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Purchasing Guitar for a Beginner who Likes to Sing
Hello Everyone - I am new here and not a very experienced guitarist, so I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question or not expressed clearly.
I love to sing, and have picked up the guitar on and off through my life to accompany myself. However, I never really persisted much beyond beginner level - at best, I could play 10-12 chords and a few simple strums with marginal competence. Someone had given me an old battered Yamaha nylon string guitar, so that is pretty much all I ever played on. During a lot of my life I have had friends who were good guitarists, so when this was the case, I would often just sing along with them and not bother trying to play. In the last 10 years, I have barely played at all. However, I am now living in a new place and have a different friend group, with several people who like to sing, but no guitar players! So, I want to pick up the guitar again and develop enough competence that I can lead the singing. I also enjoy just playing and singing by myself. I sing mostly folk/light rock (and Broadway and choral music, but not with a guitar), and have a fairly high and clear, but not powerful, voice - think Judy Collins, Joni Mitchell, Patsy Cline, etc. (Not claiming to be anywhere in the same universe with them in terms of talent - just talking about style/voice quality.) I no longer have the nylon string Yamaha, so I need to buy a guitar, and have decided I'm going to take at least a few lessons (which I've never done before) to get me on that right track. The question is: What type of guitar to get? I've given this a lot of thought, done a lot of reading, and tried out MANY guitars. Here is what I've come to so far: 1) I am petite with small hands, and feel most comfortable with a 3/4 sized guitar, at least to start with; 2) I want something that will be as easy to play as possible, as I am worried about keeping up my motivation/not getting too discouraged; and 3) I know myself well enough to know that I need the gratiification of being able to do at least some singing early on - ie., not sure I would persevere doing ONLY guitar for a long period of time while I improved my skills. As mentioned, my experience to date has been accompanying myself with a nylon string Yamaha. I actually liked the way that guitar sounded with my voice - the warmth/softness was a good contrast/backdrop for my more trebly vocals. I also felt the nylon strings seemed a bit more forgiving of my guitar playing imperfections. So one option is to get another classical - this time it would be 3/4 to get the smaller body and a least somewhat narrower nut width, which would help with my small hands. But from my reading, it seems that many people recommend a steel string for the type of music I like to sing, so I don't want to rule that out. When I played various steel strings in the stores, though, I have been worried that they did not go as well with my voice, and also that my guitar mistakes seemed more prominent. I don't know if this makes sense, but in a way I felt like the steel string sound was so distinctive that the emphasis was more on the guitar, rather than it being a softer backdrop for the vocals. The steel string that I thought worked best was the Baby Taylor in mahogany - it seemed to be a little closer to classical in feel (I got a very different feel from the spruce version). I've read in this forum about warming up the tone further by putting silk and steel strings on it, so I would consider that if I go that route. My question: First, I'm wondering if my perception of the difference between the way these various guitars worked with my voice makes sense to people. And, second, I'd love to hear any thoughts and suggestions. It can be about what guitar to buy or, more generally, on the topic of fitting guitars to your voice and, esp, how steel vs nylon plays into this. Look foward to any help you can provide! And btw, I have no ambitions for performing, other than maybe in front of friends. Jamming with friends and entertaining myself is my goal. :-) |
#2
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Don't be afraid to experiment with steel strings. Believe it or not it can actually bring out your voice just to keep up with it! If you enjoy fingerstyle or want to experiment with it can make for a softer tone. For your hands think about the neck. You want it comfy. Good luck! Keep your eyes open. And your ears, too.
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#3
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Baby Taylor Mahogany is ok but I think a GS Mini Mahogany would be better. Mahogany is the favorite top wood here in AGF for the GS Mini.
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Martin 00-15M (2019) Yamaha FS5 Red Label (2019) Faith Venus Blood Moon Burst (2018) Taylor GS Mini Koa (2017) Martin LX1 (2009) |
#4
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Quote:
She settled on a koa Taylor GS Mini-e acoustic-electric: a bit pricier than the mahogany version but sounds way bigger than its dimensions would indicate, and our bass player and I couldn't keep our hands off of it during rehearsal breaks... Incidentally, she also had no ambitions of performing when we met as fellow members of the local senior center's uke group - my advice is never say never, and plan ahead for that "just in case" day... Welcome to the Forum...
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"Mistaking silence for weakness and contempt for fear is the final, fatal error of a fool" - Sicilian proverb (paraphrased) |
#5
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I think it sounds like a Baby Taylor or GS Mini would be perfect for your needs. Here on AGF the GS Mini gets the most love of these two, but if you played and liked the Baby Taylor I don’t see any reason not to go with that!
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I’ll pile on for the Baby Taylor. There’s a woman who comes to the picking party my teacher leads. She has a voice exactly as you describe and she accompanies herself on a Baby Taylor. She sounds wonderful that way.
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Guitars: Waterloo WL-K Iris AB 1990 Guild GF30 Bld Maple Archback Alvarez AP66 Baby Taylor G&L ASAT Tribute T-style |
#7
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For a smaller guitar, it’s hard to beat the sound of the GS mini. It consistently rates as one of the best travel/small guitars. That being said, it’s also not the cheapest.
One note… I see a lot of people lean toward the mini for travel/beginners/kids, etc. Remember that it comes from the factory with medium gauge (13s) strings. So, yeah it is a fun little guitar. Personally, I love mine. However, those medium gauge strings can be a lot for beginner to get used to. |
#8
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Purchasing Guitar for a Beginner who Likes to Sing
Hi Allie,
I can relate to your situation as years ago I was a basic guitar player and too shy to sing. When I rekindled my passion for both, I went guitar shopping. Here are some thoughts from my experience. See if you can find a number of guitars to play that offer what you are looking for to compare. Finding ones that you like the sound and the feel of will be a fun adventure. If you like a warm tone, make sure that you compare an all mahogany choice with a spruce/rosewood and spruce or cedar/mahogany if you can. They can give you an idea of the range of warmth to brightness that you prefer. I have an all mahogany Alvarez parlor. It is a twelve fret and I prefer it to the Taylor mini because I found it to be warmer and a bit more responsive. I play with my bare flesh and a bit of nail. The all mahogany Baby Taylor would be one to check out as has been mentioned. Taylor, Cordoba and Yamaha make crossover nylon guitars which have the narrower nut but I’m not sure if any are 3/4 size but more in line with the classical shape and size. 00 size guitars are also worth checking out to see how they feel and try both 12 frets and 14 frets to compare how each feels and sounds. If you go steel string, know that there are string options that offer a more comfortable feel such as round core strings, silk and steel, or going to a lighter gauge so once you find the guitar that you like, you can experiment with string options. As far as guitar relative to voice, it is a pretty subjective and personal thing. I have found that (generally speaking) I like a mahogany guitar with my voice if I am singing (I’m an alto) and using my natural vibrato. Many rosewood guitars have more overtones so can compete a bit with my vocals. But, some rosewood guitars have pronounced scooped mids where the vocal can sit quite nicely. Your own hands and ears will be helpful as you listen to each as you are playing them and singing with them. Take a friend with you who sings and also get their input. One thing that helped me when I was comparing guitars is to play/ sing the same simple song from guitar to guitar. For example, I play a lot in the key of G so I would sing/play a verse and chorus of Gillian Welch’s Annabelle and listened to how it sounded. Above all, enjoy the process and trust your ears and hands! Please let us know what you are discovering as you try out instruments. Do you have access to a music or guitar store in your area? Best, Jayne Last edited by jaymarsch; 03-04-2022 at 06:54 AM. |
#9
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You're gonna have fun! Nylon strings will be quieter. Smaller guitars will be quieter. You will be accompanying others. So I would pay close attention to a prospective guitar's volume. Will it be loud enough? If it's louder than you need, how does it respond when played quieter?
If you are used to nylon strings, it will take some getting used to a new sound when you sing. To others, it will sound fine, but to you - different. Time should make that sound "right" to you. The other issue with nylon strings versus steel is that the steel will hurt your fingers - until you build up calluses. So there will be a "suffer through" period (which is not too long). Most nylon-stringed guitars are classical. Their bodies tend to be of a similar size (note: my daughter has a requinto guitar but plays it with classical strings, a nice small-bodied instrument that might work for you if you could ever find one) which you indicate is a bit too large for you. Steel-stringed guitars come in a greater range of sizes. And steel-stringed guitars have narrower necks. My last classical, a wonderful instrument that gave up nothing in volume, was sold because the fingerboard was too wide for me; it felt OK but I kept making mistakes. My suggestion is to find a steel-stringed guitar that feels good and sounds good to you, string it with light strings. And if your fingers hurt, tune it down a full step and capo it on the second fret to bring it back to standard pitch. Once you have the calluses, tune it back to pitch and put on the strings you like best.
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The Bard Rocks Fay OM Sinker Redwood/Tiger Myrtle Sexauer L00 Adk/Magnolia For Sale Hatcher Jumbo Bearclaw/"Bacon" Padauk Goodall Jumbo POC/flamed Mahogany Appollonio 12 POC/Myrtle MJ Franks Resonator, all Australian Blackwood Goodman J45 Lutz/fiddleback Mahogany Blackbird "Lucky 13" - carbon fiber '31 National Duolian + many other stringed instruments. Last edited by The Bard Rocks; 03-04-2022 at 09:13 PM. |
#10
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You wrote:
' ... my experience to date has been accompanying myself with a nylon string Yamaha. I actually liked the way that guitar sounded with my voice - the warmth/softness was a good contrast/backdrop for my more trebly vocals. I also felt the nylon strings seemed a bit more forgiving of my guitar playing imperfections... ' This has been my experience as well - nylon strings offer a nice contrast to vocals. With that in mind, why not get another Yamaha nylon stringed guitar? I'm sure you can spend as little or as much as your budget allows. |
#11
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A lot of people first assume that playing 3/4 Cordoba Cadete classical guitar with 50mm or smaller nut width automatically makes it easier to play for people with smaller hands. Look at this photo of a 12 year old girl who is 4'10" holding a full size nylon string guitar with 650mm scale and 52mm nut width. Her Lucida 3/4 guitar is in the background on the guitar stand. Her name is Lilly and she is taking guitar lessons and getting along fine with her full size nylon guitar.https://www.classicalguitardelcamp.c...27489&start=30
Last edited by singlechange; 03-04-2022 at 09:16 AM. |
#12
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As has been said, Cordoba has some decent nylon strings. If you want a steel string, you might consider a OO sized guitar (maybe an Eastman E20-OO) for a start. Don't worry that you only know 12 chords. Most songs require only 3 or 4 chords. As long as you know which chords sound good together you will be OK. Circle of Fifths will help you with that (some call it the CAGED system). I like calling it C-G-D-A-E- learn your 1-4-5 pattern: C-F-G, G-C-D, D-G-A, A-D-E, E-A-B7 with an occasional fourth chord thrown in. Knowing the 1-4-5 patterns will help alot.
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#13
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Hi Allie!
I suggest GS Mini as many people above me recommended. It has the smaller nut width so playing chords will be a lot easier as well as a smaller body as you mentioned 3/4 sized guitar. Please make sure to get it "setup" as it will make guitar playing a lot easier. I also recommended putting on "light gauge" strings as it will come with medium gauge string (thicker strings) if you end up going with the GS Mini. Try playing with the side of your thumb to strum using your flesh to get a less intrusive sound and if you feel the volume is too low you can start using your nails or start using a pick. Hope this helps and good luck! |
#14
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You're already trying out guitars and trying to figure out what you like and can work with. That's the most important thing! It's possible that your desires will change over time of course, but our suggestions are if anything more likely to be "close, but not quite." as we're not you.
As some have already mentioned, with a capo and knowing a dozen chords you can accompany singing quite well. I lot of singers would actually prefer a competent strumming guitarist to a more elaborate guitar player. I don't usually put a high value on how loud a guitar is, but if you're thinking of playing with singers acoustically in a typical "living room" sort of way without sound reinforcement there could be some issues with a guitar not having sufficient volume. You'll need to be the judge on that issue. I started an a very cheap nylon string myself. Yes, there's a certain tone and response and even "feel" as you fret or strum one. There are some nylon string guitars sometimes marketed as "crossover" models with narrower necks. Steel string guitars can be strung with silk and steel string sets and they then sound and play partway to that nylon string sound. Mahagony tops tend to impart a sound that may remind you of your nylon string, and another type of wood top to try would be cedar. I happen to like the 00 guitar size quite a bit, and there are more options in that size or smaller than there used to be, often sold under the type "parlor guitar." I quite like my Martin 00-15 for example. Good luck on your search!
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----------------------------------- Creator of The Parlando Project Guitars: 20th Century Seagull S6-12, S6 Folk, Seagull M6; '00 Guild JF30-12, '01 Martin 00-15, '16 Martin 000-17, '07 Parkwood PW510, Epiphone Biscuit resonator, Merlin Dulcimer, and various electric guitars, basses.... Last edited by FrankHudson; 03-04-2022 at 02:11 PM. |
#15
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If you go with Taylor, the Mini is a superior guitars to my ear.
If you are interested in other options, the small body Yamaha is a great guitar as is the Eastman PCH series. Here is a link to the Eastman PCH. https://reverb.com/p/eastman-pch1-om...-model-natural
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Happiness Is A New Set Of Strings L-20A |
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Tags |
baby taylor, beginner guitar, mahogany, nylon string, singing |
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