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Old 06-09-2019, 02:11 PM
Tcoudi Tcoudi is offline
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Default arpeggiate symbol lesson?

Hello, sorry, this might be little bit clumsy vocabulary - wise from my side.
I would like to learn how the " simple" down up arppegio , its noted as vertical wavy line. i can do it sort of with my thumb or with a pick, but that move P i m r in correct speed i cannot pull literally for years. is there some video lesson or article that explains how to practice this? as i mentioned, i kinda fail to find right word in english for this technique. thanks.
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Old 06-10-2019, 04:10 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
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Sorry, but I think the answer has to be steady practice. I'm guessing you can get the p-i-m-a fingers to run in the right order, but not fast enough? So you just have to start slow - with each finger evenly timed and equally loud - and build up.
It's actually good practice in any case, for all timing and dynamic balance between thumb and fingers.

Here's a good balance exercise, using a simple 4-string arpeggio in p-i-m-a order (from the time-stamp):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQ2VJII_uIM&t=180
The purpose there is making each finger in turn the loudest, so the tempo is kept steady. What you need is slightly different: to give each finger the same volume, but get steadily faster.
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Old 06-10-2019, 08:44 AM
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Shows up and then down arrow. In the example four notes are played upward within the time value of the eighth note chord, then four notes are played downward within the time value of the next eighth note chord. Speed wise can vary but usually it is quite quick as the four notes are left to ring out to fill up the time value of the indicated chord.


Mainly you don't have time for your hand to bounce up and down when playing the notes. So for practice on having a steady hand on the up arrow notes first place your four fingers (p-i-m-a) down on the strings, then peal them off upward. That's your ideal hand movement on the downward arrow notes (albeit it's more difficult to do).
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Old 06-10-2019, 11:53 AM
Tcoudi Tcoudi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonPR View Post
Sorry, but I think the answer has to be steady practice. I'm guessing you can get the p-i-m-a fingers to run in the right order, but not fast enough? So you just have to start slow - with each finger evenly timed and equally loud - and build up.
It's actually good practice in any case, for all timing and dynamic balance between thumb and fingers.

Here's a good balance exercise, using a simple 4-string arpeggio in p-i-m-a order (from the time-stamp):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQ2VJII_uIM&t=180
The purpose there is making each finger in turn the loudest, so the tempo is kept steady. What you need is slightly different: to give each finger the same volume, but get steadily faster.
thanks i will deffinitely try out this one. i believe i can do quite a few patterns and some resonably fast and dynamicaly balance, but i just cannot replicate that "harph" sound, i think my brick is between thumb and index, since they go opossite direction. in fact i am closer to do it from ring to thumb that the normal way. i hope there will be the heureka moment after long practice.
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Old 06-10-2019, 11:57 AM
Tcoudi Tcoudi is offline
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Originally Posted by rick-slo View Post



Shows up and then down arrow. In the example four notes are played upward within the time value of the eighth note chord, then four notes are played downward within the time value of the next eighth note chord. Speed wise can vary but usually it is quite quick as the four notes are left to ring out to fill up the time value of the indicated chord.


Mainly you don't have time for your hand to bounce up and down when playing the notes. So for practice on having a steady hand on the up arrow notes first place your four fingers (p-i-m-a) down on the strings, then peal them off upward. That's your ideal hand movement on the downward arrow notes (albeit it's more difficult to do).
thanks for the reply, i had sort of success with "faking" by keeping the fingers firm a make the pluck by rotating the wrist, but i am pretty sure this not right technique, since it puts you off and its difficult to follow up with anything.
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Old 06-10-2019, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoudi View Post
thanks for the reply, i had sort of success with "faking" by keeping the fingers firm a make the pluck by rotating the wrist, but i am pretty sure this not right technique, since it puts you off and its difficult to follow up with anything.
Yep, you don't want to rotate the wrist.
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Old 06-11-2019, 05:06 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoudi View Post
thanks i will deffinitely try out this one. i believe i can do quite a few patterns and some resonably fast and dynamicaly balance, but i just cannot replicate that "harph" sound, i think my brick is between thumb and index, since they go opossite direction. in fact i am closer to do it from ring to thumb that the normal way.
Understood. The tremelo technique (playing one note rapidly with p-i-m-a) does actually work in the other direction: p-a-m-i. At least that how I find it easiest, as well as how it's usually recommended. It's like drumming your fingers on a desk, it's much more natural with pinky first and index last than the other way.
But with an arpeggio, the idea (obviously) is that each string has its own finger, so the fingers have to go in that order - and normally it's p-i-m-a, bass to treble. The arpeggio sign with no arrow means that direction.
If the arpeggio symbol has an arrow indicating the reverse, that normally (AFAIK) means using only the thumb, drawing it upwards across the strings in question.
Sometimes thumb alone is also indicated for the normal downward direction.
Then again, there s the Spanish rasgueadowhere all the fingers go down all the strings (a-m-i order) while the thumb goes up!
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Old 06-11-2019, 07:28 AM
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Here is a guy doing what I suggested on an up (wavy line symbol) arpeggiate chord.

For practice if you combine a up and down chord arpeggio (p-i-m-a-m-i-p) it will likely
help you learn how to play an isolated down arpeggiated chord rapidly.


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Old 06-11-2019, 11:24 AM
Tcoudi Tcoudi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rick-slo View Post
Here is a guy doing what I suggested on an up (wavy line symbol) arpeggiate chord.

For practice if you combine a up and down chord arpeggio (p-i-m-a-m-i-p) it will likely
help you learn how to play an isolated down arpeggiated chord rapidly.


amazing, thanks so much, i could think of word roll ...
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Old 06-13-2019, 04:07 PM
merlin666 merlin666 is offline
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I always interpreted this as a simple strum ...
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Old 06-13-2019, 06:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merlin666 View Post
I always interpreted this as a simple strum ...
Sometimes that would be true, other times not.

Example below for a time not:
3
0
0
x
x
3

or you might want a different sound than you would get from a strum, or a strum throws your hand out of position for the next notes

You will find the same music symbol use in piano scores, etc..
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