Not happy with microphone capture

[DarkestDreaming]

Here are some other clips:

OMNI Pair:

https://soundcloud.com/#iankafye-lam/omni-pair



Spaced Cardioids:

https://soundcloud.com/#iankafye-lam/spaced-cardioid



And some examples of stuff i consider good sound:

Doug Young:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5kCVXyQDys


Max Roest with a Rode Spaced pair:
https://www.youtube.com/results?sear....1.KEzszqemGL4


Antoine Dufour with a RODE NT4, which is pretty much the same as my mics except permafixed in xy position:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNw9YaXemlM


There is also a recording that Doug Young did on a Rode NT4 run through a Roland recorder.. despite the noise, that guitar sound captured beautifully as well. His mic shootouts with the Brauner, Neumann, AT2020 too. What am I missing?

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by DarkestDreaming

Bob,

Yes, the mic is a few inches higher than the neck joint. I did it in this video so that it doesnt obstruct the guitar. In this case it is a few inches higher than I normally would put it. I raise it somewhat to make sure it stays off the soundhole boom, but in this case its a little higher than that as well. I have some other takes that is not limited by the video constraints. Would you like me to post that?


So as I mic up, I should pay attention to this 'wolf' frequencies and frequency oddities? I always monitor on my headphones prior to commiting to record, but truth be told, a lot of what i hear sounds really different coming out through the speakers so its mostly guess work and translating from the headphone's 'image'. How do you normally monitor it? This is of course me in the same room as my speakers because that is my one and only work room for mixing and recording, so i cant have my speakers on

When I record myself, I usually work back and forth with test runs that I play back on the speakers. Headphones can be really deceiving. Of course, I monitor during takes through headphones. I use AKG 240Ms because they aren't flattering, are reasonably flat, and are comfortable for long periods of time.

Bob

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by DarkestDreaming

Bob, is the OMNI mic affected by this off-axis response oddities as well, since there is no 'axis' to speak of?

No, they aren't, but they pick up equally from all directions, including the bounces off your walls.

Bob

[Scott Whigham]

FYI - your SoundCloud links aren't working for me. I wonder if it's b/c I'm on the "old" version of the SC website though? This works for me:

http://soundcloud.com/iankafye-lam/spaced-cardioid

To my ears, I like the spaced pair by a country mile. I liked the first one but, by comparison, it sounds boxy to me and less defined. But, that being said, either is still really nice. I wouldn't make the choice to buy/not buy/listen/not listen based on that.

[DarkestDreaming]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

When I record myself, I usually work back and forth with test runs that I play back on the speakers. Headphones can be really deceiving. Of course, I monitor during takes through headphones. I use AKG 240Ms because they aren't flattering, are reasonably flat, and are comfortable for long periods of time.

Bob

Yes, Bob i do the same thing. That's why i have tons of clips recorded in different settings and configurations so i can finally monitor them later at playback with my speakers.. was really hoping for a less tedious alternative though. I still wonder why headphone monitoring is so decieving.. i got a good pair of monitoring headphones, with enough isolation to considerably attenuate the acoustic sound, but they still dont cut it for monitoring a sound im about to commit to record

[DarkestDreaming]

Bob, in a previous post i have attached a spaced omni clip through the same guitar in the same room playing the same thing.. still sounds kinda off for me. the same 'thrash can" sound.. safe to assume that its not the off axis response you were mentioning earlier. But thank you, you have taught me something new today.

Scott,

which SC link specifically? Just the OMNI one? I clicked through all links and they seem to be working fine from my side

[Scott Whigham]

Originally Posted by DarkestDreaming

Scott,

which SC link specifically? Just the OMNI one? I clicked through all links and they seem to be working fine from my side

All of them. There are two versions of the SC site - the new version and the old version. I bet you are on the new version. I just checked and tried your link in Chrome without being logged in - talk about weird!



If I change the URL so that it doesn't have the pound sign/hash sign in it, it works just fine.

https://soundcloud.com/iankafye-lam/omni-pair

[mustache79]

You guys are awesome!! Just reading through this thread I've come up with a few ideas for my own recording, as I have a similar issue as the OP. I never even thought to try an xy mic setup in a verticle manner.

Lots of good info in this thread. I came to the right place today.

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by mustache79

You guys are awesome!! Just reading through this thread I've come up with a few ideas for my own recording, as I have a similar issue as the OP. I never even thought to try an xy mic setup in a verticle manner.

Lots of good info in this thread. I came to the right place today.

I did a vertical semi ORTF like thing that sounded good to me. I posted the result on this thread:
http://69.41.173.82/forums/showthrea...light=vertical

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by DarkestDreaming

Here are some other clips:

OMNI Pair:
https://soundcloud.com/#iankafye-lam/omni-pair
Spaced Cardioids:
https://soundcloud.com/#iankafye-lam/spaced-cardioid
And some examples of stuff i consider good sound:
Doug Young:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5kCVXyQDys
Max Roest with a Rode Spaced pair:
https://www.youtube.com/results?sear....1.KEzszqemGL4
Antoine Dufour with a RODE NT4, which is pretty much the same as my mics except permafixed in xy position:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNw9YaXemlM
There is also a recording that Doug Young did on a Rode NT4 run through a Roland recorder.. despite the noise, that guitar sound captured beautifully as well. His mic shootouts with the Brauner, Neumann, AT2020 too. What am I missing?

Your clips to me sound right in there with the others - probably cleaner sounding than some. You can do a lot with post recording tweaks as Doug's video shows. I do think over all you will get a fuller, warmer sound with non coincident mic'ing.

[Cocobolo Kid]

Ian,

I don't have a problem with the sound of your YouTube video.

However, if you're trying to get a better sound, I did notice one thing in the video. It appears that are playing the treble strings with your right hand close to the bridge. This may be just the camera angle, but this might be another thing you can adjust or be aware of during the recording process.

I'm sure you know that the sound changes quite a bit depending on how you position your right hand on the strings relative to the sound hole and the bridge.

Great song you chose, by the way.

John

[KenW]

The spaced cardioids sound better to my ears.

[Scott Whigham]

Originally Posted by DarkestDreaming

...I always monitor on my headphones prior to commiting to record, but truth be told, a lot of what i hear sounds really different coming out through the speakers so its mostly guess work and translating from the headphone's 'image'. How do you normally monitor it?

When I place my mics by headphone, I just listen for the best sound. I'm not worried about how it translates to the monitors; I simply want to see where it sounds the best. I find it impossible to hear "natural sounding" with headphones anyway - the "real world" just isn't binary like headphones are so the forced separation really messes with my head (particularly in a spaced pair setup if the mics are close to the guitar). Everyone here is going to do this differently though - there's no right or wrong, I think.

[rick-slo]

Ok, I took your spaced cardiod clip from above and

1. balanced the R and L channel volume
2. added a small bit of delay to one channel to
put R and L a little more in phase
3. added a couple of decibels with moderate Q
centered at 78 hz
4. added a reverb for the first time through, and
a drier reverb on the repeat (just so you could
compare the two).

http://dcoombsguitar.com/Guitar%20Mu...dCardioids.wav

It sounds fine to me.

[Joseph Hanna]

Ian...killer playing and killer recording.

I dunno what you're heading for but this recording is as soulful and impact-full as those you hold up as examples of "better". I do hear an uncomfortable "crunch" when you hit harder and I'd guess that's some kind of compression/compressor. It surprises me no one has mentioned this?!??

That last 4% or 5% in a recording chain is a difficult one and it comes only with time and patience and adjustments that are exceedingly small. It seems to me you're a long way down the road.

Stay the course and continue to make small adjustments man....it sounds wonderful.