Madolin newbie

[ggibson189]

I've played guitar for about 45 years. I want to learn to play the mandolin, but I don't want to break the bank (I would like to stay married). Can anyone give me recommendations in the $500-1k range?

[keith.rogers]

Originally Posted by ggibson189

I've played guitar for about 45 years. I want to learn to play the mandolin, but I don't want to break the bank (I would like to stay married). Can anyone give me recommendations in the $500-1k range?

Kentucky and Eastman usually get the most votes in this category.

As with guitars, your better value is likely used, though from what I can see, many dealers probably are overstocked with entry models right now - a delayed effect of the surge of demand for those in the pandemic, and supply chain delays resulting in them arriving just a wee bit too late. I have seen sales.

There is at least one Mandolin-Centric forum out there that will probably elicit a lot more responses. (Leaving a link out to avoid getting my knuckles rapped by the admins here like I did once before for mentioning a guitar forum - don't know the rules, obviously...)

And, probably even more than guitars, a good setup is really important, so I'd stick with shops that have a big, if not primary, focus on mandolin sales. There are sponsors listed at that website where you might spend some time browsing and calling.

[Br1ck]

There is one standout in the under 1K market, a used 900 series Kentucky. It is a cut above anything else for the price. It is an A style. If you need an F, and I truly understand, buy an Eastman MD315 or 515.

The single best bit of advise I can give you is get your mandolin from a well versed mandolin store if you buy new. The Mandolin Store is one, Elderly and Gryphon also make sure your mandolin is well set up. A guitar tech is not always knowledgeable regarding mandolins. $1000 is a tough price range. $1500 in an A style used mandolin gets a pretty satisfying instrument. That well known forum's classifieds is a pretty good bet.

I'm going to assume, maybe erroneously, you want an arched top mandolin. You can find satisfying flat tops if you are playing Celtic and folk. They are a lot cheaper. The other warning is, mandolins are addictive and double the price of guitars, so don't play that Collings or Northridge, or Webber, or Gibson hanging in the shop. You will start thinking $5500 is not so much money. It is primarily the low G string that separates the men from the boys.

Give that forum a try, but just like here, you will have people telling you to up your budget, even more than I just did. I spent three years trying to find a mandolin under $4000. I finally did due to a lot of luck. I'm seven years in, never regretted it a minute, but my Eastman lasted four months. See, I didn't follow my better judgement. I'd subscribe to a service like Peghead nation and take a beginner course.

[Mandobart]

Originally Posted by ggibson189

I've played guitar for about 45 years. I want to learn to play the mandolin, but I don't want to break the bank (I would like to stay married). Can anyone give me recommendations in the $500-1k range?

This advice is the "truth you don't want to hear" about mandolins - they just cost more. There are probably 1000 or more guitar players for every mandolin player. The majority of guitars bought are flat top/flat back. A lot of mandolins (the better ones at least) are carved top and back. They take longer, require thicker plates to start out with and thus cost more to build.

These two realities - it takes more hours/money to build a quality mandolin, and the market is much much smaller for mandolins compared to guitars - conspire to make dipping your toe in these waters a larger initial investment.

We can go out and buy a very nice guitar for around $500 (you can certainly spend much more too). A mandolin of equivalent quality of that $500 guitar will cost about $1500 or more.

I'll never again buy a beginner or student grade instrument - they really sound bad compared to a good one.

You may get lucky and find a used The Loar or Kentucky for ~$500, spend around $100 (or several hours of your time) to make it playable. Or you can maybe borrow a friend's decent level mandolin for an extended trial. Or just accept that you're gonna have to spend $1 - $2 k to get something worth playing.

[columbia]

You can buy a quality US-made mandolin for about the same price as a quality US-made guitar. Just not one with a scroll and points. And it helps to be patient. Look at used Flatiron A's and Gibson A9's.

[rockabilly69]

If you don't need conventional looks, I would look for a US made Breedlove. In my opinion that are the best sounding in the $1000 range. They have a slightly wider fingerboards that are radiused, which IMO would be easier to play for a beginner, and I think their tone is fantastic, much better than I've heard from the import mandos! The ones on Reverb right now are a bit expensive but I see them all the time hover around your price range. A while back I bought an extremely good A model for well under a $1000...

https://www.lavonnemusic.com/product...artz-mandolin/

https://reverb.com/item/62891822-bre...EaAlD0EALw_wcB

https://reverb.com/item/62185144-bre...tz-ko-mandolin

[SalFromChatham]

I own two mandolins in that price range that are fantastic.

The Eastman MD304 is an oval hole, well rounded high quality mandolin that is about $599 new. I bought mine a few years ago when it was closer to $400.

Mike Dulak and his nephew make Big Muddy Mandolins. I love the M11, but I also have an M1X made by his apprentice that is fantastic. These are not great on a budget, they are great period. And the gentleman is a craftsman and a character.. and loves dogs. Enough said.

[rmp]

when I turned 60, my wife and son gave me this

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...-pack-sunburst

I've had good luck with it.

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by SalFromChatham

I own two mandolins in that price range that are fantastic.

The Eastman MD304 is an oval hole, well rounded high quality mandolin that is about $599 new. I bought mine a few years ago when it was closer to $400.

Mike Dulak and his nephew make Big Muddy Mandolins. I love the M11, but I also have an M1X made by his apprentice that is fantastic. These are not great on a budget, they are great period. And the gentleman is a craftsman and a character.. and loves dogs. Enough said.

I've heard Big Muddy mandolins, and I agree, they are quality instruments that sound great for a really good price.

[Br1ck]

To be clear, I bought a closeout Michael Kelly once for $200. It had been a $500 mandolin. I feel very sorry for the beginner who walked into a store and bought one to learn on. I bought mine to practice my setup skills for the F style I was building. After nut work, and bridge work, I had to do a level and crown to get it to play well. I daresay, you'd need to spend $250 on your new mandolin to make it play well..

Now Eastman does a decent job, but after playing one that had a Gryphon setup, I was still amazed how poor the Eastman really was. I'd say ballpark. But I'd venture a Collings has about three hours work on a final setup. It may be plek'd too.

So any mandolin can be made to play well, but still leaves tonal considerations. It can be maddening deciding what you like. Gryphon stocks Northfield and Collings. One visit I'd like one over the other. The next visit I'd like the other, but both were far above the Eastmans. It is what it is. You can learn on any well set up instrument. But if you play many fine mandolins, you will want one.

In my case, my Eastman MD 505 I got from The Mandolin Store was good enough to get me hooked.

[posternutbag]

I consider myself principally a mandolinist, and if you don’t need the percussive “chop” of a carved top instrument, then I definitely recommend Big Muddy mandolins. I have had three. All could be lifetime instruments.

If you do really want to play bluegrass, you can do so on a flat top (like the Big Muddy), but it’s hard to get “that” bluegrass rhythm sound. You can get most of the way there, but not quite. In that case, you will be looking at carved top mandolins, which as Mandobart says, are basically twice as expensive as equivalent quality guitars. A $1000 mandolin budget gets you a mid range import carved top like a Kentucky or an Eastman. Those are my favorites at that price point.

If you get very lucky you can find a late model used Kentucky KM 900 or 950. I would look at the post 2012 era Kentucky’s. This particular brand has been up and down in quality so many times over the years that unless you know what you are looking at, you stand a good chance of getting a very mediocre instrument. Kentucky’s of the 1980s tend to be well regarded, and as I said, the post 2012 KM 900 and and higher models are well respected, but the 1990s through the 2000s are very hit or miss. I am also not a fan of the “mid range” (anything below the 900, basically) Kentucky mandolins models, but YMMV.

Breedlove is an interesting (if complicated) option. Breedlove is another company where there are some gems as well as some very “meh” choices, and it can be hard to distinguish. They were originally all built in the US, but when bought out by Two Old Hippies, manufacture was moved primarily and then exclusively overseas. Breedloves never had great resale, and diluting the brand name did not help. If you can find a used Breedlove Quartz from the 1990s through the 2000s, say before 2010 (I can’t remember exactly when they were bought out) you can get a very nice, very versatile instrument that punches way above its weight. The one thing I will say is that they have electronics (good or bad, depending on you perspective), and they have wide fingerboards. I don’t particularly like the wide fingerboard, but some guitarists love them.

I don’t want to give the impression that I only recommend American made instruments. Like I said, the post 2012 Kentucky mandolins of the 900 series and above are very good to excellent. I wouldn’t think twice about gigging one, and I also like Eastman mandolins. They have a reputation for being “bright”, “glassy” or even “shrill”, depending on whom you ask, but I find heavier strings helps tame that quite a bit. A Kentucky 305 or 505 would be a good sub $1000 mandolin, and I have been severely tempted to pick up a 304 (oval hole) more than once.

The last thing I will say in this already too long post is that where you buy is as important as what you buy. If you buy from a store like The Mandolin Store, you can expect to get an instrument that is well set up and easy to play. Carved top mandolins can be a little more finicky than guitars when it comes to setup. They are basically small arch top guitars or fretted violins (minus a sound post), so a quality setup can make a big difference in playability.


Hope that helps.

[rockabilly69]

Originally Posted by posternutbag

I

Breedlove is an interesting (if complicated) option. Breedlove is another company where there are some gems as well as some very “meh” choices, and it can be hard to distinguish. They were originally all built in the US, but when bought out by Two Old Hippies, manufacture was moved primarily and then exclusively overseas. Breedloves never had great resale, and diluting the brand name did not help. If you can find a used Breedlove Quartz from the 1990s through the 2000s, say before 2010 (I can’t remember exactly when they were bought out) you can get a very nice, very versatile instrument that punches way above its weight. The one thing I will say is that they have electronics (good or bad, depending on you perspective), and they have wide fingerboards. I don’t particularly like the wide fingerboard, but some guitarists love them.


Hope that helps.

The only Breedloves built overseas are the Crossover labeled ones, and Electronics in the USA models was an option, not the norm. I had to pay for the LR Baggs Radius in my Quartz FF.

The Breedlove Premier and Cascade models are also very nice USA series, and they are gloss finished compared to the Quartz models which are satin finished.

[SCVJ]

I concur with those recommending A style Pac Rim mandolins from Eastman or Kentucky. That seems to be the consensus on the main forum for mandolin geeks as well, although there are strong recommendations for the flat top choices as well. I agree with the statement that the flat tops are best for certain musical styles, although you can obviously play anything on either type of mandolin. My opinion is that the carved style instruments (A and F style) are more numerous for a reason - versatility, visual appeal, etc.

For context, I've owned at least a dozen mandolins over the last 20+ years, ranging in price from pretty cheap to $4,000 or so. As with my guitars I've gone down-value with age and arthritis, now owning a Kentucky KM-250 which I bought from The Mandolin Store. Also, I totally agree that you need to be sure you get a good setup, either as part of the purchase or by a mandolin-familiar luthier if you buy used or from a store that doesn't do setups. The ones that do typically sell for the same prices as those that don't. Mandolin Store, Elderly and Gryphon come to mind as ones that do good setups.

Good luck!

[leew3]

lots of good advice here so I'll only add a few suggestions. As others have noted, consider an A model as you can get more 'bang for your buck' as the labor is much less than on an F model. They sound as good or better than an F model for much less money (in some mandolin circles those are fighting words, but I'll stand by them).

A used Breedlove legacy FF would be in the range you've listed and it comes with a K & K pickup installed. If I recall correctly Rockabilly69 had one as well. I've gigged with mine for about 5 years and love it. I would also agree with those suggesting Eastman and Kentucky. You might also as on the Mandolin Cafe where you'll also get some useful suggestions.

[Br1ck]

Another word on the 900 Kentucky. When TMS was in Phoenix, I made an appointment to visit when I was in the area. I had bought my Eastman from them. I told them up front that I was tire kicking to get educated. I first started with a KM 150 and played up to a KM 750. I found the difference to be primarily cosmetic. It was the same with Eastman. The MD 315 sounded pretty much like an MD 815. The 815 looked really good though. Then they went a grabbed a KM 900 that had just come in, and they set it up for me. This mandolin was a significant upgrade. It had a pleasing G string course.

Then the got me a Northfield FS 5. At that time it was better, but no where near the difference between the 750 and 900 Kentuckys. And it was a thousand dollars more. But it was a thousand dollars I thought I'd have to pay, or forever wish I had.

I told them I'd pushed my budget to the limit, but what would be the next step. I was handed a Gibson F 9. It was another thousand more. It was superb, and at the time $4400. I ended my education then and there. But what an education it was. Stark reality smacked me in the face. That Gibson was very plain.

Would I be better off not knowing? Yes and no. It set me on a journey to build my own. Not for the feint at heart or the time limited, but I did manage to best the better Kentuckys. Since then, I have played quite a few Collings and Northfields and one OMG Ellis. Know what? They make mandolins incrementally better for thousands more. I later got to play four levels of Weber. I didn't like any of them until the top of the line Yellowstone. Of course this is every bit as subjective as guitars. That I lucked into my 14 year old Weber Yellowstone consigned for $3K, well it only took three years of looking. But I got my fancy fern inlay and full binding and it only took $500 worth of work.

I consider myself fiscally responsible so I vow never to play a $10,000 mandolin again. But rest assured, the difference between my Eastman and the $1400 Silverangel that replaced it was far and away the biggest tonal jump. I ought to sell it because I've become hopelessly scroll addicted. But I'm done.......I think.........