the Builder (like, for example, K&K only as a pickup choice), and I was really more wondering about how ‘outside the box’ they can actually be. I do know, through personal inquiry for example, that they can do a vibrant weave top, with a regular weave on the back and sides

I just asked ! KC in sales said it would not hurt to ask Alistair .. I love 12 frets .. the tone .. the ease of playing .. depth .. I asked .. and they said yes . The same for the special strings ( I'm a string snob).. Yes the bridge will be back down closer to the bottom .. which is fine with me , as my 12 string is .
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Old 07-28-2022, 02:09 PM
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Originally Posted by AZKATY View Post
I just asked ! KC in sales said it would not hurt to ask Alistair .. I love 12 frets .. the tone .. the ease of playing .. depth .. I asked .. and they said yes . The same for the special strings ( I'm a string snob).. Yes the bridge will be back down closer to the bottom .. which is fine with me , as my 12 string is .
If you don't ask, you'll never know

It seems to me that anything that does not involve *extending* the neck so that the nut moves further away from the body is probably feasible.

And, as far as moving the bridge closer to the bottom - I suspect that that has much more effect on ergonomics than tone.
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Old 07-28-2022, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Eastwood View Post
...It seems to me that anything that does not involve *extending* the neck so that the nut moves further away from the body is probably feasible....
I don't know how much to trust the scale length diagram in the online builder, but it looks like they do extend the neck for the 26" and 27" scales, with the bridge being pushed rearward a bit on the 27".

If I'm understanding AZKATY correctly, they must have increased the scale length and pushed the bridge back to get a 12-fret, possibly leaving the nut at the same location relative to the body?
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Old 07-28-2022, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinH View Post
I don't know how much to trust the scale length diagram in the online builder, but it looks like they do extend the neck for the 26" and 27" scales, with the bridge being pushed rearward a bit on the 27".

If I'm understanding AZKATY correctly, they must have increased the scale length and pushed the bridge back to get a 12-fret, possibly leaving the nut at the same location relative to the body?
You may very well be right. The imprecision of the diagrams in the Builder leaves much to the imagination
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Old 07-28-2022, 04:56 PM
AZKATY AZKATY is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Eastwood View Post
Interesting. I’m curious as to how you swung that - the 12-fret neck, I mean. When I was poking around in the builder just now, I noticed that the 12th fret indicator for an X20 with the stock 25.5” scale length is *way* off - it indicates that it’s at the bass side body join, but it’s not - it’s at the 14th.

What scale length did you specify?

EDIT: re-reading this, it sounds antagonistic. That’s not my intent at all. I’ve noticed one or two guitars in recent shipping videos which have options that aren’t available through the Builder (like, for example, K&K only as a pickup choice), and I was really more wondering about how ‘outside the box’ they can actually be. I do know, through personal inquiry for example, that they can do a vibrant weave top, with a regular weave on the back and sides
The scale length is a little tricky since they are making this a 12 fret .. which moves the bridge closer to the bottom of the guitar .. I believe it's still the normal 25.5.. .. however , the neck is shorter . If this makes sense ..
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Old 07-28-2022, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZKATY View Post
The scale length is a little tricky since they are making this a 12 fret .. which moves the bridge closer to the bottom of the guitar .. I believe it's still the normal 25.5.. .. however , the neck is shorter . If this makes sense ..
Makes perfect sense to me. If it’s a 25.5”scale, and they’ve moved the neck joint to the 12th fret, the bridge would move back accordingly. The neck is ‘shorter’ in that less of it sticks out from the body, but the scale length stays the same.

The distance between the 12th and 14th frets on my stock X20 is 1.375” (or 1 3/8”), so that’s the amount the bridge will move.

I actually rather like the sound of that (as he plots #4 here )
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